[amit]

When westerners were in the stone age, India was in a technically and scientifically advanced age. Check out the video below made by BBC which shows how advanced India was and the innumerable list of inventions that were made by India and which subsequently changed the world.

India: what the ancients did for us.

[condor]

Amit, thanks for this - looks interesting, but is Huge. Looking at a 4+ hour download even on my bsnl broadband. Have to wait before I can see it, but didn't wait to share it.

[amit]

hey condor, sorry about that huge download but don't give up on it. It's a much watch.

Why do you say download? doesn't google video player play the video downloading it simultaniously? Whats the BSNL broadband speed? I have cable internet here and all videos start playing instantly!

[condor]

no Amit, not giving up - just waiting.
We dont have the 1.5mbps you got on tap - we got to make do with a piddly 128kbps, but I still count my blessings that I dont have to do dial up, here. I am doing a download because the buffering and playing play catch-up, and you know who wins. :(

[sujaylahiri]

It's about an hour long. A documentary. Looks good though.

[1Day]

a very nice video...

but if anyone one of you have been to the swaminarayan temples you will see much more information about what indians excelled in and gave to the world. unfortunetly we are not able to recover the losses of the british rule...

[rks]

Looks interesting, will download it as soon as I get to the office on Monday. Regarding the title "Be proud to be an Indian" -- I would like to suggest that we demonstrate our pride in our nation through genuine actions, not just empty words. When I see our politicians make long speeches and salute the flag on Independence/Republic Day, it is very clear to me that these are acts of empty, meaningless symbolism that some of the most unpatriotic cut-throats will not hesitate to indulge in. I don't care if someone burns the flag -- as long as (s)he does an honest day's work without pulling down his /her fellow-Indian, (s)he is patriotic in my book. Also too much of patriotism is not good -- we should be objective and not be afraid to criticize and call a spade a spade.

[rapideffect]

Hi All,

Have a look at the following links. It's all about ancient Indian spacecraft technology.

http://www.atributetohinduism.com/Vimanas.htm

http://www.rense.com/general61/vaman.htm
http://www.world-mysteries.com/sar_7.htm

[RE500]

Hi,
While it is true that the Indian civilization is indeed an ancient one with the list of achievements enough to put to shame any other ancient civilization, the sad fact is that India today is only an emaciated replica of what it was centuries ago. Also, to blame the British for all the things that are wrong today would be escapism. It is true the British rule in India was the cause of many problems that haunt us even today, but considered in perspective, we are reaping some of the benefits of modern India due to the colonization. The very fact that we from different parts of the country with no common language are able to communicate through the medium of English is just one positive byproduct of the British rule. Our constitution and judicial system will bear testimony to the debt we owe to the British system of jurisprudence. Even today the basic framework of laws that we have are copied from the British laws.

India as a civilization and as a culture is simply too massive to be ruined by a hundred years of misrule by Britain. The real problems that plague us today are corruption, illiteracy, population, cast prejudices, etc. etc. Which of this can we honestly say are legacies of the British rule?
It is a sad fact that we as a country are have scant regard for rules, are corrupt, give scant respect for rules and do not have civic sense. This discussion board itself is a small mirror to the problems we have. We have had so many people write about the total disregard to traffic rules by Indians in almost all our cities. Don’t we as an ancient civilization have the competence to frame some good regulations for common conduct and see to it that we implement it ourselves?
It is good to be proud of ones past but more important to realize that we are nothing compared to what we were five hundred or thousand years ago. It would be prudent to be proud of what we are today and not what we were a couple of centuries ago, and if we do not have anything to be proud today we need to accept the fact and get on with the task of changing the situation.
------------------------
a proud Indian : but who would rather be proud of its future than its past!

[typeOnegative]

Originally Posted by RE500

a proud Indian : but who would rather be proud of its future than its past!

That my friend sums it up brilliantly. But yes, it is great to recount our past. The civilizations of the Indian sub continent were definitely some of the most advanced. My only grouse with the documentary (I have yet to see it) is that it was made by a Western corporation. Are we not good enough to make our own? Or to make documentaries covering other civilizations as great as ours?

[AltoLXI]

Reviving this old thread in light of the discovery that Zero is older than thought.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/...st-zero-symbol

Radiocarbon dating reveals the fragmentary text, which is inscribed on 70 pieces of birch bark and contains hundreds of zeroes, dates to as early as the 3rd or 4th century – about 500 years older than scholars previously believed. This makes it the world’s oldest recorded origin of the zero symbol that we use today.

[V.Narayan]

69th Republic Day

This was a most fortuitous thread to discover on our 69th Republic day. A Happy Republic day to all Team BHPians.

As Indian's we exercise our hard won and well deserved democratic rights to criticize our nation and our society. And often this is with good cause. But most of all we love our drawing room conversations of how rotten our country and society is - at least some of us do.

There is a lot to be done in India but let's for a moment first look at what got done between 1950 and today.

GDP: Our GDP in 1950 stood at ~USD 21 billion in 1950 dollars at the then exchange rate of 4.76. In 2016 it stood at ~USD 2264 billion in 2016 dollars. In this time USD inflation has been roughly 9X to 10X. That gives us a 11X growth in real dollar terms. This from a country left virtually impoverished in 1947, which had just survived a cataclysmic break up in the West and the East and where famines were an annual feature. Today when we enjoy middle class prosperity it is easy to forget where we started from.

