Team-BHP > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 28th July 2021, 21:29   #16
BHPian
 
ant_vas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: bangalore
Posts: 343
Thanked: 443 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Hijacking the thread to share my dzire's starting problem.

When i press the start button, the car cranks but the engine doesn't start. The starter motor keeps trying to start the engine and usually it take some 20-30 seconds.

This issue is very inconsistent. cold starts or starting the car after running for some time doesn't make any difference. Some days i experience this issue several times in-spite of running the car for a good amount of time, where as other days the car starts without a hint of this issue.

Initially it was suspected that the battery was weak and was replaced. Then i had a rat bite to one of the wires connecting to the engine, that was also fixed. Pressing the brake really hard while trying to start reduces the time required for the engine to start by few seconds.

The following has been done:
- Battery replaced
- wireless key fob battery replaced
- All Wiring checked
- No engine check light ever came up
- ECU scanned for any error codes - none found.

The garage kept the car for almost a week and couldn't figure whats the issue was. They advised me to take it to a bigger service station to have it checked, but haven't been able to do that yet.

I am just wondering what might be the issue here and plan to drop the car at a bigger service station to get this issue addressed once and for all. Any pointers ?
ant_vas is offline  
Old 29th July 2021, 10:08   #17
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pune
Posts: 192
Thanked: 291 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by ant_vas View Post
When i press the start button, the car cranks but the engine doesn't start. The starter motor keeps trying to start the engine and usually it take some 20-30 seconds.
If the starter motor cranks the engine normally, I don't think the battery could've been the culprit. Assuming yours is DZire (petrol), did you ever gave a try starting the car with A pedal pressed a little bit (at least when the car won't start)?
If that solves the problem, I think you can look at the IAC valve.

Otherwise you can look at the usual things such as spark plugs and the ignition coil, etc.
pkulkarni.2106 is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 29th July 2021, 10:46   #18
BHPian
 
ant_vas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: bangalore
Posts: 343
Thanked: 443 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
If the starter motor cranks the engine normally, I don't think the battery could've been the culprit. Assuming yours is DZire (petrol), did you ever gave a try starting the car with A pedal pressed a little bit (at least when the car won't start)?
If that solves the problem, I think you can look at the IAC valve.

Otherwise you can look at the usual things such as spark plugs and the ignition coil, etc.
Yes mine is a Dzire ZXi+AGS model. I haven't tried using the A pedal, will certainly give it a go and see if it makes any difference. the last time i left the car in the garage they did check the spark plugs. Not sure if they did a good job as their first diagnostic was battery and i replaced it based on their word.
ant_vas is offline  
Old 29th July 2021, 22:58   #19
BHPian
 
stallmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 126
Thanked: 573 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by ant_vas View Post
I am just wondering what might be the issue here and plan to drop the car at a bigger service station to get this issue addressed once and for all. Any pointers ?
Check the fuel delivery system, everything from pump, fuel filter, to injectors. Definitely a fuel issue.
stallmaster is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 30th July 2021, 09:47   #20
BHPian
 
scorpian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: GOA
Posts: 648
Thanked: 685 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

A petrol car not starting would be affected by five major components malfunctioning.
1)Not enough juice to crank
2)Not a good spark form the plugs or ignitors.
3)Fuel related function being compromised such as fuel injectors being clogged/dirty/dirty fuel/water in fuel etc.
4)Dirty throttle body with dirty IAC valve etc
5)Clogged air filter.

I would check first the battery, if ok then check the plugs and ignitors if found ok then replace fuel filter and dump a bottle of injector cleaner along with some clean fuel and run the car in the higher rpm range at highway speeds.
While at it , it would be a good idea to give the throttle body a good clean with some good old petrol.
And ofcourse replace the air filter if clogged, they are cheap and makes sense to replace rather then clean them.

Let us know please by keeping this thread updated.
Regards,
Manoj
scorpian is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 31st July 2021, 19:24   #21
BHPian
 
ant_vas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: bangalore
Posts: 343
Thanked: 443 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

The car has been starting normally but still there was no way for me to know when the starting issue would crop up again, I took my car to a trusted local mechanic. He tried starting the car several times and every time it started normally. He did a good physical examination of the engine compartment, underside by raising it on the stilts. But the car would just act normally.

he hooked up the scanner and no errors were found. He also listed the usual suspects: fuel line, fuel delivery system, compression etc. but said without seeing the issue himself he won't be able to start checking for the problem.

