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Old 2nd June 2022, 15:15   #76
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Quote:
Originally Posted by aim120 View Post
I think the 180kw is the combined total power for both the CCS2 ports. In that scenario when two cars are plugged to the charger each port can only charge at 90kw max.
True, looks like combined power of 180KW from DC1 and DC2.

Usually they do not divide power into half, the first plugged in car gets whatever it requests, the second plugged car gets the remaining, when the first car reaches higher SOC it takes less power, all the freed up power goes to the second car. I think this is a better way instead of holding both cars, the first car is charged faster and leaves early.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 16:18   #77
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by Ptr11s View Post
The KIA EV6 GT-line RWD's MSRP in USA is 51,200 USD and the AWD's MSRP is 55,900 USD. For reference, Audi E-tron's MSRP is 65,900 USD and ex-showroom price in India is ₹1.01Cr. Forget <50 lakhs,I wouldn't be surprised if the EV6 costs >₹70 lakhs ex-showroom.
I'm surprised that it is priced under ₹65 lakhs for the AWD version and is well loaded for the price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cresterk View Post
Yeah, for a few lakhs more, you get better interiors, the BMW badge and most importantly, rear air suspension with adjustable modes and more range.
I agree on the these points but the EV6 is is more practical with more ground clearance( i4 has around 125mm only) and except for rear air suspension, the EV6 gets 360 degree cameras, ADAS, Relaxation Seats, AWD, etc. It is also priced ₹5 lakhs less and KIA has more touch-points than BMW although the EV6 is sold through only selected showrooms.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 18:16   #78
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Fabulous car but honestly, for an average user, spending 50+L on a Kia is a bit of a bummer. Hope they're able to reduce the duties or reduce the prices somehow and it should be a good car to buy.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 18:55   #79
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by baireshraj View Post
How was your steering feedback and feeling with the AWD?
Too light for my liking, and I felt the EV characteristics along with the light steering will need some getting used to. Hence my reference of taking a turn in neutral in IC equivalent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rangakishen View Post
I assume with 350kW charging that it is a 800V system, could you confirm this?
800 V system, even if input is lower the car bumps it up to 800 V and hence faster charger times achieved as per the Kia presentation.


Quote:
Erm, are you sure about this? Sounds weird with the AWD config. Would have expected bigger motor at the rear and smaller one added onto the front.
As per the presentation the mentioned figures are correct for Front and Rear.


Quote:
Also, just nitpicking here but I think you meant kW. .
You got the gist right will edit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Venkatesh View Post
Kia India has revealed the prices for EV6.

GT Line RWD is priced at Rs. 59.95 lakh while the AWD variant is priced at Rs. 64.95 lakh. (Ex-Showroom)
======
BMW i4 comes close in terms of price at Rs 69.90 lakh, ex-showroom), which has an 83.9 kWh battery pack with 590km claimed range.
EV6 True blue EV Platform + Gadgets Vs ICE platform converted car from an aspirational brand. Tough one, especially since the BMW with the extra weight and sad steering has not been getting great reviews overall.

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Pick Your choice!

Attachment 2315621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ptr11s View Post

I agree on the these points but the EV6 is is more practical with more ground clearance( i4 has around 125mm only) and except for rear air suspension, the EV6 gets 360 degree cameras, ADAS, Relaxation Seats, AWD, etc. It is also priced ₹5 lakhs less and KIA has more touch-points than BMW although the EV6 is sold through only selected showrooms.
Valid points, rear seat space wise again EV6 will score higher. i4 on the other hand has that drive tunnel!
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Old 2nd June 2022, 19:19   #80
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by Axe77 View Post
Rupee for rupee, doesn't the i4 at 69.9L make a better case for itself vis a vis the AWD?

Comparable power (although its lower than the AWD on torque), better range too if I'm not mistaken. I wonder whether the Kia will sell more of the lower variant at this price and the higher variant buyers might gravitate to the i4 instead.
As a BMW owner and loyalist, I still feel the Kia is an overall better car from an EV perspective. Better space, better performance, way better features and a bit less range but more than enough for a round trip to neighboring locations that I tend to visit. Definitely better looking.

I feel like people have taken a complete U-turn on the BMW kidney grilles of late. Even the purists HATED the front end. Also, don't forget that you need to spend an additional 5L to get the M Sport kit. Otherwise, the i4 looks like this.

Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh-bmw_i4_2021_5k1920x1080.jpg

if we leave the badge aside, does this really look worse than that?

Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh-kiaev6gtline20214k5kcars.jpg

BEVs are taking the brand out of the equation I feel. It's more about the platform. Yes, we can argue that our infra hasn't even caught up to the potential of either of these cars, but the 800V architecture is far more advanced and hence more future-proof.

The only BMW EV I'd ever consider is the iX and sadly that's way out of most people's budget. Considering our duties, carmakers are doing what they can. With a market of 17k cars a year, we are lucky to have any of these options. Otherwise, it'll just be Nexons and ZSs in the market for us. Our market is too small to manufacture EVs locally at the present time. Even CKD operations would still cost companies a lot more than they'll earn. Kia, Hyundai, Volvo, BMW bringing in much more affordable cars is definitely a sign of good things to come. Hopefully in a duty cut, maybe even local manufacturing to some extent. It is tougher to do with a BEV. Maybe cars like the XC40 and BMW ix3 which share the platform with ICE counterparts can be made here in CKD guise. Only time will tell though. As of now we are paying extra for being first movers in the market.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunikkat View Post
My choice would be i4 for the brand alone. For that money I would be happy to have a BMW in my garage than a Kia.
And for me i4 looks better too. And somehow feel (not experienced) i4 will be more fun to drive too, being a BMW.
i4 would definitely have been more fun to drive if it was the M50. Sadly it's just the edrive 40. Plenty quick but not as quick as the Kia. Even if it was the M50 for 10L more, it'd be a good deal. Also, that ground clearance is a complete deal breaker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv View Post
+100. At this price I would rather have a Bimmer in my garage than a Kia. Spec to spec (including the interiors, driving dynamics, features, etc) i still think a BMW gives more car than EV6.

Not a great pricing though (for a KIA). Would have been a game changer if it was priced around 45L-50L.
Is it not a bad part on Kia if the next of EV6 comes as a CKD with lower weight on the wallet, especially for this first lot buyers?
How does it do better spec to spec? I believe the range is the only category for it to trump the Kia.

The biggest difference will be some features will be cut from the CKD versions as has almost always been the case. EVs are generally more expensive than their petrol counterparts. Will be interesting to see Kia and Hyundai's made in india C-SUV EVs coming in 2025.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 20:14   #81
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post


800 V system, even if input is lower the car bumps it up to 800 V and hence faster charger times achieved as per the Kia presentation.
They bump up the voltage because that's the only way to reach 100% soc.

For a typical lithium cell, the first phase of charging is constant current and after the set voltage is reached, it shifts to constant voltage and starts ramping down the current.

So in EV6, the battery voltage is 800v but the charger like the one posted a few pages back can only supply 750v. So if the car was charged with only 750v, it would never achieve 100% SOC. So the cars on board DC-DC converter will have to boost the voltage.

But there is no free lunch, you can have a charger with 1000v and 350A or can have a charger with 500v and 700A both result in 350kw of charging power. But a 180kw charger (like the one posted a few pages back) with boosted voltage from the cars onboard DC-DC cannot magically make up the remaining 170kw.

If you use more volts, you can get away with less heat and smaller diameter wiring, PCB traces etc.

So as long as the components can handle higher voltage, it's more efficient to get power from using more volts then using more amps.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 20:21   #82
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Mod note: Post edited, avoid leaving short notes using acronyms, and quoting entire large post for short replies. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aim120 View Post
They bump up the voltage because that's the only way to reach 100% soc.
====
So as long as the components can handle higher voltage, it's more efficient to get power from using more volts then using more amps.
Can you ELI5 (explain like I'm 5) please?

Last edited by Jaggu : 2nd June 2022 at 20:38.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 22:03   #83
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by venom_op View Post
Can you ELI5 (explain like I'm 5) please?
Let's just take one single lithium polymer cell. It has a nominal voltage of 3.6v (approximately 60% soc) and fully charged voltage of 4.2v (100% soc) and a low voltage cut off of about 2.8v (0% soc). SOC is State of charge.

Now to charge a cell, in order for the current to travel from the charger to the cell, you need to have a voltage higher then that of the cell voltage. If the charger voltage is less then then that of a cell, it cannot charge the cell.

So in the KIA EV6 because of its very high battery pack voltage, a charger which has a lower voltage cannot charge the battery pack to 100%.

Since not all chargers are the same with regard to voltages and as car manufacturers come out with even higher battery pack voltages, how can a new EV get charged from a legacy or old chargers with lower voltage?
Answer: They use a on board DC-DC converter.

