[Bhargav7]

Indian Government is contemplating making the three-point seat belt mandatory for all passengers. A very welcome move. Hope it gets implemented soon!



https://www.livemint.com/auto-news/s...264837857.html

“The intent of the government is to improve the overall safety ratings of passenger cars manufactured in India. The ministry found that barring a few models, no vehicle has three-point seatbelts for the passenger seated in the rear middle in India. They only have a lap belt, which we found is hardly effective in case of a crash, thus putting the passenger at great risk," a senior MoRTH official said requesting anonymity.

[Meph1st0]

This is an excellent move by the government. I always wondered how hard it was to provide a proper 3-point seat belt for all the rear passengers. This is not only neglected by most of the manufacturers as listed in this thread, it is even not highlighted or mentioned in the car reviews.

[Goandiaries]

Good, finally! Next in line should be the inbuilt dash camera with sufficient resolution in all vehicles! In fact, M&M had introduced the mid-row 3 point seat belt as a segment first feature in their XUV300 way back in 2019 during the launch (in their top models), and then removed it a year later. Guess they have to now bring it back even on their base models! The cost of a 3 point seat belt assembly was around 3k when I had to purchase and fix it on my own. I don't understand why manufacturers need to cut relatively a minute cost, while cutting out a good safety feature.

[Meph1st0]

Originally Posted by Goandiaries

In fact, M&M had introduced the mid-row 3 point seat belt as a segment first feature in their XUV300 way back in 2019 during the launch (in their top models), and then removed it a year later.

XUV300 is nothing but Ssangyong Tivoli chopped to fit 4 metres (hence the reduced boot space). The reason why a 3-point seat belt existed was not due to Mahindra's safety consciousness but due to the fact that Tivoli had one. Once the bean counters swung into action, it was removed. Even their flagship XUV700 also does not get one.

[Duckdoc]

Originally Posted by Goandiaries

In fact, M&M had introduced the mid-row 3 point seat belt as a segment first feature in their XUV300 way back in 2019 during the launch (in their top models), and then removed it a year later. Guess they have to now bring it back even on their base models! The cost of a 3 point seat belt assembly was around 3k when I had to purchase and fix it on my own. I don't understand why manufacturers need to cut relatively a minute cost, while cutting out a good safety feature.

On the same page with you especially as their marketing and attractiveness to many customers were the safety features.

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

XUV300 is nothing but Ssangyong Tivoli chopped to fit 4 metres (hence the reduced boot space). The reason why a 3-point seat belt existed was not due to Mahindra's safety consciousness but due to the fact that Tivoli had one. Once the bean counters swung into action, it was removed. Even their flagship XUV700 also does not get one.

Absolutely!I realised this when I got the 300 that Mahindra can build like a tank but features like the 3 point seat belt existed only because of the Ssangyong pedigree, which was then needlessly removed.
I used to cringe at the mention of the crazy speeds the 700 could attain in the much lauded videos at interviews of their engineer and I could think only of the inadequate lap belt in a vehicle with such a powerful engine, which confirmed the statement about safety consciousness.

[ron178]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

Even their flagship XUV700 also does not get one.

Let's see what happens when they export it to Australia later this year, where ANCAP is likely to test it (in fact their President was visiting the test lab when the GNCAP was testing the Indian car, I'm not sure why). I'm hopeful and nervous for Mahindra at the same time. ANCAP completely shares Euro NCAP protocols, and they're often known as the most demanding overall among all NCAPs. Maybe they've developed a three-point seatbelt but aren't selling it in India.

Note that under the new mid-2022 Global NCAP protocol a car will not be awarded any points for the vehicle-based evaluation in child occupant protection if it does not have a UN or FMVSS compliant three-point seat in all seating positions. Hopefully the mandate will be in force by then.