He advice me to get the car back if the issue is seen few times a day. Since then the car showed the issue only twice: yesterday once and today once. So its kind of become infrequent.
ant_vas is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 31st July 2021, 19:47   #22
BHPian
 
stallmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 126
Thanked: 573 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by ant_vas View Post
He advice me to get the car back if the issue is seen few times a day. Since then the car showed the issue only twice: yesterday once and today once. So its kind of become infrequent.
Use a fuel system cleaner from STP or any other brand and check if the problem persists.
stallmaster is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 5th August 2021, 20:47   #23
BHPian
 
ant_vas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: bangalore
Posts: 343
Thanked: 443 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Use a fuel system cleaner from STP or any other brand and check if the problem persists.
have added the STP today to the full tank of petrol. wasn't able to drive much, just couple of kilometers after that. Hope fully i will start seeing some change in the starting issue soon.
ant_vas is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 6th August 2021, 20:01   #24
BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: trivandrum
Posts: 478
Thanked: 284 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Is there a possibility that the starter motor pinion getting stuck with the fly wheel at times?
sureshkishore is offline  
Old 7th August 2021, 02:42   #25
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Delhi
Posts: 22
Thanked: 146 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_shimla View Post
Dear Team Members

I decided to reach out to you all here in order to discuss a strange issue with my 2005 Maruti Alto LX. Sometimes the car refuses to start after being driven and the engine check light starts glowing. No matter how many times you turn the key it refuses to buzz and there is no activity with the starter motor. The car does fire up when given a push in the second or third gear, the engine light at this time keeps glowing which goes away after a few hours/days.

....

Looking forward to your inputs.
We need further inputs from you to properly diagnose the problem. I'm writing a few questions based on the assumption that the engine is not turning over when you hold the key in IGN position. That is, you hear no starting noise.

1. Do you hear any clicking noise when you rotate and hold the key in IGN position?
2. Does the stereo turn off when you hold the key in IGN position?
3. Do the headlights dim slightly when you hold the key in IGN position?

The answer to these questions will help everyone reading the thread to find the remedy faster.

I have had the same problem of the starter not turning over the engine but it was found that the lockset was not engaging the contacts. Spraying contact cleaner into the key hole fixed the issue. Sometimes it won't start but pressing into the keyhole while turning the key does the trick. But since, you have got the entire lockset changed, I doubt that the problem lies there.

I suggest the following remedies:
1. Replace all the engine related relays from the fuse box in the engine bay. There's a chance that the contacts inside the relay have corroded or burnt, making improper contact. Relays cannot be serviced and need to replaced but it's external contacts can be dirty. Remove the relay and spray some contact cleaner(WD40 will do) on to the contacts. Use a brush to clean the contacts. Insert the old relay in and out to rub the meeting surfaces. Spray the cleaner once more to wash loose dirty away. Since you are at it, clean the rest of the contacts for the fuses too.
2. The negative terminal at the battery splits into two wires on Alto wiring harness.One goes to the body on the left side of the car and the other to the engine. Remove both of them. Clean with a metal brush or 320 grit sandpaper. Spray contact cleaner on the surfaces and tighten then back. Check the wires for any cracks in the insulation or burn marks. There's a possibility that the wire must have burnt and there's only few stands left to carry the current. You can replace it easily if needed. Part number: 33850M79F00. Might cost you around 200₹.

I suggest you do these two regardless of the source of the problem. Preventive maintenance won't hurt on an old car. You will then have to wait for the problem to pop up again. If it does then you can try the following.
1. Clean the contacts at the starter motor assembly.
2. Clean the contacts at the lockset connector. You will have to remove the steering wheel and the the cover behind the wheel to access the connector.

Be sure to disconnect the negative terminal of the battery whenever you are working on electronics of the car.

I'm skeptical about a part failure since you have got replaced the lockset and there distributer and also got the starter serviced. Would like to hear from you how the starter was serviced. Were the brushes replaced?

As far as I know, if the immobilizer is causing problems it will pop up a code in the system and the symptom would be the engine turning over but not starting.
PratyushJaya is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 10th August 2021, 20:13   #26
BHPian
 
ant_vas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: bangalore
Posts: 343
Thanked: 443 Times
Default Re: A strange starting problem with my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by ant_vas View Post
have added the STP today to the full tank of petrol. wasn't able to drive much, just couple of kilometers after that. Hope fully i will start seeing some change in the starting issue soon.
drove the car for over 100KM's since adding STP and i haven't see the problem reoccur even once since adding STP.

Guess it was some blocked injector which was causing the issue with my car.

Thank you all for valuable suggestions to help me get this issue sorted.
ant_vas is offline  
Reply

Most Viewed
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Copyright 2000 - 2021, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks