[ECM]

=People For Ethical Treatment Of Animals
And here is there spy video in which you will see how Humans treat Pigs and Piglets.
Warning:-Some scenes may hurt your soul.

http://www.petatv.com/swf/video.swf?...edit_peta_high

[bottle]

I subscribe to PETA too , People for Eating Tasty Animals

just kidding, I havent watched the video but lots of people especially those for whom rearing animals is a livelihood only see it as a source of money and have no sensitivity at all to the plight of the poor things.

[maddy42]

Well access has been restricted by my company to that link and am a non veggie and also from the farming background. So what do they want people to do? Eat veggies? But the land is being used for industries right?? Well forget it why to start getting flamed.

[vivekiny2k]

maddy, more grain is used to feed the animal than can be used to satisfy the people who would eat that much meat. loss of agricultural land is not an argument. and it's ok to rear and kill animals to eat, what's not good is sadist torturing.

ECM, you should see the way indians treat their cattle in rural india.

[ECM]

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

ECM, you should see the way indians treat their cattle in rural india.

Tx,I am quite aware of it dude.

[v1p3r]

Peta is so full of hypocrites, it's not even funny.

[Amien]

I've said it before and i'll say it again, PETA is rubbish.

See, i have no problem with people not eating meat for health or religious reasons. The problem is the people who think they are somehow more humane than non vegitarians by avoiding meat and try to make everyone else feel guilty for eating meat. Do they have any idea how many small animals die during the harvest process? Rabbits, gophers etc get caught in the rotor blades , their bones get crushed and die an extremely painful death, thats a lot worse a fate then what animals in the meat industry go through. Their response to this embarrasing fact is "well atleast we dont kill intentionally" WHAT THE HELL? How can it be unintentional if you KNOW about it? Even if 70 plus percent of harvesting in India is non-mechanized, You're telling me that the life of one baby rabbit isnt worth the same? Enjoy your tofu murderers.
So what's the way for these "humane" people? Buy your own land and grow your own damn potatoes. Now, at this time these people wont step up. Why? Because its too inconvenient. "We're trying to limit the suffering" they say, how about you limit MY suffering and shut the hell up.

I don't care about your stupid diet, as long as you keep it to yourself. You have the liberty to do whatever you want as long as you shut up about it. Until then, as Maddox says, For every animal that you don't eat, Im going to eat three.

PS:
@vivekiny2k
People conveniently forget to mention that the quality of grain used to feed these animals is so coarse that it's unfit for human consumption.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by Amien

PS:
@vivekiny2k
People conveniently forget to mention that the quality of grain used to feed these animals is so coarse that it's unfit for human consumption.

that was in response to justification for eating meat by lack of grains.

coarse or not grain is grain, nobody eats grain as such. and what is grown is also a decision made by those who grow it.

[Amien]

vivekiny2k, you aren't getting my point...
the "grain is grain" line makes it evident. There is no justification to eating meat because of lack of grains or vice versa as there needs to be balanced consumption of both for (apparently not so) obvious reasons.

The majority of grain grown for livestock is tough as rocks, coarse, and so low-grade that it's only fit for animal consumption in the first place. Spare me the "you could feed 500 people with the grain used to feed one cow" ; it's not the same grain. (I'll take some liberties and assume what your next point will be, incase you decide to hold your stand)Then there are the people who jump on the bandwagon with "you could plant billions of potatoes on the land used for cows"--good point, except for the fact that not every plot of land is equally fertile;
Do you really think farmers have a choice as to what they sow all the time? That any sort of consistency in the fertility of land is possible?

Like i said before, I've got no issues if you follow vegetarianism or veganism(lol) for health or religious reasons, but anything else and you're really only kidding yourself.
I'd be glad to continue this discussion provided you bring up something i havent covered already.
Regards.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by Amien

Spare me the "you could feed 500 people with the grain used to feed one cow" ; it's not the same grain. (I'll take some liberties and assume what your next point will be, incase you decide to hold your stand)Then there are the people who jump on the bandwagon with "you could plant billions of potatoes on the land used for cows"--good point, except for the fact that not every plot of land is equally fertile;
Do you really think farmers have a choice as to what they sow all the time? That any sort of consistency in the fertility of land is possible?