As long as we're here, I'll just list the final new cars as of Feb 2021 that have retractable three-point seatbelts for all FWF seats before the mandate, since this thread is now in bits and pieces. I'll go up to the D1 segment (where you still find even global models with a static lapbelt, like the Jeep Compass and Elantra).

MG Astor
Volkswagen Taigun
Škoda Kushaq
Honda New City
Škoda Slavia
MG Hector
Toyota Innova
Hyundai Tucson
Škoda Octavia

That's really a very small list.

Škoda and MG are the only mass-oriented manufacturers who have the three-point belt as standard across their entire fleets.

The lack of a three-point belt is especially frustrating for those of us who would prefer a clear view ahead to avoid motion sickness and hence don't prefer outboard seats. As a frequent occupant of a cramped third row to avoid the lapbelt, I could not thank the Government more for this mandate. If I keep sitting in the third row I will eventually not be able to walk either way.

I am also looking forward to rear seatbelt reminders next, which have particular relevance to India. The Brazilian Honda City will get it, and I am nearly sure the exported MQB-A0-IN VW T-Cross (LHD Taigun) and India-made Virtus for Latin America will get it (Latin NCAP assesses rear SBR). Even Brazil's best-selling car, the Chevrolet Onix, gets it. None of those cars get them in India.

I'm almost confident there will be an ESC mandate soon.

The reason I think these systems are so important is that they are not very expensive in production yet can go a long way in protecting occupants much better. Given a long enough timeline for development I'm sure costs can be made negligible.

[landcruiser123]

Well, great move. Along with building awareness regarding seat-belt usage for rear passengers, I hope this move reduces the number of severe injuries and death.

I was recently in India and one thing I noticed is that most Ola/Uber (in the dozen or so rides I took) don't even have a seat belt latch in the rear seat. They are tucked under the seat or removed. I hope there is some enforcement on this to improve safety of passengers.

[GTO]

Thanks for sharing, Bhargav7! Moving your post out to a new thread. A new thread means 100X the views & 100X the visibility in search engines, including Google. Will add to homepage later this week .

@ BHPians, if you should spot any good post in an existing thread that deserves its own new thread, please report the post and we'll move it out for greater visibility.

Thank you!

[Goandiaries]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

XUV300 is nothing but Ssangyong Tivoli chopped to fit 4 metres (hence the reduced boot space). The reason why a 3-point seat belt existed was not due to Mahindra's safety consciousness but due to the fact that Tivoli had one. Once the bean counters swung into action, it was removed. Even their flagship XUV700 also does not get one.

Oh yes, the fact XUV300 is a modified Tivoli is well known. At least they did not remove it from the car for the Indian market and highlighted it as a segment first. And in the end, they did remove it probably looking at the competitors and wanted to compete with them.. Now, everyone have to bring it if the rule comes into place!

[Reinhard]

Finally a rational point that I fully agree with. Off late there have been too many random directives from this particular ministry otherwise.

Great to see an active drive to make cars safer. I sincerely and eagerly look forward to the same ministry making roads safer as well. Pushing all responsibility just towards cars is now a bit amusing. At least in my nick of the woods - highways are death-traps with added high-tech speed guns.

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

XUV300 is nothing but Ssangyong Tivoli chopped to fit 4 metres (hence the reduced boot space). The reason why a 3-point seat belt existed was not due to Mahindra's safety consciousness but due to the fact that Tivoli had one. Once the bean counters swung into action, it was removed. Even their flagship XUV700 also does not get one.

Trust me - bean-counters are in action always. They don't come into play only after a product is launched.
The car wanted a stonking score at GNCAP, that would be hard to beat on paper. Points like center 3pt belt, ESP etc - actually bring vital score points on paper for a car, even without a test. Thats why it was probably retained from the Tivoli. No reason why the engineers could not have removed such a modular part otherwise.

Then - such unique features are important for brand establishment at the launch of a new vehicle, especially in a crowded segment. The plan of feature deletions - exists well in advance and is not done suddenly. With the Nexon having scored 5 stars, "safety" was a buzz word, and what better than a unique safety feature, that exists only in imported cars?

