[varkey]

We were driving from Bangalore to Kochi in our 2012 Etios Liva Diesel last weekend and sometime after Salem, the charging system malfunction indicator lit up. At the time I mis-took the warning as the battery had a low charge (the battery is a bit aged from what I remember) and assumed this would correct itself during the trip so I didn't give enough seriousness to it. I even went past the Toyota ASC (Anaamalais) at Erode which was on the highway.

Sometime after that nearing Avinashi, the EPS (Electric Power Steering) warning lit up. Then I finally realised something is seriously wrong and I could feel the heavy steering and even the horn was only making a feeble sound. I immediately turned off the AC, ICE, 12V phone charger etc. I asked my wife to check the owner's manual to better understand what the warning lights meant. With a better understanding it was clear that the charging system is not functioning, the battery is not getting charged and all electrical systems are draining the battery directly and is now almost depleted. I knew if I turned off the car it wouldn't start again.

So we parked the car idling on the side and started checking for a Toyota ASC. Erode ASC was around 50km behind, Tiruppur ASC around 25 KM away, Coimbatore ACS around 50km. In that situation, we decided to go for Coimbatore ASC thinking that it was in the direction of travel and less of a deviation. Also felt that being a bigger city hence a bigger service center, would have all required parts. In retrospect, we could have opted for the Tiruppur ASC as that was in effect less of a deviation, and we'd have avoided the traffic going through Coimbatore city.

I also called the Coimbatore ASC saying that we noticed the malfunction indicator, and advised us to turn off all electrical equipment and drive straight to a service center without stopping anywhere. We arrived at the ASC at 1 PM and the lunch break had just started. Even then someone attended us (the same person who spoke to me on the phone) and I explained the issue. He checked the malfunction indicator and said that it could be an issue with the alternator. Since the lunch break had just started, he turned off the car, knowing that it wouldn't self start, cause it would be an hour before they can start the work.

The car had all our luggage and our pet kitten. Took our backpacks and kitten inside and we waited inside the customer lounge. Around 1:50 PM or so, the SA arrived and he checked the vehicle again and opened a job sheet with an initial estimate of Rs 732 + tax (only labour). Shortly after couple of technicians arrived and tried to push the vehicle to start, but it didn't work and they ended up pushing it all the way to the service bay.

Now coming to the main part, the ASC diagnosed the issue to a worn out alternator regulator. While inspecting they also noticed cracks on the alternator belt, hence advised changing it. The SA showed me the parts, the brush (?) had indeed worn out and there were cracks on the belt. The car has 173000 km on the odo, I do not know when these components were last changed as my father used to use the car till about 157k kms.

REGULATOR ASSY, GENE - 27700-0N020 - Rs 4382
BELT, V-RIBBED - 90916-02674 - Rs 2204
Labour - Rs 863
Total Rs 7,500

(The labour also included Rs 173 for sanitisation, they never did anything inside the car, when asked to the SA, he said its a mandatory charge, I let it go)

I authorised the repair but I was bit un-easy with the prices cause these appeared to be on the expensive side. I did ask the SA if there is any other child/sub part which can be changed for the regulator as only the brush (the term they used) part appeared to be worn out. But he assured me these are the right parts.

By 3:45 or so, the car was ready. They charged the battery as well enough to start, although asked me to keep the car running for 30 min or so to get it properly charged.

Coming to my questions

1. Is there a child or sub part for replacing just the brush? I noticed P/N 27370-0Y100 but not sure if it is compatible.
2. I noticed that there are two part numbers for V-Ribbed Belt. 90916-02674 for Etios Liva Diesel which costs Rs 2204 and 90916-02690 for Etios Liva Petrol which costs Rs 544. Is it normal for the v-belt for the diesel engine to cost 4x more?
3. Was I over-charged in anyway? (Considering this was done at an ASC, I understand that the part prices maybe on the higher side)

Except for this doubt of being over-charged, I must say that Anaamalais Toyota, Coimbatore did an exceptional job in taking care of this emergency during our trip.

