[bblost]

This post of mine is inspired by a movie I saw last weekend.

a: What is the population of this city.
b: 50 to 60 lakhs.
a: wrong the population is 2.

The person inside the multiplex. the person outside it.
The person inside the atm, the person outside it.
The person earning 2 Lakhs a month, the person barely surviving on 2k a month.


When I was in college as part of a NSS camp I interacted with some fisher folks.
They earned 5 bucks a day. They still earn in the same range.

Some of us earn 5 bucks for every second spent in the office.

The problem India faces is the same that most of the world is facing.
Watched the Persian movie called Crimson Gold onTV today.
It captures the slow changing face of the society in Iran.
I found it quite the same in India.

We all need to move forward as one India.
Else you better get some karate training to save your shoes, pizza, cards and of course your life.

[jat]

there can be many solutions, eg entertainment tax on sex, tax on babies, ban on marriages or marriage tax or simply have the babies registered and have number plate like vehicles. the babus in govt offices will make sure people won't have babies after that.

Population is not a problem as such, but mismanagement is. In Europe or Japan cities, the population density is at par with Indian cities, but you don't feel it because the people there are more diciplined, tolerant and organised.

There if you have 1000 cars passing per hour on a single lane, still you won't have a traffic jam. But here, even if there are 100 cars/hr, on multiple lane, you can have a traffic jam.

Based on agricultural requirement, we do need a bit of population control. And so are the developed countries insisting. Because developing and under-developed countries are going to produce the food for developed countries in future.

[condor]

jat : Population is not a problem as such, but mismanagement is.

The problem is in the lack of management. And we also need to look at the world as a whole, not just in India.

jat : There if you have 1000 cars passing per hour on a single lane, still you won't have a traffic jam. But here, even if there are 100 cars/hr, on multiple lane, you can have a traffic jam..

To use your own example, the world's population is like cars in a traffic jam : come into one road, and stay there in increasing numbers. So the jam builds up. People trying to get ahead, but just end up in a grid-lock. A situation so familiar to us on our roads.

If human population had been like the first half of your example - the number of people being born = the number of people dying, then we would not have had a problem on our hands.

[sameer_dg]

Originally Posted by agentsmith2

Drafting is not a solution. 250 Million Men strong army will need money to be fed.

India's forest cover is 24% aimed to reach 35% in the current five year plan [Compared to 25% in USA]. We're one of the 'less-dense' and 'less vertically growing' countries. There's enough growth to accomodate every bhaiya from UP and every mallu from Kerala. Don't lose your hope yet [lose, not loose :-p]

We don't have highrises the way every modern city has. So we grow horizontally - hence the commotion. India needs well planned cities.

For instance, entire Dharavi can be accomodated in well built 10 '20 floor' highrises. Please visit KL, HK or outskirts of Shanghai to see how nice planning can accomodate both poor people in slum highrises in the suburbs and rich downtown. I won't call them slums in our context because these buildings are well kept, have water/electricity - infact they just look like nice flats - albeit a little packed and organized.

Why India doesn't permit high-rises is beyond me. I understand you need excellent water-drainage and wide-girth underground inrastructure for that which our cities don't have.

But I'm sure we'll figure that out if the next govt is a little more urban centric.

Population is a boon - and we will be laughing ourselves to death in 10-20 years when China and the entire western world sees a sudden drop in their educated work force. This is the key to being the Superpower post 2030.

Thats is a nice way of putting it but still think one of the options suggested by me should be seriously considered.

[aerohit]

Originally Posted by agentsmith2

Population is a boon - and we will be laughing ourselves to death in 10-20 years when China and the entire western world sees a sudden drop in their educated work force. This is the key to being the Superpower post 2030

population is a curse

1 billion people taking dump everyday with no flushing toilets is not pretty.
No wonder, when a Plane lands from another country, as soon as the door opens people complain of foul air.

This applies to all classes of society. The more kids you have, the lower your standard of living is going to be. Typically, families with one child are doing well, as they have enough disposable income.

Population is a boon, but at what level? 300 million? 600? or 2 billion?
India only needs 500 million and that is what the natural resources can support if everyone wants to live comfortable life.

I have not seen any country in the history that became a superpower on the basis of over-population.

You are simply ingoring the basic concept of scarcity of natural resources - because peope like you think that water comes from tap, petrol comes from petrol pump, and electricity comes from wall plug.
WRONG - all this comes from LIMITED natural recources, which are in decline.

The India story = Increasing Population + Declining Natural Resources. The Joke of the Century.

As the expert on YouTube says - if you dont reduce population, the nature will reduce it for you, by disease, famine, war etc....

Riz Khan - Population Explosion -

Part 1

YouTube - Riz Khan - Population Explosion - 17 July 08 - Part 1

Part 2

YouTube - Riz Khan - Population Explosion - 17 July 08 - Part 2

[bhp1]

One child norm is the only answer. I remember a quote from the movie Matrix, where the agents are comparing the Human race to Viruses & says Humans multiply like viruses & deplete all the natural resources! So, true!
China's population is on a decline & ours is booming as ever.
Every where you see, there's a sea of people, its almost impossible to find open spaces & admire nature.

[alpha1]

All those who cry that booming human population in India is the root cause for all the evils and problems being faced in India - why don't you guys simply admit that you have been (and are still being taken for ride) by those who are "ruling you". (Ironic, since these politicians should be actually serving you).

Its an irony to see that Europe and Japan, which are more densely populated than India and less resource intensive (mineral resources) than India are far far ahead.
They never talk about population density being really a problem.

