[neil.jericho]

Im throwing in my 2 cents having worked for corporates for several years and seen things both as an employee and from the organization / HR / inner circle perspective. When you take into consideration today's job market and overall economic climate, I would say that the promotion, albeit without a payhike, is admission of the organization's recognition of your cousin's hard work and is actually a positive thing. Had he not got the promotion, he would have been unhappy and felt that all the hours spent toiling away were pointless and he would have been quite dejected.

I wouldnt lose much sleep over what has happened. If I was in your shoes, I would ask my cousin to stay put and keep up the good work. All his hard work has obviously built up a good amount of social currency for him, that is quite invaluable in today's Covid world.

[Jhinchak]

The title change surely does help, While looking for a position in the new company. Maybe being patient is the right thing to do right now because of the Pandemic and Companies are on the slower side on the Hiring front.

But I would also ask about the work culture or Job satisfaction because many Companies might pay you more but you will be not be happy with the job as you are being milked. If you're colleagues are supportive and helpful, the location of the office, work timings and of course work pressure all should be considered before leaving.

If you are not happy maybe apply for a few jobs and be patient till you get another job and then resign when the time is right.

[charanreddy]

Going by the OP post, here is what I would do.

1. Accept the promotion and work at the same salary.
2. Wait out the COVID related slump but keep looking for a good opportunity.
3. Use the skills and experience gained at the new level to seek similar level job. Given he is underpaid at current company his next job has good headroom interms of salary.

I joined corporate work in 2007 and from 2007 through 2010, there was an economic crisis and I was working for a bank. The increments I got were 2.6%, 0% and 0.3%. You could ask why bother at all vs give something like 0.3%. It is what it is.

It doesn’t help to feel negative or throw a tantrum. Your boss may have a boss also and could be in the same situation as you. You do what’s in your best interest. If it means continuing in the job then do so. My advice would be : don’t get emotionally high and take instant stupid decisions out of spite or anger or disappointment. Ingeneral you don’t control what happens to you , but you do control how you respond.

[TrackDay]

I voted 'Yes'

Take the promotion. At least designation wise you are going up the ladder. When you change firms later you can get into a better role, based on the previous promotion.

[HammerHead]

Originally Posted by foxworkz

What are your thoughts? What would you do if you were promoted without a pay hike?

I know how frustrating it can be BUT lets look at the situation in a different angle.

Most of the organization's follow something called as 'Market Ratio (MR)', which is nothing but a Min-Mid-Max pay package (band) for a role or grade whatever is being followed.

With a promotion you move to a higher band and since you are promoted without pay hike, you would land up at 'Min' or below for the new band.

Ideally the 'Compensation' team looks at the MR of their employees and would point out if someone is below 'Min' as it's a risk of loosing that employee to the market.

Personally, I will happily go for a promotion irrespective of pay hike as I know for sure in long run it will help me with
1. If I stay with the organization -- Some point down the line my package would be adjusted.
2. If I don't plan to stay with the organization -- Outside, I can take up a similar role to which I'm being promoted to or go a step above.

Note : General term for this situation is 'Lateral Movement'. Just so you know I have gone through this situation twice in the same organization however 'all' was recovered during the third promotion

[puntOOs]

I have been on both sides of this. There are years when I thought I got a higher raise that I deserved and some years lower. Sometimes I got promoted early sometimes late.

The framework I use and also told my direct reports is simple and is like that of a stock. The stock price always regresses around the intrinsic value but can be higher or lower than it for long periods of time due to a hundred other factors. What you can hope as owner/manager is keep running the business well and keep increasing the intrinsic value and sooner or later the market or acquirer will catch up.

So I told my direct reports to keep developing themselves and if I don't reward them in a year or 2 years someone outside will snap them up. As a manager I didn't always have the freedom to reward based on my wishes (or let go bad people as well). In case they were good, they went out and got good packages and I supported them with good references.

Your cousin should do the same. Slow down and invest in himself and look out if his current org isn't recognising his talent even after waiting. If he really developed himself the market will reward him.