Poverty: This is the worst curse and misfortune that could befall a family. Before 1947 there was little real effort made to measure poverty or its extent. Those studies got real momentum only with the first 5 -year Plan. Between 1850 and 1920 food grain output declined in each decade compared to the one before because farmers were forced to cultivate opium, indigo etc to feed the empire trade. Govt of India estimated absolute poverty in India to be 65% in 1956 a year of a good harvest and monsoon. Meaning it was worse in years of bad harvest. According to the World Bank 180 million Indians still lived in poverty in 2014. Lets round that up to 200 million to allow for measurement errors and we get to 16% of our population. That is still 200 million people too many. Still moving from two-thirds to one sixth of our population is an achievement we should not ignore especially when the population itself grew 3 times in the same period.

Democracy: What ever we may say we are a vibrant colourful democracy which has developed a chaotic but functioning democratic culture unique to ourselves. The roots and awareness of our voting right and power is more deep rooted in the bottom 80% of the socio-economic spectrum than the upper middle classes and above some of who don’t even vote. The roots of democracy and the fact that the Westminister model works in India is our greatest achievement. A country which, according to the UN, has the greatest ethinc-lingustic-religious diversity in the world can only prosper with democracy and tolerance.

Of course there is a lot to be done. In my view the civic sense and basic good manners towards our neighbours and public property have a long long way to go. Public litter, poor road sense, bullying, all fall in this wide basket. And then there are our feudal attitudes, the tou janta hai main kaun hoon (do you know who I am), female infanticide, the entitlement mentality etc. It will take a long time to cure. I won't see this change in my lifetime but I hope my grand children will in theirs. Primary and vocational education and drinking water remain our two most looming challenges which deserve not to be under estimated.

When I look back at how economic initiative was stifled in the 1960s and 1970s, on the economic despair we lived with each year, on the famine of 1973-74, on the five dollar forex travel allowance you got, on how construction labourers did not have even chappals to wear, on standing in queue to collect the monthly quota of 10 litres of kerosene, I look back and say things have changed and a lot for the better. In 1950 few Western experts gave India a chance of surviving cohesively even for 25 years let alone 70+. We just need to look around at how many smaller less complex ex-colonies have fallen by the way side to know how slippery the slope was in 1950 - Pakistan, Sudan, Argentina, Nigeria, Philippines and many many others. All said and done despite our internal complexities and very real external divisive threats we enjoy a democracy, stable economic growth, some rule of law and most importantly hope for the future.

Despite our politicians, despite our bureaucrats despite our whingeing and whining upper middle classes and despite our functioning anarchy we chug along. If there is something you like or admire about your country or are proud of then say it here on this thread. Jai Hind.

All data taken from official Government websites or renowned economic data sites. All numbers rounded off for ease of reading

PS: I am an unapologetic nationalist who firmly believes each of us should do our two annas worth to help build this great country.

[subraiyr]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

69th Republic Day


There is a lot to be done in India but let's for a moment first look at what got done between 1950 and today.

GDP: Our GDP in 1950 stood at ~USD 21 billion in 1950 dollars at the then exchange rate of 4.76. In 2016 it stood at ~USD 2264 billion in 2016 dollars. In this time USD inflation has been roughly 9X to 10X. That gives us a 11X growth in real dollar terms. This from a country left virtually impoverished in 1947, which had just survived a cataclysmic break up in the West and the East and where famines were an annual feature. Today when we enjoy middle class prosperity it is easy to forget where we started from.

.

@Narayan - Interesting take on the numbers. Some interesting figures provided in Wikipedia and hopefully they are more or less correct. Our GDP did grow 11X, however compared to some of the other countries in the sub continent + others like S.Korea, it has not been that great. This is probably due to the reliance on Agriculture in the initial days. Also, it is interesting to see that Agri has dropped and Services is now much higher. Ref images

The biggest things one needs to look at

1. At the time of independence, India was not a united nation. There were a plethora of rulers with varied interests in governance. The initial years were spent in correcting this and pulling us out of the divisive quagmire of British era

2. Religion and casteism also played a huge part in the initial stages. However it is to be seen that we as Indians overcame this and now have learnt to live with culturally different group. It is in India that minorities can have their own way and the government defends the rights of minorities whether it be as per law or for vote bank politics. I dont agree with minority appeasement, but then again we are a nation where till now freedom of expression was guarenteed

Saying more can be detrimental i guess given the time we live in. But as a nation we need to be proud of the fact that we have grown to be an influential nation amidst the developed countries with all our challenges and short comings.

[FrozeninTime]

Taking a contrary view, I dont feel happy with changes that has happened in last 20 years.
Yes so called GDP numbers may paint us an economic powerhouse and has made World sit up according to Media propaganda. But deep down nothing has changed except increased subversion by sucesssive government. I would rather say there was more freedom in India in late 1990s than now.Also I pay more for basic necessities in life than 1990s. All new regulation from CAS to GST has not benefited poor and middle class.

Seeing frivilous expenditure on luxury transport in form of top of line luxury cars , private jet for VIP and electric cars for Govt. employees is nothing to be proud when sucessive goverment scoffs at loan waiver for poor debt ridden framer or relief from taxes for middle class.

To sum up I am happy to be Indian but unhappy way things are progressing.