Lets admit one thing. We indians don't know how to manage our resources. Be it Human, mineral, machinery, money.
We like to blame all our problems on things that really are not really the causes.
Stuff like population, foreign hand, brain drain, corruption ... stuff are all excuses.

The main reason why we are what we are is attitude.
We blame population as a cause for all problems like poverty, illiteracy, diseases, misery etc. Well why don't we admit that we don't know how to manage such a large population. Bulging Population becomes a problem only when we don't know how to use it.

One simple example comes to me is that of oil & gas exploration. Please bear with me if you think I am drifting.
During earlier days, ppl used to curse when they struck gas reserves. Infact the gas which used to come out from oil wells was simply burned away.
No one though that it could be such a great energy resource in those days.

Look at it now. Ironic? The same "by-product" that we used to "flare off" and "bleed away" is the same one for which exploration is going on.


We blame foreign hand for all our political problems, why don't we admit our incompetance in handling the "foreign hand"? The foreign hand only acts as a catalyst for "eff up" done by us only.

Brain drain? LOL, thats such a communist ideology/lingo. We used say that we have a lack of trained manpower, that the trained "elites", leave this country and go somewhere else. They shouldn't be allowed to do so. They should be compelled to stay back. ...
OK stay back and do what??

All these issues are similar.

We have just come up with excuses and explanations to pin-point blames on stuff that really isn't the cause.

[supremeBaleno]

@alpha1, so as per you, this population thing is just a conspiracy and we all are being taken for a ride ? Really enlightening, man. It might take some time for you to understand the ill-effects of having a population that strains the available resources at its seams. But then it might be too late.

And pray what does a foreign hand have to do with us breeding like rabbits ? You have actually gone one up on our incompetent politicians - they might blame price rise, terrorism etc on foreign hand, but I dont think they ever laid the blame for our population on foreign hand.

And I do not see what flaring away gas has to do with population problem. My Dad retired from one of the premier oil-exploration companies in India and I have been priveleged to visit many oil drill-sites in all parts of India.

I also noticed how in those days they would flare away the gas, while working to get to the thing they were actually drilling for - crude oil. And I remember asking my Dad why they are wasting the gas instead of tapping it for energy use. His answer was storage problem - in those days.

Ofcourse there did exist drill-sites in some places where they would tap this and run it through pipelines running in their townships for domestic use. But this was not possible at all their installations as they did not have the mechanism to store the gas.

[sameer_dg]

Bottom line is that Population is a problem and somethings must be done.

[spawnofsatan]

Now that the majority has concluded that population INDEED IS A PROBLEM.

What are some things we can do to help with the problem.

Some of them are having no more than one or two kids ourselves, but what are some others that apply to a wider range of people?

Originally Posted by spawnofsatan

Now that the majority has concluded that population INDEED IS A PROBLEM.

What are some things we can do to help with the problem.

Some of them are having no more than one or two kids ourselves, but what are some others that apply to a wider range of people?

since the majority have concluded that population is the problem, why not that majority do as lemmings do, and go for a long swim in the indian ocean?

here's a link-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemming

[condor]

@Dan, missed your post here completely !
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/691185-post83.html

DirtyDan : As India reaches critical mass in terms of over population, and North America and the rest of the world follow closely behind, we see the future of the world in microcosm inside a car. Put enough people in a car and leave them there for two hours at close quarters....and they will drive each other to madness and kill each other. This is the grand design of the Earth Mother Gayne who will soon tire of us and shake us off her like so many fleas. Except for me who she likes very much. All Hail Gayne.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by alpha1

Its an irony to see that Europe and Japan, which are more densely populated than India and less resource intensive (mineral resources) than India are far far ahead.
They never talk about population density being really a problem.

Lets admit one thing. We indians don't know how to manage our resources. Be it Human, mineral, machinery, money.
We like to blame all our problems on things that really are not really the causes.
Stuff like population, foreign hand, brain drain, corruption ... stuff are all excuses.

while there are problems in our own country, I don't think it can be directly compared with european countries and japan. We depend on crops for most of our food, and there is only so much land to support 1 billion+ people. plus our main industry is agriculture, which means we need more of it.

Why I brought this topic up again, because I saw this news in rediff and I think the culprit lies in the uncontrolled population growth. An indian farmer can not compete with an american farmer not because of some subsidy or a gnetic conpiracy, but because in america they have a lot of acres per farmer.

Why the US is to blame for India's farmer suicides : Rediff Business News, Latest India business news, India Economy news, World Business, Finance news, Latest business headlines, business videos and business articles.

High time we start looking at population as a very important issue in India. Otherwise our children will have a very difficult future. On the other hand there are countries who really need some population growth to support their aging propulation.

[greenhorn]

has any of you seen the movie idiocracy?
I feel that it is, to some part coming true.

And given the shortsightedness of humans in general, i think we ourselves will be responsible for our own extinction. Its inevitable, and whatever we do will only prolong it :|

[GordonGekko]

Population as such is not a problem....IF...it is evenly distributed.

We have a lot of area, however our metros are just spreading like fire in an unorganized fashion.

New centres for business need to be constantly set up, so as to reduce the burden on the big cities.

In addition to that what we need is BASIC CIVIC SENSE, which most people..including the so-called educated seem to lack.

Just look at the roads, NH8 is good enough to be doing 80k/h consistently, however due to consistent lane changing and other annoying things, we have the misfortune of seeing traffic halted on it at some times.
Utterly disgusting.