Actually they do. with the demand for meat from the majority of population which shudders at the thought of not having meat in the meals, there is a compelling reason to grow food just good enough to feed the livestock. I don't have statistics on fertile land but I can't believe there is not enough land to feed us humans, but some to grow grain for livestock and then feed us.

besides, Maddy point was industrial usage was taking fertile land away. in that case, what makes more sense, more grains or keeping an extra layer in food chain?

Like i said before, I've got no issues if you follow vegetarianism or veganism(lol) for health or religious reasons, but anything else and you're really only kidding yourself.

you are forgetting environment and stress on fertile land. Yes, health is the most important reason for me to reduce my meat intake.

and yes, I have no doubt on hypocrites in peta who don't mind thousands of unthankful turkeys killed for thanksgiving supper.

[Amien]

Unfortunately, as i've said, you did not bring anything to light that i hadn't covered already.

In your post to maddy, the second line of your post is accurate, the first is not, therefore i replied to it along with my own opinion on "PETA". Im aware of the context of the reply.

Farmers DON'T have a choice as to what grain they grow, it gets used for different purposes depending on its quality level. As im sure you can deduce, grain of higher quality will fetch the farmer a higher price for his yield, rest assured that there is no "pressure" on him to create inferior goods.

Secondly, Land fertility, climatic change and pollution levels while important issues have NO connection with the production and/or consumption of meat. I'll tell you what, Im sure most people, yourself included, purchase and use cars right?(this being an automotive forum and everything). To make a car (including tires), it takes about 40,000 gallons of fresh water and the lives of many animals. That's not including the petrol/gas it takes to run the car, the electricity to run the petrol pump/gas station, the resources(leakages included) used to create/utilize the rig that brought you your precious oil, the destruction of toxic chemicals that went into creating your clothes, and the electricity you use every day to post in forums like these over the internet.
By driving your cars, you pump billions of tons of poison into the atmosphere and you're slowly killing us all. The computer you use requires 250 watts of electricity minimum, let alone the billions of computers required to keep you on the internet. All consuming energy. All contributing to pollution. Let's just ignore those minor hypocrisies. Someone wants to enjoy a burger and you'll be damned if you're going to let them.

You know what, I don't have beef(pun?) with PETA because they are hypocrites and cant stick to their own propaganda. It's because they use the the emotions of common guys like you and me in a bit to get us to join their bandwagon of stupid. If they were really commited to their cause, they would point out what's good about the meat industry along with what's bad. They would say it like it is instead of being insecure about losing face.
The problem is, therefore, That even when i want to feel sorry the next time i see/come across a PETA campaign, i have to figure out first weather im being brainwashed by their stupid agenda.

[greenhorn]

Personally, I wonder why some people would rather care more about animals ( not that they are undeserving) than their fellow human beings

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by Amien

Farmers DON'T have a choice as to what grain they grow, it gets used for different purposes depending on its quality level. As im sure you can deduce, grain of higher quality will fetch the farmer a higher price for his yield, rest assured that there is no "pressure" on him to create inferior goods.

I have no reason not to believe you and no data to prove you wrong.

Secondly, Land fertility, climatic change and pollution levels while important issues have NO connection with the production and/or consumption of meat. I'll tell you what, Im sure most people, yourself included, purchase and use cars right?(this being an automotive forum and everything). To make a car (including tires), it takes about 40,000 gallons of fresh water and the lives of many animals.

Come on, just because you can prove a connection with environment change to the car's pollution, you are saying there is no connection to the livestock breeding? have you forgotten the green house effects from cattles' gases, have you forgotten the so called developed countries exporting shiploads of bull**** (literally) to india because they could not handle it?

Someone wants to enjoy a burger and you'll be damned if you're going to let them.

i fell sorry for them and I would give them many reasons to not do that in every single meal. cruelty to animals is the last of them.

The problem is, therefore, That even when i want to feel sorry the next time i see/come across a PETA campaign, i have to figure out first weather im being brainwashed by their stupid agenda.

I already agreed that animal activists have double standards.

on a related note, this is something that really bothered me. 4000 $ to save each dog.

Iraq
Baghdad Pups - Home

I don't really care if Michael Jackson gifts a million dollar necklace to it's (ok, his) pet chimpanzee. but i do feel bad about people's hard earned money being used in such activities.

[BaCkSeAtDrIVeR]

Is Peta more holy that SPCA?