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Old 28th November 2019, 11:33   #1
sgm
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Default Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

First of all a big Thank You to GTO for accepting my request for membership

I have been an avid T-BHP follower for the past 15 years. Recently I got a new C220D and I have run into some unpleasant experiences and I seek the expert opinion from the team members. I would greatly benefit if someone has gone through a similar experience.

A brief background on cars/bike at home:
We are a family with two kids aged 10 and 6. We and our in-laws stay together, so it is a big family of 6 members, let me call them mom and dad as they are likes my own parents. We needed two cars at home after we started staying together from 2008. About 5 years back, my wife had to shift to driving when office stopped giving bus facility, so the cars increased to 3 finally. We tend to keep vehicles for a really long time, especially my dad has used 10year old used Corollas for another 10years when he was abroad. He has been using Corollas for past 35+ years.
Ford Ikon : 2005-2017, sold it around 92k mark on Odo
Toyota Corolla (top end 2005 model): Bought in 2008, still at home, need to renew FC by 2020 Feb-Mar
Maruti Celerio AMT : 2014 Ė present
Corolla Altis VL Automatic : 2017 Ė present (Corolla family, so Octavia was finally dropped from plan)
Mercedes C220D : Nov 2019
Bikes:
Bajaj Caliber : 2000 Ė 2001 (Gifted to my father when I got a CBZ)
Hero Honda CBZ : 2001-present (renewed FC in 2016)

Now Iím creating this thread about our newest addition and which has turned my routine life upside down. I will create a follow up writing on why I got C220D and what were the choices in the final list. C220D was based on what met our requirements of a few specific creature comforts.
Now I'm in some trouble. I need some advice here. I booked the car just before Diwali and I was promised a delivery around 5th Nov, soon after the busy festival season. The car arrived the dealer yard towards October end. The car was registered on Nov 4th. Our SA went on leave on Nov 5th to celebrate his birthday, so we changed our plans to 6th though we would miss to take a cake for him on his birthday. He informs over Whatsapp that he has fallen sick, so we change the date to Nov8th, the day both our kids were born. We liked the idea of another member joining us on the same day. We had informed that we wonít be going to the main showroom rather we would pick the car from the sales office. All our test drives and meeting had happened at the sales office.

Delivery goof ups
On Friday morning I received a call from the backup SA and I confirm that we would reach by 4pm. He promises to be there by 2pm with the car. We reach there around 4:30pm and neither the car, nor the SA was present there. He reaches around 5pm and says that car should reach in 30min. He goes ahead and finishes the delivery of an E class kept ready in the deliver area. Children were getting tired after long day of school. They started running around in the showroom, started small pranks & fights and we were getting tired. By 6:30 the staff started leaving and it was getting dark. Around 7:30, the truck reaches and to my dismay it was not our car. The SA rushes to me to signal that the car is there. It was a black C220D instead of our white car, and he didnít even know that. My son got super excited to see a non-white after our white Corollas, though it was short-lived. SA makes a few calls and confirms that it would arrive soon. So finally around 8pm the car arrives, we complete the delivery process by 8:30. The next surprise was that the number plate was not picked up where as the black C220D which arrived before ours came with the number that too registered a day or two after ours. I explained to the SA that it is not that the number plate was not ready but someone has forgotten to send it along with the documents. He promises to deliver them the next day. We thank everyone, give our sweet box and decide to start back. I finally picked the number plate on Sunday after a few reminders. Out of the 5 deliveries that I have taken, this turns out to the least pleasant one.
I believe that due to the last day stop-gap arrangement of a new SA for delivery, he would have been underprepared and I give benefit of doubt to the dealer, but the dealer had 3-4 days to assign someone not overloaded. My experience until the delivery was the best at Merc, compared to all their other German Rival showrooms. This is the first time that my family has joined me for any car purchase and they had a nice experience except for the delivery process.