[CosmicWizard]

Yes, if the promotion entails increase in job responsibilities and is not a mere HR trickery with title names. In any professionally run organization, compensation is typically a lagging indicator of your value add to the company so if you continue to move up the value chain, comp almost always follows.

[Maverick Avi]

I am working in an organization where pay hikes were not given during promotion initially. They used to get clubbed with annual increment cycle which usually used to happen in March every year. So for somebody who gets promoted in April, the promotion increment would happen next year in March. So much so, there have been instances where annual increment did not happen leading to no promotion hikes even next year. So how did the employees who got promoted felt? Not good for sure. Are they still with the organization? Well, yes. All 4 from my group at least. What led them to stay? Their own choice. Are those 3 folks still happy? Well yes, at least happier than the others who did not get promoted.

Some people in this forum have suggested not to give unsolicited advice especially for careers. Well, I have another perspective here. I remain quite reserved in giving any career advice even if solicited. That too when I am responsible for 50 odd folks in my organization. I have maintained a very straightforward approach towards these scenarios. Just put across all possible choices and perspectives in front of the person. Then let him choose. I even do not tell them that If I were you I would opt for option x.

People have different personalities, ambitions, and priorities based on which they take decisions. A person who is ambitious and has an aggressive goal for himself would straight away start looking for opportunities outside and look for something that would give him a reasonable hike. On the other hand somebody with a laid back personality might be happy with the promotion, new title, flexibility, less stress, work from home etc being provided by current company. So it eventually boils down to individual’s personality and his priorities. Doing a public poll for such advices is futile as the end result might not suit the personality or circumstances of the person in question here. Good to see that OP plans to share the topic’s link with his cousin so that he can have an overall perspective and then take an informed decision.

Coming to another perspective being discussed here, the employer. Was it the right thing to do from organization perspective? Depends on company culture and their leaders. Two different companies in same space and same financials can take different decisions for similar situations depending on leader’s outlook and experience. Some leaders can act conservatively during crisis situation whereas some are fine taking risks. Any decision can go wrong and then CEO/decision maker is held at task by the board of directors. Some organizations are quite aggressive. Their main agenda being bottom-line profits and they take not so employee friendly decisions very well knowing that it might lead to disengagement and attrition. But then this is what they choose. I as an employee can abhor the work culture there but still choose to work with them based on my priorities and choices.

Bottom-line is everybody has choices and it’s important to choose the right one based on your personality, goals, values and priorities. Getting into details of whether company is right or wrong is futile. Just be well informed about company, its leaders, its culture, your current situation and take an informed decision on your OWN.

PS : I have seen some of the most weirdest career advices coming from very successful people such as IAS officers and Country Heads of big corporates during the time my father wanted something BIG for me. I had nothing against those advices but they were coming from personal experiences and thought process of those strong individuals without caring much about the personality of this timid 21 year old just out of grad school. Now 17 years later I do feel that some choices could have been better but I certainly do not have any regrets.

[MinivanDriver]

Originally Posted by HammerHead

With a promotion you move to a higher band and since you are promoted without pay hike, you would land up at 'Min' or below.
Personally, I will happily go for a promotion irrespective of pay hike as I know for sure in long run it will help me with
1. If I stay with the organization -- Some point down the line my package would be adjusted.
2. If I don't plan to stay with the organization -- Outside, I can take up a similar role to which I'm being promoted to or go a step above.

I personally think the above mentioned post is the most logical and rational way to look at it. In a private company, it is employment at will at the end of the day from both sides - the employer and the employee. Hence considering the current circumstances as well, I would advice viewing the situation the way HammerHead has put it.

[Astonite]

I'm not sure what was is the other option that your cousin has. If he denies the promotion, will he be given a hike? Assuming NO and considering the current situation, your cousin is left with two options

• Take the promotion, wait for the salary hike whenever that happens
• He will still be in his current role without a salary hike

Going back to my first statement, what other option does he have? Unless he has an offer from another organization with a substantial increase in the package, it wouldn't be a great idea to reject the promotion. He can take up the promotion, work in the role for 6 months and move out for a better company that pays more if that's what he wants.

Personally, I would take it up with no hike as money would follow later (if I switch in future, the org would put me in the band for the role I'm hiring even if the difference is by a big margin). In the meantime, I can upskill myself and the job experience would help me too.

