[PreludeSH]

We are seeing many advertisements by coaching centres for students scoring ranks in JEE/NEET exams.

We also see the same student(s) being mentioned as a student in multiple institutes. Even if theoretically its possible that a student might attend classroom session in one institute and have distance learning from other, you cant expect them to do the same across 3 or 4 institutes.

Not sure if there is a legal issue doing this when the information is false. Is this being done by awarding the student monetarily to get their concurrence to use them in their advertisement ? Even then its false to say they were students.

[ValarMorghulis]

The trick works like this:
- Institute 1: Student actually studies here. Score number 1 rank and i now immensely popular. But no institute asks students to sign an exclusivity form

- Institute 2: Senses opportunity, pays student to say s/he enrolled for distance course

- Institute 3: Same as above, pays to say mock test series was taken from them

- Institute 4: Same as above, pays to say mains tests were taken from them.. and so on...

To be fair, sometimes students also mix and match different modules from different centres.No one thinks about credit when they are actually studying and preparing. The madness emerges only after the mock & actual ranks.

[am1m]

Surprising that the IIT dream refuses to die, especially when there are so many other options for students these days.

I wish someone had told me not to waste time preparing for IIT when I was in school. Some students (I'd say the vast, vast majority of students- going by the acceptance rates) simply don't have it in them to get in. And that's perfectly ok. I was very obviously one of those- neither was I gifted enough to crack the JEE on brains alone, and neither did I have the appetite to grind away at it for years and then crack the paper. But because of peer pressure and a parental overestimation of my abilities, I too like tens of thousands of others wasted so much time in these coaching classes. Everything worked out just fine though. But if I had spent those hours playing a sport, that would have done me so much more good!

I hope students and parents are smarter about their choices these days.

[chaitanyakrish]

This used to happen even 15-20 years ago. Now, we have a platform to discuss these topics.

I used to see photos of random students from Kota, Rajasthan in local city specific coaching institutes in Andhra Pradesh.

But, I never used to find those students in my classroom.

[fordday]

Apart from this every other kid seems to be enrolled in Allen or Byju or Aakash. What is happening? And these kids have to wear (I think so) that institute branded T shirts, making then living walking advertisements.

Are these any helpful? I know it may work for a few. But this en masse enrollment seems crazy. How could these parents push them for another school after regular school hours?

[lsjey]

When the governments don't provide good quality education, then such things are bound to happen.

If a student is a topper, they can earn good money this way and pay for their college education.

And as has been already pointed out, there is not much regulation in this space as well.

Regards,
lsjey

[binand]

Originally Posted by PreludeSH

Not sure if there is a legal issue doing this when the information is false. Is this being done by awarding the student monetarily to get their concurrence to use them in their advertisement ?

As someone who secured a newspaper-worthy rank in a PET many decades ago and had been played like this by coaching institutes:

* Throughout the 2 years of higher secondary education, these coaching institutes conduct "practice tests".
* Practice tests are free of cost for participating students, provided they allow their names & photos to be used for promotional activities.
* Because of the exam format, "need for practice" (the specific PET I cleared had me answering 120 objective questions with negative marking in 90 minutes in each of 3 papers) is a major worry for the students and parents.
* Therefore almost all serious students sign up for as many such practice tests as possible.

When the actual results come, these coaching institutes match the qualifying students with their entire student database - not just classroom or correspondence students, but also those who just took such a practice test.

Et voila. Full-page newspaper ads with a huge matrix of "our students who got high ranks" in whatever exam.

[androdev]

I don’t think even parents or students care about these ads any more - I am sure it’s common knowledge that such claims are dubious. It’s done only as a branding exercise and to gain the mindshare of the potential clients during the peak season. Branding is very critical for b2c - as can be seen by the insane levels of spend by companies like Byju - often exceeding that of Coca Cola/Pepsi.

