[nkishore_007]

Originally Posted by Rehaan

As much as i agree with the sentiment in the latter part of your quote, i have to say that i completely disagree with your point about law enforcement not being a big factor.

In a Utopian world, sure. I'd agree 100%.

However, in India, what i hear more often than not is :
"Hey man, i hope you're not driving... there's naka-bandhis (police checkposts) everywhere tonight".


Responsibility can be a powerful motivator, but so can fear!

Unfortunately, responsibility and intelligence takes far longer to cultivate than fear. So rather than waiting around for our road using population to get smarter, I'll settle for some strict law enforcement to kick-start that change!

cya
R

+1 to this. Both aspects needs to be in place. Human being, being the way they are, will definitely use the lack of law enforcement as a means to exercise activities which are otherwise termed as 'crime' or 'illegal'. How many of us in this forum drink? And how many of us think that we can easily drive/ride 4-5 pegs down? I will be surprised if someone honestly states that he/she cannot.

RTOs have a HUGE role to play as well. I keep hearing deserving parties failing driving test (becoz they refuse to bribe the officer), while we see ignorant cab/auto drivers with "valid" licenses making the public road their own playground. The very institution which certifies that we can drive on roads itself is corrupt, so we cannot expect idiots on road to learn things (read traffic rules) by themselves. :(

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by Arch-Angel

In my opinion, these are the following methods that accidents can be reduced:

1. Enforce the helmet rule and spare no one.
2. Enforce the seat belt rule and spare no one.
3. Enforce lane discipline and catch the violators and let them be given gyaan regarding what are the do's/dont's as a phamplet.
4. Bi Annual traffic rules awareness campaigns, safe driving practices and also, driving skills which can be taught to the attendees.
5. Fitness checkup with a mandatory eye checkup every year. This will ensure that only people fit enough to drive hit the roads in their vehicles.
6. For heaven's sake, increase the salary of the policewalas. Their conditions are deplorable.
7. Speed limits in accident prone areas with CCTV and then, send a snap with a challan to the person. Increase the fine exponentially for each violation.
8. A course for the policewallahs regarding PR. Yes, this is important. Policewallahs are here to serve the citizens. They have to be made to understand the significance of the khaki dress and also, the badge.
Only if these points are enforced will the traffic situation improve.

p.s: regarding the automatic speed limit enforcement. It definitely will not bode well with the majority of the people who have shelled out big bucks on swanky cars.

We have to start giving incentives to the policewallas for each person they fine. Something like 20-30% of the challaned amount. Then we shall see how briberies fall and how people get challaned for smallest offenses.

Fines for all traffic offenses/voliations need to be increased exponentially. Let it be so high as to be a deterrant and also a built in hike each year to cater to inflation etc. Let multiple offenses/repeat offenses be compounded with jail terms or even higher fines and loss of licences.

Also records need to be computerised at the national level. It must be possible to pull out offenses based on PAN card or adhar card details. Insurance must be based on the owner's criminal details, with repeat offenders having to shell out big bucks for car insurance.

Automatic speed enforcement (through ECU limitations/RFID etc) is a big help to prevent overspeeding and is a 100% foolproof and corruption proof method. If expensive car owners feel sorry that they cant speed, they can book sessions at Kari or the Buddh circuit, and not drive like morons on local roads. They dont own the roads they drive on, you and I pay taxes driving common cars, on which they run their supercars too.

Some additional measures which sound harsh but will help curb dangerous antics of the so called 'ignorant' class of drivers. If a driver/rider is injured or dies in an accident, and is found to be driving/riding under the influence of alchol, not wearing seatbelt or helmet, no matter who's fault it will be treated as the driver/rider's fault and no case should be made against the other party.
If a pedistrian dies because he was crossing illegally, or jaywalking or strolling on a road, it is he/she who will be blamed and no action to be taken against the vehicle which cuts him down. It is same elsewhere in Europe/US or any developed nation or even similar treatement to people illegally crossing railway tracks, so I see no reason why roads should be any different. Atleast it will prevent morons from running across highways right under a foot over bridge.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Fines for all traffic offenses/voliations need to be increased exponentially. Let it be so high as to be a deterrant and also a built in hike each year to cater to inflation etc. Let multiple offenses/repeat offenses be compounded with jail terms or even higher fines and loss of licences.


Some additional measures which sound harsh but will help curb dangerous antics of the so called 'ignorant' class of drivers. If a driver/rider is injured or dies in an accident, and is found to be driving/riding under the influence of alchol, not wearing seatbelt or helmet, no matter who's fault it will be treated as the driver/rider's fault and no case should be made against the other party.
If a pedistrian dies because he was crossing illegally, or jaywalking or strolling on a road, it is he/she who will be blamed and no action to be taken against the vehicle which cuts him down. It is same elsewhere in Europe/US or any developed nation or even similar treatement to people illegally crossing railway tracks, so I see no reason why roads should be any different. Atleast it will prevent morons from running across highways right under a foot over bridge.

What you say about Europe and USA is simply not true. And moronic will never ever be cured by stiffer laws and or punishment.

As US comedian Ron White says: You can't fix stupid!

On the effects of harsher punishment; like I said earlier, there is lttle evidence that it works. You might think India is different. I'm active on various forums around the globe and the call for harsher punishment is universal. I don't know if it's ever been researched in India, but it has been researched extensively in USA and Europe. And although there is little proof it is effective it is the first thing everybody demands whenever anything goes wrong in society. Politicians and the general public at large will be outraged and demand stiffer punishment. Again, unfortunately it is not that simple. If it was that simple, we would have outlawed crimes easily by now!