A DC-DC converter can trim incoming DC voltage or Boost the incoming DC voltage depending on the design of the circuit, some can only trim aka buck and some can boost the voltage and some can do both.

How do we get watt (power). In electrical terms you get watt by volt x Amp(current). In the previous pages the charger had the specs 750v and 200A max. So with this info, we can conclude that it can charge at 150kw of power.

But the KIA EV6 is capable of charging at 350kw and its battery pack is 800v. So either you bump up the volts or current to increase the charging power. Without doing this you cannot magically create sustained high charging power.

Last edited by aim120 : 2nd June 2022 at 22:07.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 22:36   #84
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Quote:
Originally Posted by aim120 View Post
But the KIA EV6 is capable of charging at 350kw and its battery pack is 800v. So either you bump up the volts or current to increase the charging power. Without doing this you cannot magically create sustained high charging power.
Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense now. When you explained this, it reminded me of an article i had read somewhere on how it works in very simplified language. Couldn't find the exact article but i did find a Kia press release explaining how it works.

Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh-kiasev6reimaginestheelectricvehicleownershipexperience.png

Also link to the URL

https://press.kia.com/eu/en/home/med...xperience.html

It's pretty awesome tech indeed.
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Old 3rd June 2022, 08:19   #85
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by venom_op View Post
How does it do better spec to spec? I believe the range is the only category for it to trump the Kia.

The biggest difference will be some features will be cut from the CKD versions as has almost always been the case. EVs are generally more expensive than their petrol counterparts. Will be interesting to see Kia and Hyundai's made in india C-SUV EVs coming in 2025.
I am sure KIA offers more features than the i4. But what about the fit, finish, build quality, driving dynamics, performance, ride and handling. I assume all these will be miles ahead in the i4 compared to a EV6. When i spend so much of money, its not just about range, 0-100 timing, features, etc. that I expect, its also about brand experience, premium feel, exclusivity, etc, etc. - At least in India.
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Old 3rd June 2022, 08:25   #86
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

We should give the credit to Kia where it is due. I had never thought I would see the day when a Kia was being compared to BMW - either in terms of features, price or desireability.
Kia has come a long way since being branded as the cheaper version of a Hyundai.
Reports in the Economic Times today in an interview with Mr. Tae-Jin Park states that Kia EV6 has already received 355 bookings which is 3.5 times more than the allocation of 100 units.
Do we have reports of how many units the BMW i4 has sold in India?
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Old 3rd June 2022, 09:25   #87
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

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Originally Posted by Axe77 View Post
Rupee for rupee, doesn't the i4 at 69.9L make a better case for itself vis a vis the AWD?

Comparable power (although its lower than the AWD on torque), better range too if I'm not mistaken. I wonder whether the Kia will sell more of the lower variant at this price and the higher variant buyers might gravitate to the i4 instead.
EV6 is a bespoke EV platform, so interior space is good with a flat floor. I4 is not and has that massive central tunnel and middle seat is almost useless. Spec to spec difference is marginal so is the price. I was contemplating with 70L to splurge, which one would I choose. For EV, definitely I would take EV6 RWD, since the top end is limited to 192Kmph, i don't find any real use in the additional power in the AWD guise, but if i make my mind on BMW, i will beg borrow steal an additional 10L and get an M340I. When most of the EV's are moving away from the unneeded grill, its ironic that BMW slap one of the biggest faux grill on I4. Maybe they should have offered body color inside the grill as an option similar to Audi e-tron GT RS. As a CBU, i think EV6 is priced competitively .
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Old 3rd June 2022, 13:13   #88
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

What an amazing car at a fantastic pricing.

If it were launched as a CKD, I wonder what the price would be.

Great to have such a good car in India
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Old 3rd June 2022, 15:20   #89
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Love the car how it looks and being a CBU, 60 Lakh is a decent price.

BUT having the i4 being announced at 69.99 Lakh, I feel KIA got themselves in a difficult position here.
The higher specs and technical side aside (And the ugly grill too ), The BMW badge itself is enough to pull potential buyers towards the i4 at the given price.
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Old 3rd June 2022, 15:27   #90
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Default Re: Kia EV6 Preview | Driven @ Buddh

Honestly this hot debate seems somewhat futile as the entire lot for both these cars was probably sold out for the year before bookings even officially opened! ��
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