The blame lies 100% with parents, who fully knowing that Engg/Med doesn’t suit their children, still go ahead enrol them in the BEST program they can afford only to earn the right to say they have done the very best for their kids. Can’t blame a business entity to encash such culture.

[agambhandari]

Originally Posted by lsjey

When the governments don't provide good quality education, then such things are bound to happen.

If a student is a topper, they can earn good money this way and pay for their college education.

And as has been already pointed out, there is not much regulation in this space as well.

Regards,
lsjey

Best medical education in the country is available at throwaway prices(from the likes of AIIMS/MAMC) , there's no need for the money from these institutes.

As someone who secured a single digit all india rank in NEET few years ago, I can confirm that you get calls from many such institutes offering remuneration in lieu of your picture in their ad, but at the end the onus lies with the parents and the candidates to restrict this to the entities that you are really associated with. You will find many videos and ads with my face on it but all would clearly say that I only attended Distance learning/Test series because that is all I did with them and I made it a point to make it clear. Of course I was offered a higher amount if i said something else but I didn't agree to it.

[ajayc123]

This one's doing rounds on WA.

[bhphog]

I have worked in the Ed-Tech industry in Sales and have worked for multiple unicorns in the last 6 years, be it Byju's, Vedantu, Unacademy or Upgrad. Finally have left the industry for good.

Let me begin by saying, yes, rhis advertisement may seem misleading to us learned lot but how this is perceived by the other end of the lot is polarizing.

As for the crazy number of students enrolled for these companies, its more to do with the technique and skills of the Sales Team than the product itself. My 15 member sales team would bring 60+ lakhs worth of enrollments each month with an AOV of 30-40 thousand in a B2C Sales Setup.

More than the service, its how they are sold. Its manipulation at its best. We play with the customer mindset to an extent where they feel either completely helpless or extremely satisfied. The idea is to use these two situations for the company's gain. If they feel helpless, we show them the way out of the situation by getting an enrollment and if they are satisfied, then its a done deal.

What will surprise you is that about 80-85% of enrollments are the helpless kind.

Happy to answer and provide insider information.

[ajayc123]

Your analysis simply is a reflection of the typical marketing philosopy of exploitation of the human psychology, where to influence somebody to reach a decision you need to exploit the human fear or greed.

The helpess guys map to fear (fomo), and the satisfied guys map to the greed (for outcome/ value).

The tragic aspect is when the marketing blows out of proportion where the the ordinary product takes the backseat and the psychological manipulation becomes the mission.

For God's sake please strike a balance between the product and the promotion.

WhiteHat Jr is another epic institution in this bunch that has some highly dubious advertising and manipulative tactics.

As a general practice, when I am buying something, I tend to avoid product/offerings where there is too much marketing, and research more on the product.

[Saanil]

Originally Posted by bhphog

I have worked in the Ed-Tech industry in Sales and have worked for multiple unicorns in the last 6 years, be it Byju's, Vedantu, Unacademy or Upgrad. Finally have left the industry for good.

Appreciate your insider insights! Would like to know your views on the following:

- Do you see so many Ed-Tech players surviving competition in the next 2-3 years?

- Any comments on the quality of teachers in these Ed-Techs? Is there too much churn happening amongst teachers? I was reading an article yesterday which highlighted that teachers in many of these companies are under tremendous pressure to bring more students by creating viral youtube videos?

- In your opinion, is the study material of these Ed-Tech companies better than those of offline institutions?

[arnabbhagabati]

Originally Posted by ajayc123

WhiteHat Jr is another epic institution in this bunch that has some highly dubious advertising and manipulative tactics.

Whitehat Jr is the epitome of this exploitation.

From what I understand this whole industry of coaching institutes and the madness of competitive exam preparation stems out of two psyches:

1. A relatively poor family looking for a ticket out of poverty by sending their kids to a govt funded prestigious college
2. Parents trying to impose the dreams they themselves could not achieve or their arch rivals(a relative/colleague) achieved on their children

Apart from the financial loss itself, the psychological impact on the children and the parents, loss of opportunity in terms of years lost in a critical formative phase of life - harms of this phenomenon are many.