Feel free to stick to your own opinion. If you've read some of my other post, I will always appreciate anyone with an opinion, especially in lieu of facts! Just be cautious don't let some good research and in-depth understanding stand between you and your opinion either. The best opinion usually come from the most erudite persons. This is opinion of course, not fact! Oh, and I don't consider myself erudite or academic for that matter.

Have a look at this article for instance to increase overall awareness what drives crime rates:

http://www.law.ed.ac.uk/cls/esytc/fi.../lesscrime.htm

Does it apply to road safety? It doesn't say so, but then is there anything to suggest that societies approach to road safety would be fundamental different?

Just remember this, another very boring fact; the states/countries that enforce death penalties have also been the states/countries over the last five decades that have seen a sharper increase in (violent) crimes than states/countries that do not have the death penalty.

Enjoy!

Jeroen

[lancer_rit]

Originally Posted by Rehaan

As much as i agree with the sentiment in the latter part of your quote, i have to say that i completely disagree with your point about law enforcement not being a big factor.

Can't agree more to this. Besides not only in India, law enforcement is a big part of preventing repeat violations or atleast dis-incentivising the same.

Take the USA for instance - your points rack up faster and faster and your insurance goes through the roof, finally you lose your license - most people mend their ways! If law enforcement wasn't important, then why have a police ?

Education and sensitivising is very important, but behavior change over a mass scale also needs law enforcement and penalties (and advertising the same) to make a big difference - its the same in most places in the world, probably even more so in India. Both complement each other.

@Jeroen, I have difficulty following your logic. If a moronic driver won't mend his moronic ways, then strict law enforcement will take away his license to drive and/or put him behind bars. This will save other law-abiding road users damage due to the moron's actions. Education will do zilch to change the moron by your own argument.

It seems you have little experience of India - so you're way off the mark here.
Law enforcement works in India. If most folks in Delhi wear helmets and seat belts today, it happened due to strict law enforcement coupled with advertising the safety aspects. It didn't happen by education only. Same is the case in Bangalore. For a change, go to Hyderabad, and you'll see not even 10% of the riders wear helmets - majority is not oblivious to safety aspects of helmets etc. Its just that they have a habit (of not wearing helmets, there are half a dozen "logical" reasons that folks belt out), and they have the feeling they won't meet an accident - it does not happen to me syndrome! Once the police fines them 4-5 times, economics will drive them to good habits, and then good habits linger coupled with more education on the topic.

[kaushal21fb]

Originally Posted by arjab

Until and unless we take the strictest corrective action to root out one of the main causes of accidents in India :
That is enforcing the strictest of the strict penalties/fines/examinations - or whatever it takes necessary to enforce the STRICTEST norms for issuance of driving licences in INDIA, these alarming figures will continue to rise. Licensing has to ULTRA-STRICT - period.

Today we have a system, which is laughable to say the least.
We have states/RTO's where people get driving licenses without even visiting the testing centre.
We have so-called "Training Schools" teaching wannabe drivers, where the trainer himself/herself is unaware of the nuances of road safety and defensive driving.
We have no refresher courses - D.L.'s are renewed blindly without even assessing the current capability / physical fitness of the driver - which leads me to ask you - How many times have you seen a truck driver on our Indian highways wearing spectacles? Can it be that 100% of Indian truckies have 6/6 vision? - just my observations!

And to enforce any such strict legislation, there has to be Government intervention and Government legislation.
A network of accredited, comprehensive driving schools. A proper syllabus, with comprehensive Learner's and then actual driving test policies - both in Theory & Practice.
Properly equipped Learner Car's on which students can learn and finally Trainer's and Instructors who MUST be certified by an independent testing authority - maybe by some global biggies - there are lots available in the world.

Impossible? Don't think so.
The Government has to have the will to enforce this.
Look at it this way: Even 3 years back getting hold of a passport was a nightmare - with the advent of the Passport Seva Kendra's (PSK's) being run through a successful Government - Private (I think TCS right?) PPP initiative, the hassle of getting a passport and the role of "touts and blackmarketeers" in "managing" to get you a passport has reduced substantially.

So things can be made to change, let's hope it will - soon, and we as a country need not count ourselves to be at the top of the heap - in statistics as fearful as these.

Absolutely Agree with you sir. IMHO educating works better than any policing.. Somebody should be out there telling motorists:
1. No you cannot drive on the wrong side of the road.
2. You cannot turn or change lanes without indicating.
3. On 2 wheelers helmet is a must.
4. etc. etc.

Instead of driving tests for license, driving courses should be made mandatory from reputed institutes. Anyone who does not show the right conduct should be banned and not given a license at all.

[krish82]

If speed laws of India was same as of US, the death toll will be more than double what's quoted, I think more than 70% of Indian cars on road are without any kind of airbags, forget side airbags. In usa even a basic car comes with at least 6 airbags. In India safety is luxury and people in saving mode, what do we expect. The laws must change first.

[kingofmyworld]

A very true fact about riders and helmets usage. Most people do not get the point of wearing a helmet (A good quality one). They wear them just for the sake of it. Many called me a fool when I spent 10-15k on buying a helmet, But I know how important my life is and I do not mind spending double or more to get a heavy duty ECE2205 or a DOT certified helmet. Frankly, ISI stardards are below par as long as helmets are concerned.

[BUXX]

Here is another Myth buster link: http://www.nsc.org/safety_road/Distr...sking-Lie.aspx

[mpksuhas]

There is a report in todays Times of India regarding guidelines for ambulance service availablity in NH. The article also quotes WHO report mentioned in this thread. Enforcement of this may be an issue, however feel its a guideline in right directive.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/i...w/20469649.cms