Advance inventory orders for these parts are already agreed with the suppliers and the carmaker already knows that a certain feature/part is going to be removed X-months post launch. MBA degree is not given for nothing.

[rohan_iitr]

Very welcome move from the Government.

I am just curious to know how simple or hard would it be for the car companies to retrofit this feature on the existing models.

Also, in the cars which offer a 3 point seat-belt for the middle passenger, where does the top part of the seat-belt get anchored ? To the roof ?

Rohan

[PaddleShifter]

Back in 2012, I used to ask rear passengers to wear seat belts on highways and eventually stopped doing so after facing criticism and being made fun of.

I would stand apart from everyone here. I dont think this is the right move for now as all rear passengers need to start buckle up first. The Government is passing one new rule every few days. Lets maintain focus on 6 airbags, mandatory to wear rear seat belts etc for now. 5th seat belt can come later.

Apologies if my views dont match with other members.

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

Also, in the cars which offer a 3 point seat-belt for the middle passenger, where does the top part of the seat-belt get anchored ? To the roof ?

As far as I know:

More common: Rear of the back seat or floor behind rear seat where other seat belts are also anchored.
Less common: Roof.


Edit: Adding a few images I just Googled, featuring CRV, Audi and Nissan models.

[ron178]

Originally Posted by rohan_iitr

Also, in the cars which offer a 3 point seat-belt for the middle passenger, where does the top part of the seat-belt get anchored? To the roof?

Depends on the body style. In sedans, the upper anchorage is in a panel just above the seat and the lower anchorage is fixed. Similarly with most SUVs. Eg. Honda New City and Volkswagen Taigun.

However, in wagons, and cars with a third row, the upper anchorage is in the roof. There is a fixed anchor at the end of the belt, and you have to 'make' the seatbelt (see 0:41) by clipping this anchor to the lower anchorage yourself. Then you will find the movable 'tongue' on the seatbelt which you attach to the buckle on the other side as usual. Examples include the Toyota Innova and Fortuner.

https://youtu.be/hxxW9gczPGs

https://youtu.be/v4iOW3cTL6o

The MG Hector has a similar system where you have to 'make' the lower anchorage yourself, but the lower anchor still comes from a panel behind the seats.

Edit: There you go. BHPian PaddleShifter has explained all of them using detailed images in the post above mine.

Originally Posted by PaddleShifter

Lets maintain focus on 6 airbags, mandatory to wear rear seat belts etc for now. 5th seat belt can come later.

Well, without a three-point belt mandating rear seatbelts would be hard because the lapbelt is almost useless. Rear seatbelt use for certain age groups is already mandated, it's just that enforcement is really poor. Of course, having three-point seatbelts and not making people wear them would also be useless, but you have to start somewhere.

[AutoConsultant]

The mandatory front seat belt rule has been one of the most revolutionary rules from the government. The fines and strict enforcement have successfully acted as a deterrent and for someone who started driving in 2010 in Delhi it is almost a subconscious action I do when I sit in my car, irrespective of any reminders. Who knows how many lives have been saved due to this law.

While the enforcement of rear bench's seat belts might be a bit tricky for traffic police to spot, creating a law would definitely make at least a small percentage of travelers to use it. Enforcing seat belt reminders for rear seats in new cars would also make a few more people use it.

This should actually take priority over the 6 airbags law - easier and cheaper to execute imo. Also, more focus should be on crash test ratings - weather we make the Indian NCAP tests more stringent or go with GNCAP. Adding Airbags would lead to increased prices for the customers whereas we have seen manufacturers producing 4/5 GNCAP rated cars with competitive prices so the customer doesn't get the price burden.

[Piyush_DT]

This decision if implemented will be significant. Crowding at second row will be stopped. Also, child seat should be made compulsory as well.