But at least the college entrance exams are for relatively older kids (14+ years) when they are somewhat more developed to handle the madness and pressure. Also, in a demography like India, the individual cases belonging to point 1 above is somewhat unavoidable and understandable

Whitehat Jr is now taking this to another level of evil. They are pulling to 7-8 year old kids into this vortex - potentially stripping off the few years of childhood left in the Indian kids.

The first time I saw a Whitehat Jr made me cringe - man some people can stoop really low!

[bhphog]

Originally Posted by ajayc123

Your analysis simply is a reflection of the typical marketing philosopy of exploitation of the human psychology, where to influence somebody to reach a decision you need to exploit the human fear or greed.

The helpess guys map to fear (fomo), and the satisfied guys map to the greed (for outcome/ value).

The tragic aspect is when the marketing blows out of proportion where the the ordinary product takes the backseat and the psychological manipulation becomes the mission.

For God's sake please strike a balance between the product and the promotion.

WhiteHat Jr is another epic institution in this bunch that has some highly dubious advertising and manipulative tactics.

As a general practice, when I am buying something, I tend to avoid product/offerings where there is too much marketing, and research more on the product.

I agree this being a typical strategy but in this industry the combination of this extraordinary marketing, like you rightly said, where the product/service takes a back seat + a super manipulative aggresive sales team is horrendous. What feels extremely wrong is the concept of dream selling to the people in tier 2,3 to a parent with an annual income that is the equivalent of a 1 year course of these companies.

My first sales demonstration for a company called Lido Learning (now bankrupt) was in a placed called J.J Colony in Uttam Nagar, Delhi. (JJ colony equals Jhugi Jhopdi colony essentially is Government's replacement of the slums present earlier). The family of 5 lived in a single room. Father was a night security guard, the sole earning member with 3 children. I sat on the floor and sold them a 40k yearly course on loan with about 9% ROI that would take 24 months to pay off (twice as long as the actual course). The product, live classes for two subjects on a cheap android tablet. All I did was dream sell to them. One of the many regrets that I'll die with.

Originally Posted by Saanil

Appreciate your insider insights! Would like to know your views on the following:

- Do you see so many Ed-Tech players surviving competition in the next 2-3 years?

- Any comments on the quality of teachers in these Ed-Techs? Is there too much churn happening amongst teachers? I was reading an article yesterday which highlighted that teachers in many of these companies are under tremendous pressure to bring more students by creating viral Youtube videos?

- In your opinion, is the study material of these Ed-Tech companies better than those of offline institutions?

Hey, Happy to answer many more!

- The only Ed-Tech players that would manage to survive would be the ones providing certifications of up-skilling. Don't get me wrong, the learning is still mediocre with these players but certifications are of great importance for people early in thier careers and they are ready to pay for them to get an accelerated growth in thier jobs. Byju's reportedly loses Rs. 12.5 Crore each day while Upgrad has managed to raise a funding round amid the Funding Winter.

- These companies have what we call show teachers and then real teachers. Show teachers are the one generally advertised and marketed and you would see them giving pre-sale trial classes. They get paid enormously.
While on the other end are teachers on contractual employment with scripts provided to them to just read out in the class. WhiteHat Jr. had a court case wherein they were accused to even script out the jokes that the teacher makes in the class, let alone the content. For doubts, which are generally solved in the chatbox or via an app, are students pursuing masters or Ph.d working part time.
Unacademy's top educators like Namo Kaul make upwards of crores in a single year.

- Study material, generally for the K12 segment is outsourced to firms that specialise in them. Again, that's a one time activity and these materials are rarely upgraded except for the hot selling courses. But yes, some companies do have good practice materials for specific courses. Compared to offline, I would say they are on par with them.