Insurance goof up
I received a hard copy of the insurance at the time of delivery and everything looked fine. I contacted ICICI, my insurance agency, to send a soft copy from their side, and I get a free upgrade from C class to E class. I forwarded the soft copy to dealer and asked them to get it fixed. Last week I received another softcopy from ICICI after dealer follow-up and E is corrected to C but model changed from correct one to a wrong one. Ouch, another mistake !!

First failure
I start the car, move a few feet forward and stop for family members to enter and I hear a grinding noise from brake and a slight movement while in brake hold mode. I ignore this and started from the showroom. A few meters and we are at a signal and I apply brake-hold and it gets engaged. I notice that about 15s later, there is grinding noise, brakes get automatically released, the car moves 3-4 inches and again stops automatically. This repeats after 10-15 seconds. We start as it turns Green but before crossing, the signal turns Red, I apply brake-hold. The engine stop-start kicks in this time, so engine turns off. Now in another about 30sec, engine fires again as the AC was ON, the car moves about Ĺ a foot and stops automatically. Now Iím extra careful at signals, turn the car to Neutral instead of drive and donít engage Brake-hold to reach home safely. I reported this on the same day night to SA and contacted MB helpline on Saturday, on 9th Nov. I was given a number of the dealer support network and I contacted them. I got a call from one of the technical person with a promise to visit me soon. Nothing happens till Monday the 11th and after repeated calls, on 13th Nov the car was diagnosed and fault codes were found in Electronic braking systems. The car was picked up on Friday, 15th Nov, and it took a week to come back (Nov 21st) after replacing the ECU.
The dealer is assuring that the PDI was done correctly and the issue was not there till delivery. I agreed that it just happened by chance giving another benefit of doubt.

Second failure
I used it again for 3 more days without trouble, and then on Nov 25th Monday evening, it started giving ABS warning/error. I shared the screen shots with the CRM. When the warning is ON, brake hold, eco start/stop etc won't work at all. The issue suddenly disappeared on Tuesday morning while waiting at a signal. The car was again picked up again at noon, 26th Nov. Till Wednesday afternoon, the technical team didnít have any idea about the issue. Yesterday evening I was given an update that the same part has failed again.

I have gone through various reviews and have not seen anything like this reported by T-BHP members on a brand new car. May be mine is one of the rare cases. Now I'm wondering if I should take this issue to MB India or sort this out with the help of the dealer. The brakes work fine when manually engaged in normal driving and start/stop traffic. I need some advice here. Should I listen to the sweet talk of the dealer? Should I get any official wording from MB India about their support for the repeated failure of the same part in a new car? I love the car so much that I don't want to create any negative vibe which will affect my ownership experience. I just want a fair conclusion and a happy ending. Though I feel that MB has given me a car with faulty parts, the dealer also is not competent enough to diagnose the issue. Looks like, they need a few days each time to find the issue. Today being Nov 28th, and being registered on 4th Nov, I have admired the car only for 4 days without trouble. More than half of the days, the car has been with the dealer. I donít know when it is going to come back to us now. I get no updates from the dealer, I make sure that I give a call in the morning and evening. If I donít get a response, I call the higher ups. Iím forced to follow up, plan my day for car drop or pick up or diagnose etc, so I have lost my timing flexibility and these cause lot of inconveniences

I would love to hear from the fellow experienced members.

Once again, thank you to all the members for making this forum an amazing place for the Indian automotive space.
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Old 28th November 2019, 13:04   #2
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

At this moment, please put all these down in a letter, attach any supporting evidence such as job cards, and send it to MB, copy the dealer. Send it by registered post and keep the acknowledgement safe.

It could just be a bad unit, bad luck. But in case it turns out to be something else, or the dealer isn't able to fix it properly, something in writing will help.

