Team-BHP - The Forex Thread
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Quote:

Originally Posted by rajesh1868 (Post 4748789)
Looking for a forex card for my mother for her use in an upcoming UK trip.
Was thinking of HDFC and also Ebix since I have them nearby. Any other option is also welcome.

Get a Global NiYo card which is issued by DCB.

It has no markup charges, adjusts forex rate as per VISA currency exchange rate, easy to load money on the go and adjusts forex charge when the transaction gets settled.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rst89 (Post 4749258)
Get a Global NiYo card which is issued by DCB.

It has no markup charges, adjusts forex rate as per VISA currency exchange rate, easy to load money on the go and adjusts forex charge when the transaction gets settled.


+1. I have a NiYo card and find it very convenient for foreign travel. It's a prepaid card and not a credit card. So you top up your money in Indian rupees and spend in your preferred foreign country. The amount is debited from your card as per the rate on that particular day.

Advantages:-
1. Control the card with an app.
2. No starting and yearly fees.
3. Deactivate the card immediately online or on app if it is lost/ stolen.
4. No need to carry multiple Forex cards.
5. No worries of bill payment like credit card. 0% mark up fees for foreign currency.
6. You have nothing to do with DCB bank.
7. OTP required, same as other cards.
8. Withdraw money in local currency in any foreign country.
9. Some good offers. Eg. 15% off on shopping on Cliq. 10% cashback on travel booking on booking.com. 20% off on Spa in Four Fountains Spa and O2 Spa.

Disadvantages:-
1. No name on card. The card is delivered on the spot by the executive who collects the documents. So your name is not there on the card.
2. Validity only for 3 years.

I have to make a large value online USD transaction in the range of 4000USD. I have always used my Yes first exclusive credit card which charges me 1.75% transaction value + GST which I think is too much. I have an option to send the fund via international fund transfer but I don't want to visit a bank branch at this time.
I was going through my wallet and found a Axis Bank multicurrency forex card which I had got during my last US trip. I got a confirmation from my bank that I can reload it online free of charge.
My question is, can I use this card for online payments to a US merchant while I am located in India? Is the service charge to load the card really free or do they make up for it by charging an unfavourable exchange rate which is hidden?
Thanks in advance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nagr22 (Post 4850763)
I have to make a large value online USD transaction in the range of 4000USD.

You can try out this website : https://www.fxretail.co.in/#/login

Here is the RBI Notification regarding the same : https://www.rbi.org.in/Scripts/Notif...d=11597&Mode=0

I haven't used this personally nor have researched much (since I don't have similar transactions) but you may check this out! If it is decent, you could also share your experience. I'll make a note of it in the future.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharktale (Post 4850767)
You can try out this website : https://www.fxretail.co.in/#/login

If it is decent, you could also share your experience. I'll make a note of it in the future.

Thanks for sharing sharktale. I went through those links and what I understood is that it is a currency trading platform which offers better exchange rates to retail users who wish to buy forex and take delivery.
My requirement is to send the money to a merchant (to be specific, to a university) who currently accepts credit/debit cards via payment gateway or through bank transfer.
Since they are accepting credit cards, will they accept prepaid forex card as well? Will it be cheaper to pay by forex card than to use my credit card which charges 1.75% transaction fee? If they do accept forex card, is it legal to use it while I am still in India? I do not want to get into some government's radar for money laundering lol:

Quote:

Originally Posted by nagr22 (Post 4850820)
Thanks for sharing sharktale. I went through those links and what I understood is that it is a currency trading platform which offers better exchange rates to retail users who wish to buy forex and take delivery.
My requirement is to send the money to a merchant (to be specific, to a university)

Since you'll be paying to your university in USD, you will need to BUY the USD from the Bank first, and then make the payment to the University.

I had used the SWIFT mechanism (via Netbanking) to pay my university deposit. Paid a $25 SWIFT transaction fee and Forex was converted at "TT outward remittance rate" of my bank (HDFC). AFAIK, one isn't charged a commission via SWIFT. I had compared it to Credit Card payment, but found SWIFT to be a much cheaper alternative.

Creating a new Forex Card to pay the deposit right now isn't suggestive IMO. You can pay the deposit now via Netbanking, and then research in deep regarding FX Cards and their benefits before buying a Forex Card for long term use.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharktale (Post 4850767)
You can try out this website : https://www.fxretail.co.in/#/login

Any further details in this. This may be useful tool for 1000s of NRIs who send USD every month to India. This will definitely help customers in getting better fx rates than banks/agents. I couldn't find much details online, and I doubt if local bank branches (HDFC or ICICI or any PSB) have enough knowledge on this.

Looks like Banks are willfully not promoting this else their customers would stop using wire transfers or third party money transfer vendors etc. All banks' websites have very little info on this platform except for one liners on the landing page and thats it. If somehow we face any technical issues in order execution or cash settlement etc, I fear if we will get any assistance in such cases.

Also not sure how to fund this trading account with USD currency, so that I can just sell for INR at some favorable limit. Also not sure how many 'traders' are on the platform already. I guess I just have to register and try for myself.

I have a question which seems borderline illegal in some countries, but let me see if someone can clarify.


I am in EU currently whereas most of my older savings are in India which now I plan to bring over to EU for a property purchase.