[vigsom]

Originally Posted by varkey

I noticed that there are two part numbers for V-Ribbed Belt. 90916-02674 for Etios Liva Diesel which costs Rs 2204 and 90916-02690 for Etios Liva Petrol which costs Rs 544. Is it normal for the v-belt for the diesel engine to cost 4x more?
3. Was I over-charged in anyway? (Considering this was done at an ASC, I understand that the part prices maybe on the higher side)

You haven't been overcharged. Yes, an FNG Electrician could have done it for much less, but then you wouldn't have got OE parts. An aftermarket drive belt would have cost you typically ₹500, but as per the on line parts catalog, you've been billed just right for the OE parts - no issues here. Just to give you an example - a Suzuki Genuine drive belt for my car would cost ₹2500 against a typical ₹600 for an aftermarket Contitech.The belt on your car doesn't seem to have been replaced ever, so it was good that it was done.

We arrived at the ASC at 1 PM and the lunch break had just started. Even then someone attended us. By 3:45 or so, the car was ready. Except for this doubt of being over-charged, I must say that Anaamalais Toyota, Coimbatore did an exceptional job in taking care of this emergency during our trip.

You arrived at the ASC at 1 at lunch, someone attended to you rather than make you wait. A job card was opened at 1:50pm, and job was over at 3:45pm. I'd say that was fantastic service plus the labour charge was a mere ₹863. That's Q service !

[sagarpadaki]

I do not think you were overcharged. The right parts have been replaced and labor is also reasonable considering you got it done at TASS.

To your question, is the serpentine belt for diesel 4x the cost of that of petrol? I think this cost difference between the petrol and diesel belt is because of the country of origin. The belts imported from Japan or any other country will cost more. Maybe the belt for petrol engines is made locally. There are cheaper aftermarket options available from reputed companies but you did not have a choice given your situation. In my opinion, you should not think too much about the expensive belt since the original one has served well for this long without snapping. You would be in bigger trouble if the belt snapped since the water pump is also driven with this belt.

Typically, the rubber belts are to be replaced once in 7-8 years to be on safer side. The old belt had good amount of cracks.

[condor]

To chip-in: agree about not being overcharged.

The Alternator on the Safari costs about 24k. A recent overhaul put me back by about 10k at the T.A.S.S

You have the OE parts, and the list looks straight forward.

[parsh]

Absolutely agree with vigsom and others above.

You were indeed treated to a Q service!

As we also experienced for emergency service on way in travels, they do try give priority service to those in travel, although we never faced any issues as such, but made stops just for some checks to be done for surety, which they promptly attended on urgency basis.

If it gives you any solace, here is the Belt Replacement Labor and Part charges for Diesel Innova. The Belt is supposed to be changed at every 1,50,000 kms. There is proper warning for changing and it needs to be reset in firmware once done.





How did your belt go to this extent if quite questionable. I believe it was not replaced at proper interval and the belt warning done away with. The belt looks done for. It seems terribly dangerous to have driven to this condition.

However, I would have contested the additional Rs 173/- charge, totally unnecessary.

Rest assured, the parts and charges seem very well controlled. Additionally, you have the peace of mind with the quality of long lasting OEM Toyota parts.

[Raghu M]

I don't think you have been overcharged. On the contrary, you have been very lucky to get that kind of treatment and priority. Try getting into an M&M service without an appointment and you will be scrambling all over to have someone attend to you in the first place. I think Toyota has done a fantastic job here. You had your family, baggage and a kitten. I would be very satisfied and happy if I got back on my journey after facing such an issue. I think you can leave that worry aside altogether!

[shankarbn]

3-4k for a belt change is extremely reasonable. FNG would have probably charged you more too.

[turbowhistle]

This sounds very reasonable to me, especially given the turnaround time and it did not cause a lot of deviation from your schedule.

[MBond007]

Looks absolutely reasonable to me. I recently faced a similar alternator issue. There was just some carbon deposit in my Linea Tjet alternator which was removed and I was charged Rs 5400 for that by a well known FNG in Noida. There was nothing I could do but cough up the amount and make peace with it. And the turnaround time was more than 5 hours.

