[vsrikkanth]

After about 12k kms on my Kia Carnival, I experienced steering shake and shudder, which I immediately reported to the ASC in Bangalore. According to the ASC, the front rotors/discs were warped and all brake pads were worn out. The ASC, after a long and hard fight, agreed to reimburse the front discs on goodwill, while I shouldered the brake pads expense. Post this replacement I have driven about 4k kms and at least for now, I have not faced the issue again.

I have to confess here that I have been quite an aggressive driver. After this disc warp incident I have become a more sedate driver to ensure I don't face this issue again.

I need advice from BHPians whether this issue is due to:

1. Aggressive driving and hard braking from high triple digit speeds generating excessive heat leading to warping. The FWD configuration is probably putting significant stress on the front wheels/discs...

Or

2. Quality issues with the discs/pads and if yes, how to deal with this issue with Kia in future.

Or

3. Combination of both

[Kosfactor]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

1. Aggressive driving and hard braking from high triple digit speeds generating excessive heat leading to warping. The FWD configuration is probably putting significant stress on the front wheels/discs...

Every time you come to a full bore stop from high speeds, use the hand brake / parking brake to keep the car stationary. Avoid holding down the brake pedal so that the discs cool off without being clamped on part of its surface by the brake pad as the vehicle is waiting for a signal to turn green for instance. Of course as the disc thins out, more susceptible for being warped, brake dust is mostly the disc itself than the pad - that is a clue. Heavy AT vehicles can wear out the brakes within 15K itself.

Not many would have come across the perfect conditions for this to happen , I have experienced this on a diesel Corolla which for the lack of timely spare availability was running on a bit worn discs, not the most pleasant thing while you are trying to stop the vehicle.

[Duckdoc]

Sorry to be a killjoy, but those speeds are truly frightening, especially at night on our highways.

As to your queries, the following threads would be helpful:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/road-...t-driving.html (Guidelines & Tips for Safe NIGHT Driving)


https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/ownin...e-driving.html (ARTICLE: Mechanical Empathy | Preserving the Car While Driving)

Also, suggest to look at the Accidents in India section. This would pour cold water over any overenthusiastic driving.

[vishy76]

My advice to you (apart from toning down on your driving style) is to avoid sudden braking at the last moment. If you know you have to come to a stop eventually, anticipate the distance and gradually start applying the brakes beforehand. It seems you are holding off braking till the very last moment and suddenly jamming them on. This cycle will lead to sudden heat build up in the rotors (in repeated cycles) and will eventually warp them.

Another thing is to allow them to cool off. If you do follow what is written in the first para, you won't even need to to do this to be honest. The key as I said is a predictable and gradual braking style. I know it's easier said than done at the speeds you have mentioned, but you will have to practice it to keep the rotors in good shape and show them some mercy. Any driver who is ruthless enough on the brakes can warp the best of rotors. Your driving style is conducive to this phenomenon.

You will also benefit with more predictable braking behaviour and less brake fade which I am sure you would be experiencing currently.

[Mr.Boss]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

Quality issues with the discs/pads

If that is the case, it should not happen on both sides. Even if we suspect a particular batch to be defective, cars from similar manufacturing date should face the same issue.

Hope this clarifies.

[Indian2003]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

I need advice from BHPians whether this issue is due to:

1. Aggressive driving and hard braking from high triple digit speeds generating excessive heat leading to warping.

Or

2. Quality issues with the discs/pads and if yes, how to deal with this issue with Kia in future.
Combination of both

If you have to brake at those speeds, the best brake discs and pads wont help you. You need racing brake discs and pads.

You should stay off the roads if you drive like that.

[SchrödingersCar]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

I have to confess here that I have been quite an aggressive driver - Example: I drove from Bangalore to Hyderabad in straight 5.5 hours (10 pm to 3 30 am)... After this disc warp incident I have become a more sedate driver to ensure I don't face this issue again.

I would not call it aggressive. I would call it reckless and irresponsible.

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

I need advice from BHPians whether this issue is due to:

Better to stay off the road than drive like this.

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

1. Aggressive driving and hard braking from high triple digit speeds generating excessive heat leading to warping. The FWD configuration is probably putting significant stress on the front wheels/discs...

Or

2. Quality issues with the discs/pads and if yes, how to deal with this issue with Kia in future.

Or

3. Combination of both

Driving at those speeds puts you and others in grave danger, specially in India. Such high speeds on a heavy vehicle, with late braking is a recipe for disaster. You should thank Kia for their goodwill but I am sure they may ask you for a refund if they see this thread.

[SenPai_GTi]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

1. Aggressive driving

Or

2. Quality issues with the discs

Ignoring your driving style (as other members have already advised you on that) warping of disc brakes is partly a quality issue and partly your fault. But solely blaming you for the wear and warp of the brakes is not justifiable. We all know the driving style of Innova taxi's which unlike KIA's all discs have only front discs. I have not heard one incident from any taxi driver about disc warping. Yes, they have replaced brake pads at intervals less than the normal ones, but never replaced a disc that early.

This is partly KIA's quality issue and for the most part, your driving style issue. You should know that Carnival is the first iteration of KIA's MPV in India and therefore they do not have as much of a local R&D experience as the Toyota's. Hence you should avoid rough driving or even rough road speeding if possible.