[SVMBLR]

Originally Posted by foxworkz

I believe that Employment is a mutually beneficial agreement between two parties.
============
What are your thoughts? What would you do if you were promoted without a pay hike?

I totally agree with you, but today scenario every company is taking advantage of current situation ( pandemic and current economy) whether company gain profit /loss ! Considering current commodities price viz.. Petrol / Diesel, Home needs etc.. salary is hike is a must for all employees. You wont believe that some companies started cut off around 25% on Gross Salary.

[SideView]

Originally Posted by foxworkz

I believe that Employment is a mutually beneficial agreement between two parties. Simply put, an employee brings in a certain skill-set / service for which the employer offers monetary compensation. The employee may be one in a hundred, but the company will hire him/her only if their services are useful / required. In other words, the company needs the employee as much as they need the company. Hence, it is an equal arrangement. In an ideal world, that would mean no one party should be expected to deliver more without a suitable equal compensation. However, this isn't often always the case.

Case in point, the story of my 29-year old cousin. He's been working in an accounting firm--a reputed MNC, for almost 8 years. He was due for a promotion for the last 2-3 years, however it didn't happen for unspecified reasons.

Last month, he finally got promoted, but was not given a pay hike (reason? the pandemic and current economy). The company refrained from committing to a specific date for the hike but merely said 'as soon as things get

I had seen my “ex Manager” in the technical role since the past decade whereas people who have joined later reached Director/Snr Director roles in same timeframe. (I honestly do know the reason why he still sticks around in the company)

I would say take the promotion.

Promotion and no hike is still better than no promotion, no hike.

Would I personally stick around long term in such a company. NO!

If they value you they would also value your effort and time spent in the short life of ours.


Ask him to take the promotion, and start searching for a better company/opportunity.(or change the project if he is soo comfortable in the company, maybe things would improve)

And no matter what, if they ask to stay back during negotiations once he resigns with the pay that he asked, never accept.

[Rajiv0909]

I don't know why the question? As an employee I don't have an option to reject recognition in the form of promotion. Especially when the decision of not supplementing with a pay hike applies org wide. I am yet to see an employee who refused a promotion because it wasn't accompanied by a hike.

If the employee isn't fairly compensated, he/she can always look out and for performers ( as the case would be for promotion) there is no dirth of jobs. Promotion would obviously increase the market value if not more.

[ShivrajG]

Voted NO

I was hired by an Indian IT MNC in 2016 and they offered a good hike while joining, next year in the appraisal they said since you have been hired on a high CTC we cant give you a hike. I asked not even a symbolic gesture of Rs.1 ? they said no !
I quit the organization with in 3 months.

Point is at the end you work for money and if the company cant afford to give you a hike you shouldn't be wasting your time there.
Who cares for the designation in this century?

[foxworkz]

Originally Posted by Rajiv0909

I don't know why the question? As an employee I don't have an option to reject recognition in the form of promotion. Especially when the decision of not supplementing with a pay hike applies org wide. I am yet to see an employee who refused a promotion because it wasn't accompanied by a hike.

Thanks for pointing this out. You're right.

I've made a mistake in the way I articulated the question the second time.

This was my original question:

Originally Posted by foxworkz

What are your thoughts? What would you do if you were promoted without a pay hike?

I wanted to add 'more responsibilities and work' to the question. But I inadvertently ended rephrasing it this way:

Originally Posted by foxworkz

...

Perhaps a better articulation is in order:

'Would you accept a promotion that comes with more work and responsibility but not a pay hike?' (Does this work?)

Two very different questions! The second one opens up very little room for discussion.

It should've have been:

'What would you do if you were promoted to a role that came with more responsibilities and work, and not a pay hike?'


So, just to clarify there are two aspects to the query:
1. The poll itself - Promotion without a hike - YES or NO
2. What would you do if you were promoted to a role that came with more responsibilities and work, and not a pay hike?

One might ask what is the relevance of the poll if the second question exists. It is just to see the ratio (as poll results show on top of the thread).

Apologies for the confusion.