[srini1785]

From what I know (and went through), the Germans were already working only 4.5 days per week. Friday afternoons were "Schoenes Wochenende" (Have a nice weekend) anyway . Its just official policy now.

To even move from 6 to 5 working days uniformly there should be for an employee,

1. Enough savings to enjoy the finer things in life.
2. Interests/ Hobbies and proper facilities to pursue them.
3. Understanding Management which wants to invest in employees wellbeing.
4. Less TV Channels and more outdoor entertainment.

and I can go on. I don't think that we tick all boxes.

[DigitalOne]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Germany to try 4-day work week from February 1 for the next six months

Germany is all set to try a 4-day work week from February 1, 2024, for the next six months.

Before this discussion continues, just wanted to point out the headline of the post and the linked news article is totally misleading. Entire Germany is NOT going to try a 4-day work week.

Quoting from the linked news article below.

The six-month trial for a 4-day work week would begin on February 1, and 45 companies are set to participate in it. The pilot is being led by 4 Day Week Global, a non-profit based in New Zealand.

The sample size and characteristic of the pilot company is hardly representative of the third largest world economy .

ps - I work for a Germany headquartered IT firm; there is zero talk of any 4-day week.

[msdivy]

5-day work week in certain industries & 6-day work week in others are set norms. Most of the world is aligned to this schedule. The production, finance, marketing, sales, services, support, maintenance business functions are aligned to this schedule. This is the accepted balance between business owners & employees.

There could be a few niche industries where their employees can work 4-day or 3-day a week. There could be few individuals who can work 4 hours a week.

It will require a revolution to change this norm. I don't think it will happen.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by srini1785

From what I know (and went through), the Germans were already working only 4.5 days per week. Friday afternoons were "Schoenes Wochenende" (Have a nice weekend) anyway . Its just official policy now.

The work week culture described above is similar in ANZ as well. To some extent it is even true of France. Most of Western Europe- in Retail and similar, shops and all are shut at 6 pm all week except maybe Fridays when they stay open till 9 or 10pm and of course remain shut all day Saturdays and Sundays. Then there is the ‘Siesta’ prevalent in some countries.
Some may remember in 1980’s and 1990’s Bangalore and Pune, Retail used to be shut in the afternoons and Sundays. Establishments in parts of Pune were closed on Thursdays.
The age of consumerism and instant gratification has changed and continues to change all this but mostly in poorer countries like ours where people cannot afford to take time off from a financial stand point. Holidays etc for working people are a relatively new phenomenon here in India.

[McLaren Rulez]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

From what I know (and went through), the Germans were already working only 4.5 days per week. Friday afternoons were "Schoenes Wochenende" (Have a nice weekend) anyway . Its just official policy now

Whether it's official policy or not, this attitude towards work will be the downfall of the Germans and many other EU nations. The Germans already have the lowest annual average hours worked than any other country in the OECD.

https://data.oecd.org/emp/hours-worked.htm

[pickdj]

Well, I work for one of the very few (maybe only) companies in India who have an exclusive 4-day work week. There is no catch, none. There are no log-in/log-out time restrictions, no need to follow a shift, no need for minimum number of hours per week, none of that. Everyone follows the 4 day week, sales, customer support, delivery,admin; everyone. We are aggressively work-from-home/anywhere and the only ask is 4 days per quarter in office.
And no, we are not a startup. About 700+ employees across the world. Have been here for many years. It's all on the honor system and it works beautifully!
Before you scoff, hear me out.
About 6 years ago, when we decided to try this out seriously, we first tested this for a quarter. Post the quarter, we took serious feedback from some of our largest and most demanding customers and they overwhelmingly loved it! Employees were happier, productivity was way up and attrition rates were low single digits (Pre-covid ofcourse).
Personally, I can vouch for the fact that my productivity has never been higher and my work-life balance has never been better.
Happy to answer more questions if asked. My advice is to go for it!

[am1m]

Originally Posted by pickdj

Before you scoff, hear me out.

Going by the WFH thread, I'm sure enough of that will happen. (Somehow, threads where people buy 50-lakh cars or 20-lakh bikes (the preserve of a few) progress as intended, but one about remote work/better work-life (affects several) will always get derailed with comments/reminders about "privilege"! )

Originally Posted by pickdj

Happy to answer more questions if asked.

Thanks, have several:

* For the 4 in-office days a quarter, are those company-wide? As in everyone in each office comes in on the same days?
* How does fresher/new team member on-boarding work? In-office or remote?
* Any idea if the IT team has had to deal with increased cybersecurity issues with remote work?
* Is your company publicly traded? (On any stock exchange.)
* Is the top management Indian?

Thanks in advance for any information! (And understand if you don't respond to any question to avoid sharing company/personally identifiable info.)

[pickdj]

Originally Posted by am1m

Going by the WFH thread, I'm sure enough of that will happen. (Somehow, threads where people buy 50-lakh cars or 20-lakh bikes (the preserve of a few) progress as intended, but one about remote work/better work-life (affects several) will always get derailed with comments/reminders about "privilege"! )

LOL. Not going there

Copying some of your questions and my answers

* For the 4 in-office days a quarter, are those company-wide? As in everyone in each office comes in on the same days?
NOPE. it is not mandated for everyone to come in at one time. You can plan for any 4 days. However many times distributed teams feel its better to coordinate a time when they all come in. Admin ensures that other teams don't come in at that time to ensure we use the office space we have. A big advantage is that it saves us from investing in a huge office.