It will also put pressure on the dealer to get the core issue resolved.
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Old 28th November 2019, 13:33   #3
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Hopefully the car is not an old stock which was lying in stockyard for long. Check for any physical damages/repair work done on the car. Also if possible get in touch with mechanics to see any parts were replaced before handing over to you. Service Advisers are generally smart enough to mask all these. If these aspects are good, its just sheer bad luck.
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Old 28th November 2019, 13:38   #4
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

take a very good mechanic who has a dealer level OBD scan tool, pay him well and have him evaluate the car to check what faults lie within. Only then will you have a clear picture of what is going on and how deep is the doo-doo you are in.
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Old 28th November 2019, 14:00   #5
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgm View Post
I would love to hear from the fellow experienced members.
Hi sgm, welcome to the forum! First of all, congratulations on the new acquisition & compliments on the lovely garage collection you've maintained.

Sorry to hear about the issues you've had to face so far. Hopefully they'll get sorted for good now.

As for the delay in identifying issue - its actually quite commonplace. In case of such tricky items in electronic / software components, the dealership workshops rarely have fully trained staff. They rely on a small number of trained technicians directly available from MB (or any brand) factory as professional services groups (just like in IT ccompanies). They do rounds on select days at workshops & diagnose. Thats why it takes time to identify issues.

Sure you can write to MB, but let me tell you - you must remain patient. The dealership or MB don't really have much to loose here. You'll need to be accomodative & patient with these guys. Make friend at the workshop if you can. Insist on sticking around with the car when they diagnose & witness what error they catch.

If the errors are getting generated the ECM may not necessarily be faulty. It might be the sensors or actual modules like ABS that are causing the errors. Replacing the ECM has become a standard "first trial attempt" of all car workshops from Maruti to MB off late.

I don't yet think you have got a lemon. And you don't start thinking so too just yet. These seem fixable issues for now. Just check the VIN and find when this car was made. Its afterthought but still, just to be at peace.

Last edited by Reinhard : 28th November 2019 at 14:02.
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Old 28th November 2019, 14:52   #6
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgm View Post
I need some advice here. Should I listen to the sweet talk of the dealer? Should I get any official wording from MB India about their support for the repeated failure of the same part in a new car?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
Sure you can write to MB, but let me tell you - you must remain patient. The dealership or MB don't really have much to loose here. You'll need to be accomodative & patient with these guys. Make friend at the workshop if you can. Insist on sticking around with the car when they diagnose & witness what error they catch.
A part failing on a new car itself should trigger alarm bells. The same part failing twice is unacceptable. Especially, one that controls the braking system. MB *has* to be informed at the earliest. While the dealership may be co-operating and doing their best to resolve this issue, it is time for MB to step in and explain why it failed, and why it failed again. What if it is not this part, but something else altogether.

Not only will this lead to a detailed diagnosis, it will also buffer you from any possible associated future breakdowns for this part. Given your SA's support, loop him in but inform MB right away.

Last edited by libranof1987 : 28th November 2019 at 14:55.
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Old 28th November 2019, 14:54   #7
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Quote:
Originally Posted by libranof1987 View Post
A part failing on a new car itself should trigger alarm bells. The same part failing twice is unacceptable.
Yes, that's why I also feel he should visually check the diagnosis. I suspect the diagnosis itself was wrong and they have replaced something as more of a trial & error in the first place.
Even with MB he needs to be patient is what I have advised. MB is not going to bring a magic wand & fix the car as well as the probably incompetent service engineers.

Last edited by Eddy : 28th November 2019 at 15:22. Reason: Quoted post deleted
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Old 28th November 2019, 16:22   #8
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Quote:
Originally Posted by honeybee View Post
At this moment, please put all these down in a letter, attach any supporting evidence such as job cards, and send it to MB, copy the dealer. Send it by registered post and keep the acknowledgement safe.

It could just be a bad unit, bad luck. But in case it turns out to be something else, or the dealer isn't able to fix it properly, something in writing will help.

It will also put pressure on the dealer to get the core issue resolved.
Thanks honeybee.

I have been personally visited by a team from dealer and they have assured that they have taken all the required help from MB India on this. Today, the car was visited by MB experts from Pune, and they will investigate on the failure of a replaced part.

I'm at peace now and I trust them the way they have handled everything.
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Old 28th November 2019, 16:54   #9
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Seems to be an issue with your vehicles speed sensor most likely.
Similar issue happened in our F30 3 series - where even the speed limiter stopped working along with ABS and other functions that rely on it.

That being said, there are common niggles with the C Class which you should get used to:

1) Rattles: sunroof, steering / dashboard, trunk (due to space saver I am guessing)

2) Squeaky Brakes: Some cars have this issue where brakes squeak / squeal a lot and it gets a little annoying. There is a slight grinding noise as well at times when lightly applying the brakes in say moving traffic at low speeds.

3) High rate of wear & tear - brake pads at around 15 - 20,000kms

4) Parking Sensors on occasion beep randomly when there is no one around, happens mostly in standstill traffic.

5) The wood finish on the interiors are prone to light scratches, so take care.

6) The gray colour in particular seems to pick up a lot of swirls! My car has been detailed once every 4-6 months and there is just no getting rid of them!

I should also throw in a note that routine maintenance is a little on the higher side compared to other Germans, and in our case - reliability hasn't been stellar on our Sept. 2016 C220d.
The following has been replaced / repaired since we got the car, 17K kms ago:

1) Front Passenger Seatbelt sensor (Jan 2017 @ 2,000kms)
2) Sunroof rattles (Sept 2017 along with service @ 4,500kms)
3) Rear Brake Pads (Sept 2018 @ 10,000kms) - a little too early IMHO
4) Secondary Battery Capacitor (March 2019 @ 13,000kms)
5) Driver's side window switch (March 2019)
6) Motor for the sunroof shade + shade fabric (Sept 2019 @ 16,000kms)
7) Steering Wheel Logo discoloured (same as above)
8) Passenger Window Switch (same as above)

Now that the car is out of warranty, it seems I need to send it back again for the following issues:
1) Squeaky Steering (happened once and went away - need to see if it is back)
2) Driver's side front passenger window switch has stopped working
3) Sunroof & Dashboard rattles

Globally, according to some reviews - Mercedes niggles are back with a lot of new vehicles facing niggles compared to competition (BMW being on the better side of the spectrum).

That being said, the car is absolutely fantastic barring these niggles.
The suspension is the right mix of stiffness for our conditions, the interiors feel superb and are a really nice place to be in on the way back home from work, the steering & brakes are a delight, visbility & ergonomics are spot on in ways BMW can only dream about, etc.

Congrats on your buy - and try getting MB to throw in a discounted Extended warranty package.
I didn't opt for it because it seemed ridiculously priced when I inquired, but maybe you may have some luck.

Last edited by lamborghini : 28th November 2019 at 16:56.
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Old 28th November 2019, 18:34   #10
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Default re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Dear members,
Your advises have helped to be calmer from being calm I got a personal visit from dealer, I was assured that MBIL is looking into this repeated failure of the same part. The dealers support gives a lot of peace of mind. I'm an optimist, so I believe that, something that was bound to fail after warranty has failed now to save me from the trouble later on. The car will be ready in a few days, when the part arrives.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrideRed View Post
Hopefully the car is not an old stock which was lying in stockyard for long.
Thank you PrideRed
Based on the VIN number, this was manufactured in April 2019. I think this should be fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker View Post
take a very good mechanic who has a dealer level OBD scan tool, pay him well and have him evaluate the car to check what faults lie within. Only then will you have a clear picture of what is going on and how deep is the doo-doo you are in.
Thanks lurker. I was present at the time of first time scanning and the errors were related to ESP. This is what I saw on the screen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
Hi sgm, welcome to the forum! First of all, congratulations on the new acquisition & compliments on the lovely garage collection you've maintained.
Thank you Reinhard for the welcome and compliments. I'm very patient and now I understand that these are complicated systems and need time to root cause. The dealer was delaying any update because they were taking help from MBIL. This is what I understand now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by libranof1987 View Post
A part failing on a new car itself should trigger alarm bells. The same part failing twice is unacceptable. Especially, one that controls the braking system. MB *has* to be informed at the earliest. While the dealership may be co-operating and doing their best to resolve this issue, it is time for MB to step in and explain why it failed, and why it failed again. What if it is not this part, but something else altogether.
.
Thanks libranof1987.
I was assured that MB person visited the service centre today and MB India wants to check the failed part for further root causing. The dealer has raised this to the right levels as the same part has failed within a week again. I understand that some failures are new to them also, so they could not give me any update for a day and waited for a confirmation from MB India.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lamborghini View Post
Seems to be an issue with your vehicles speed sensor most likely.
Similar issue happened in our F30 3 series - where even the speed limiter stopped working along with ABS and other functions that rely on it.
Thanks a lot lamborghini for sharing your experience, this helps me to understand the regular issues which are not a safety concern but good to fix for a comfortable drive.
From many of the posts here I understand that C class is a bit more expensive to maintain compared to a 3 series. I was actually waiting for 3 series arrival but switched to C due to a few misses. I will write on those after a month of ownership.