Now, while discussions with my Indian bank are underway, I thought if I could get a couple of my Indian friend's around me in Europe to lend me some local currency (via bank transfers of course), I could at the same time, transfer the equivalent INR amount via my Indian bank to their Indian bank.
I was told that this is called 'hawala'.


Is it? (money does not leave the respective countries in my case and it involves only two parties - me and my friend)

Quote:

Originally Posted by S_U_N (Post 4920723)
I was told that this is called 'hawala'.


Is it? (money does not leave the respective countries in my case and it involves only two parties - me and my friend)

That’s correct. Its hawala and indeed is illegal in a lot of countries. For small amounts it’s ok but avoid if it’s for a substantial amount as you mentioned property purchase.

I assume you already explored remitting through wire transfer apps like TransferWise or Instarem? Normally their fee is nominal since the working way is similar to hawala i.e. money doesn’t leave the shores. But they are approved by authorities & need bank accounts in both countries, so are legal. Limit is upto 1mn GBP IIRC.

Personally I have always used these only to remit money to India from different countries while working there, so not sure if the reverse flow is as flawless but internet suggests so. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoumenD (Post 4920727)
I assume you already explored remitting through wire transfer apps like TransferWise or Instarem? Normally their fee is nominal since the working way is similar to hawala i.e. money doesn’t leave the shores. But they are approved by authorities & need bank accounts in both countries, so are legal. Limit is upto 1mn GBP IIRC.

I highly recommend Transferwise. A UK Bank will charge 30 pounds + miserable exchange rate + 3 days to transfer. Overall, to transfer around Rs 7 Lakhs, I saved neared 300 pounds via Transferwise who made the payment in less than a day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoumenD (Post 4920727)
That’s correct. Its hawala and indeed is illegal in a lot of countries. For small amounts it’s ok but avoid if it’s for a substantial amount as you mentioned property purchase.

I assume you already explored remitting through wire transfer apps like TransferWise or Instarem? Normally their fee is nominal since the working way is similar to hawala i.e. money doesn’t leave the shores. But they are approved by authorities & need bank accounts in both countries, so are legal. Limit is upto 1mn GBP IIRC.

Personally I have always used these only to remit money to India from different countries while working there, so not sure if the reverse flow is as flawless but internet suggests so. :)


Thank you.
So, I understand that 'hawala' as such is not illegal.
In my example, the money is also getting transferred via bank accounts - there is no cash dealing and also there is no third-party involved.

Transferwise does not allow for more than 6.5 lac outward. Secondly I do not have the currency I need with Transferwise. It seems this is due to laws which do not allow me to send more than 7.5 lac as outward remittance - unless I do more paperwork (Form 15CA/ CB etc.) though that is not the biggest challenge.

I was not aware of Instarem (thanks for sharing!)
I explored that and see that I don't have the needed currency there too. But if I do a transaction to EUR, then on a figure of 30 lac INR, I get 34115 Euro, with roughly around 420 Euro as the 'overhead'. I will try to compare this with bank rates now.

@Ajmat: I use transferwise too - but that is for sending money to India. For some reason, it is more challenging to get money out of the country in India.

Quote:

Originally Posted by S_U_N (Post 4921004)
Transferwise does not allow for more than 6.5 lac outward.

Yes, this is due to a new law effective 1st October where TCS @ 5% is to be collected if any individual remits over 6,5 Lac after 1st October unless it's TDS Paid income, which unfortunately is tricky for Banks to implement.

The best way is to speak to your Bank in India where you have the money. Usually, you will get preferential rates of the value is over Rs 2 lac or have some relationship with Bank. It's not uncommon to get a rate of Xe.com + 20-50 Paise and Rs 1000-1500 as SWIFT charges.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbanator (Post 4921024)
Yes, this is due to a new law effective 1st October where TCS @ 5% is to be collected if any individual remits over 6,5 Lac after 1st October unless it's TDS Paid income, which unfortunately is tricky for Banks to implement.

The Transferwise limit has been there for a long time. It has nothing to do with the TCS.


Quote:

The best way is to speak to your Bank in India where you have the money. Usually, you will get preferential rates of the value is over Rs 2 lac or have some relationship with Bank. It's not uncommon to get a rate of Xe.com + 20-50 Paise and Rs 1000-1500 as SWIFT charges.
Yes. Tried that and they gave me a 10 paise discount. I am trying to talk to other banks in parallel as I get more understanding of legality of 'hawala'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by S_U_N (Post 4921058)
The Transferwise limit has been there for a long time. It has nothing to do with the TCS.

Ok, I was not aware. This is what they have mentioned on their webpage though.


The Forex Thread-image_20201031_200835.png


Quote:

I am trying to talk to other banks in parallel as I get more understanding of legality of 'hawala'.
There is no legality, it's forbidden at-least for Indian authorities. EU laws, I am not aware, they may not be bothered how it comes as long as you can prove it's from a valid source.

Your best bet will be the Bank where you have an account. Talk to the right people and it should be done.

I had some dirhams cash with me and wanted to exchange to INR, this is the first time i am doing something like this. Would like to know the documents I will have to carry with me do the exchange. Can anybody suggest me some reliable foreign exchange services in Pune?


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