[Kosfactor]

Originally Posted by SenPai_GTi

We all know the driving style of Innova taxi's which unlike KIA's all discs have only front discs. I have not heard one incident from any taxi driver about disc warping.

There is a lot of difference between rash driving in normal highway speeds and Carnival speed - which is much higher than what OP has quoted on his post by the way, this is a fast vehicle by all means and a lot heavier too.

[vsrikkanth]

Thanks for all your comments. I have realized that my adrenalin and want for higher speeds is more to blame than the quality issue.. I have already changed my driving style, due to which I have started seeing 9kmpl FE even in city conditions with such a heavy vehicle.. I will try to become a seasoned driver going forward....

[GTsunny]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

Thanks for all your comments.

Please do not be disheartened by any comments. Please take them positively. Everyone wants you to enjoy your ride, at the same time they want you to be careful so you don’t put your life and anyone else’s life in danger.

Also, please keep us posted on the long term ownership review of your luxury limousine. A friend of mine, he was looking to upgrade and this may be one of the options he had in mind.

Cheers

[Mr.Boss]

Originally Posted by SenPai_GTi

This is partly KIA's quality issue

Do you mind explaining this with some facts and figures? How many such concerns were already reported?

[kiku007]

That's one hell of a stress testing outcome!

KIA should actually talk to you to understand how you managed to achieve this so they can improve their component testing procedures and I'm not kidding!

That's one hell of a powerful van. Take care and drive safe man!

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by vsrikkanth

I have already changed my driving style, due to which I have started seeing 9kmpl FE even in city conditions with such a heavy vehicle.. I will try to become a seasoned driver going forward....

This more than answers everyone's concern about over speeding and application of brakes to checkmate the speed due to oncoming obstacles. Luckily you have been safe for 12 K kms, else rear end hits by trailing vehicles, due to sudden braking and the resulting whiplash injuries, are a cause of grave concern.

Our roads including expressways are never cool with high speeds and traffic indiscipline by other traffic users including drivers and pedestrians put us in a spot. Untethered cattle, stray animals and poultry are other sources of nuisance.

A good driver needs to be always on the defensive and more predictable for other traffic users.

[vsrikkanth]

Mod note: Back to back posts, please use Multi Quote [Quote +] instead. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Mr.Boss

Do you mind explaining this with some facts and figures? How many such concerns were already reported?

I did find one more owner reporting disc and brake pad issues almost every 1000kms. He is not a demanding driver like me but his reporting of the issue looks too bad to believe it to be a quality issue....

Originally Posted by kiku007

That's one hell of a stress testing outcome!

KIA should actually talk to you to understand how you managed to achieve this so they can improve their component testing procedures and I'm not kidding!

That's one hell of a powerful van. Take care and drive safe man!

I did honestly confess my driving style to the service advisor who assessed my truck... What surprised both of us is that the disc was fine at 9k kms with the same driving style (recorded by the same Ass during 3rd service) and something went wrong in the next 3k. The ASS in Bangalore was very helpful and they were convinced that even with my driving style the disc should not have failed so early which is why they later reimbursed the cost of the discs 15 days after the replacement was done...

Originally Posted by GTsunny

Pl do not be disheartened by any comments. Pl take them positively. Everyone wants you to enjoy your ride, at the same time they want you to be careful so you don’t put your life and anyone else’s life in danger.

Also, pl keep us posted on the long-term ownership review of your luxury limousine. A friend of mine, he was looking to upgrade and this may be one of the options he had in mind.

Cheers

I haven't written any long-term ownership report yet since I am not capable of writing long, articulate reviews that BHPians write. But honestly, the Carnival is one hell of a beast I love to keep driving all day. Until now, I have not experienced any issue other than the disc warping, which I now feel is more of my problem than Kia's.

Pros
1. Great interiors, I would any day sacrifice a bit of Toyota's reliability for this quality of interiors.
2. Refined engine that is in service for about 15 yrs globally- should be fairly reliable..I am not the kind expecting 10 lacs on the odometer. Max 2 lacs is enough with Supreme comfort.
3. Good enough GC, even with my driving style my truck survived most bad roads - but we are just 2 adults and 2 kids, so that's definitely not the acid test.
4. Space - It's a house on wheels. I once loaded my truck with 6 large check-in bags, 2 cycles, 4 water cans, one baby cradle, 2 traditional wet grinding stones e.t.c.
5. 220 v socket is super useful. it helped me work from anywhere when I was on a long trip last year.
6. I get 9kmpl FE in the city and I get 12.7 kmpl max FE on the highway if I drive at night. during the day I get a max FE of 11.5 kmpl on the highway.
7. With my aggressive driving in the past I got 8kmpl on the highway, in the city, I am never aggressive, the truck achieved that much quite immediately after delivery.
8. It may be a van but there is no denying the fact that it has a great road presence and other drivers do make way when they notice the huge truck.

Cons

1. Coming to cons, the single biggest con is the high price of spares, possibly due to CKD route - imported spares. Example: One mirror costs 20k, front brake discs(pair costs 13k), or maybe all vehicles in this segment cost so much...

2. Kia ASS are clueless about this vehicle. They check with the plant, write to Kia about every problem since this vehicle is new in India.

3. Even as a 40 lac vehicle owner, we have to go through the service experience of a car maker who sells Sonet and Seltos alongside a 40 lac car. Little to no premium service experience, more so since they always assume it's the chauffeur waiting for the service, not the owner himself as is in my case.