Last edited by Sheel : 28th November 2019 at 18:44. Reason: Please quote ONLY the relevant bits of a post. Thanks.
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Old 29th November 2019, 10:14   #11
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Default Re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Thanks for sharing! Sucks to have problems in a new car, but I hope the dealer sorts it out & you can begin enjoying your new Benz.

Am sending a link of your thread to Mercedes India so that the company can look into it .
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Old 29th November 2019, 11:07   #12
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Default Re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Its a bit of a downer when your new car gives trouble, even more so if it is a Merc.
I hope your problem is quickly resolved.

I too think a wheelspeed sensor is to blame. Its an easy fix.

Apparently the last coupling of the speed sensor does not like pressure-washers or over-enthusiastic car wash boys.
A bit of moisture there causes a lot of other systems to go into limp mode.
Although, I have heard of this being a problem only in German cars.

Never heard of a Maruti or Toyota throw this tantrum.


I wonder how home grown ABS equipped 4x4 SUVs with water wading credentials deal with this problem.

Last edited by KMT : 29th November 2019 at 11:32.
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Old 29th November 2019, 12:13   #13
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Originally Posted by sgm View Post
Now I’m creating this thread about our newest addition and which has turned my routine life upside down.
I would raise hell personally. This is unacceptable for any car (or product really), first, second or third hand doesn't matter, and the fact that you would have spent a cool 50 L makes it doubly egregious.

I would personally,

(1) Tweet this to both MB India and their global ID

(2) Call their customer care if any

(3) Use the contact us form to escalate

A brief Google search takes me to their India specific grievance page,

https://www.mercedes-benz.co.in/pass...redressal.html

I would straight up call them, email all email ID's given here.

They have a nodal officer listed as well,

https://www.mercedes-benz.co.in/pass...icer-link.html

I would add this email id as well.

Mind you this is not overkill, you paid for a service and a product and it is unacceptable that it is not working.

I have done this with many service providers (am always polite though, so please don't get the wrong impression), Hilton, Renault (a repeated engine issue on my father in law's car was not resolved by the dealer for 2 months and when I escalated it was done in 2 days + a complementary full tank of diesel was given as compensation AND their region head personally came with the car and apologised) and now am fighting my own battle with Kia (for a minor issue compared to yours)

Simple, if you had paid even Rs 100 short, would they have delivered the car to you? No right, so why should you or any customer put up with such sub par service.

Last edited by vb-san : 29th November 2019 at 13:02. Reason: Mod Note:Please quote ONLY the relevant bits of a post. Quoting a full, long post inconveniences our mobile readers. Thanks!
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Old 29th November 2019, 14:44   #14
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The composure shown by you is god-level! Especially with the way MB has handled this customer relationship!

Any petrol head here would have managed this very differently. I personally would have been very upset, as initial days with a car determine what kind of relationship will you have with the car in long ter (if it reached long term).

Hoping to take yoga sessions from you in soon!
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Old 29th November 2019, 14:56   #15
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Default Re: Problems in my brand new Mercedes C220d

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgm View Post
The car arrived the dealer yard towards October end.
Sorry to hear about your experience, can you share who the dealer is pls.
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