* How does fresher/new team member on-boarding work? In-office or remote?
Hybrid. Mostly remote but with some in-office work at the start. But we want them to quickly develop the discipline needed to WFH without monitoring.

* Any idea if the IT team has had to deal with increased cybersecurity issues with remote work?
Oh Boy! We get those a lot. From Phishing attempts to someone impersonating senior leaders asking for 'gift cards'. LOL. But I think this is true for all IT teams in the current age.

* Is your company publicly traded? (On any stock exchange.)
NOPE.

BR

[volkman10]

Japan wants its hardworking citizens to try a 4-day workweek.

The government’s official backing of a better work-life balance represents a marked change in Japan, a country whose reputed culture of workaholic stoicism often got credited for the national recovery and stellar economic growth after World War II.

Hoping to produce more takers, especially among small and medium-sized businesses, the government launched a “work style reform” campaign that promotes shorter hours and other flexible arrangements along with overtime limits and paid annual leave. The labour ministry recently started offering free consulting, grants and a growing library of success stories as further motivation.

Link:

[V.Narayan]

The Right to Disconnect

https://indianexpress.com/article/op...india-9550785/
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5y32g7203vo

Recently Australia passed into law a bill on the right to disconnect from work related messages/emails after working hours. This brought back memories of my experiences with this law in France and Slovakia several years ago. The Australian law sensibly permits employers to send messages in non-working hours and protects an employee if that employee chooses not to respond till working hours the next day. France is worse where companies with more than 50 employees must include this as a part of the annual negotiations of the management with the Workers Council of Employees. France also bans employers from expecting employees to carry files home to work off line.

I can understand where these laws are coming from. In my career in the pre-internet days the boss or your employers simply could not reach you after 6.00PM or on weekends. It worked for two reasons – first most of us instinctively organized our selves to more or less complete our work in the allotted time; second the customers, suppliers, and other stakeholders were in the same boat.

The internet in all its forms has made work 24/7 with out a doubt. An employee would never believe that is a good thing. An employer would believe exactly the opposite. These new laws will work well if they are universal. But in a business where customers expect responses & answers within minutes or at most a few hours 24/7 this can be a meat grinder for the employer and those employees responsible for results to the customer. In my experience France was tolerable as my senior employees were reasonable and responsive. The next layer not so. Slovakia was a nightmare where while on vacation for 3 weeks chaps would switch off their mobile phones so you could not even reach them on a voice call. If you are a floor worker that is still okay. But if you are the General Manager of an industrial unit it is not a workable situation.

No easy answers here. I believe for a nation and economy like India that is developing, trying to get its productivity up, trying to get unemployment down imitating Western countries that are in cruise mode is not a wise path to go down. Nations, institutions, employment creating companies and GDP cannot be grown without stretching yourselves. I suspect that as Team BHP is dominated by young IT employees these views will not find favour. But all those here who have created jobs for others may resonate with my observations.

[ninjatalli]

Originally Posted by pickdj

Personally, I can vouch for the fact that my productivity has never been higher and my work-life balance has never been better.
Happy to answer more questions if asked. My advice is to go for it!

Can you share what kind of business your firm is in? And a bit more of what is your typical client profile.

I get the sense your firm roles are more of individual contributors. How are people not performing well assisted in improving in their productivity.

And why not share your firm name. It’s a fantastic achievement if your firm has been able to make the 4-day model successful.

[deathwalkr]

Interesting.

Is this something that applies to people in corporate jobs?

[V.Narayan]

Tokyo government launches 4-day work-week to aid families amid low fertility

https://www.hindustantimes.com/world...799198881.html

Tokyo's local government intends to implement a four-day workweek for its staff in an effort to encourage young families and raise the country's historically low fertility rates.

This is an attempt to boost the nation's historically low fertility rates and promote young families Tokyo's Governor Yuriko Koike announced that the metropolitan government's employees will be able to take three days off every week beginning in April.

At a time when Japan's fertility rate is at an all-time low, the new policy aims to encourage couples to become parents. According to the Ministry of Health, Labour, and Welfare, despite the government's intensified efforts to encourage young people to start families, it fell to just 1.2 children predicted per woman throughout her lifetime last year. For a population to be steady, that figure must be at least 2.1.

The programme will also have a feature of voluntarily working lesser hours with lower wages and a system that allows employees with small children to leave 2 hours early.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

The programme will also have a feature of voluntarily working lesser hours with lower wages and a system that allows employees with small children to leave 2 hours early.

Not sure if being allowed to leave 2 hours early is going to be enough for couples to change their mind about having kids!

If the majority of young adults are choosing not to have children, I'm sure the reasons are deeper. Probably the government needs to address those. Or open the borders to immigration, like any sensible nation would. But being Japan, I guess no chance of that happening. Am guessing government 'mandates to have kids' is coming next!

[ambandla]

Japan is in desperate need of young population. Their median age is 48, China at 38 and India at 28. When majority of population is above 50, it puts huge toll on healthcare, working and on economy. No wonder they are going into 4 day week and benefits for parents. China too is going in same direction of giving benefits for parents, removed one child rule.