[igemini]

I don't think you have been over charged. The prices looks reasonable and more than the money or anything, the service team saved a lot of your time and attended you well, more importantly in a timely manner. They definitely deserve an applause for that. The situation could've been horribly bad if the service center didn't attend you in a timely manner or if they played tricks. Think about the financial impact and mental burden that would have been caused in that scenario. Be assured that you have not been overcharged and even if it is, they still saved you from an unpleasant situation. Consider that as a token of appreciation.

[vmathews]

Dear BHPians,
Please note that whenever you are required to replace the Regulator (tech term is Automatic Voltage Regulator or AVR ) in your Alternator, please replace the Rectifier Assembly also.

The Regulator is usually is the first component to fail. This is usually due to the inadequate cooling arrangement within the confines of the Alternator. The manufacturer has already done the best they can with the considering the constraints of price and space, so no point blaming them.

A damaged regulator will in turn increase the load on the Rectifier Assembly and weaken the Diodes inside.

Should you only replace the Regulator, please be on the lookout for another Alternator failure in the near future, this time involving the Rectifier, which in turn will also damage your newly replaced Regulator.

IMHO it is always better to replace both Regulator and Rectifier at the same time, even though the Rectifier may be OK at that time. It will set you back by a couple of thousand bucks, but the next alternator failure will force you to replace both these resulting in time and money wasted.

There used to be a time when both were replaced at the same time. However, as customers started cribbing, the Garages started to replace the damaged part only, knowing fully well that you will be back sooner or later with a Total Electronics failure in your Alternator.

[vishy76]

Originally Posted by parsh

How did your belt go to this extent if quite questionable. I believe it was not replaced at proper interval and the belt warning done away with. The belt looks done for. It seems terribly dangerous to have driven to this condition.

However, I would have contested the additional Rs 173/- charge, totally unnecessary.

Rest assured, the parts and charges seem very well controlled. Additionally, you have the peace of mind with the quality of long lasting OEM Toyota parts.

The belt which has been referred to here is the alternator belt. The alternator belt is responsible for driving the accessory system including the alternator, compressor and power steering pump (for cars with a hydraulic power steering setup).

The belt you are referring to is the timing belt. The timing belt synchronizes the rotation of the camshaft and the crankshaft such that the pistons don't hit the valves. This belt can cause havoc if it breaks due to obvious reasons. But an accessory belt breaking cannot directly lead to engine damage. At the most, it will cause the car to shut off if the battery looses charge and loss of air conditioning. On this note, I believe the 1.4 D4-D uses a timing chain which lasts the life of the engine. It doesn't use a belt.

[parsh]

Originally Posted by vishy76

The belt which has been referred to here is the alternator belt. The alternator belt is responsible for driving the accessory system including the alternator, compressor and power steering pump (for cars with a hydraulic power steering setup).

Thanks for getting out these points Vishy. And they are absolutely critical. Should be helpful for others to understand criticality of this belt.

1. The belt referred here is same. It is called Drive Belt.

2. The timing belt in my bill, just ignore for a moment, it is just for reference cost. Indeed it is timed to be replaced at 150000 kms as I said atleast for Diesel Innova. But Drive belt wear has to be checked and replaced as needed.

3. Ignore any accessory running due to Drive Belt like Alternator charging battery, Compressor running AC.

4. The single most important thing that this belt runs is the Water Pump responsible for cooling your engine. It is irrespective of the type of engine. Now imagine what happens if the belt goes in middle of anywhere and you drive the car irrespective. I had very detailed picture somewhere I am not able to find, else I would have attached herewith. Everybody, just don't take it lightly on the Drive Belt.

[joybhowmik]

A malfunctioning alternator is easily diagnosed at the start of the trip - by measuring terminal voltage on an idling engine. It should be a tad over 14 volts - if it's slipped below 14 - that's a warning sign.

V belt is a critical part - as parsh mentioned, one should check the condition and especially before starting a long journey where service centers may be few and far between.
On old belts, with engine turned off - look for cracks across the ribs, missing bits of the rib, pilling (accretion of rubber from rib to the grooves-observed with diesel engines mostly), glazed/shiny back side, rib separation. With the car started, listen for squeaks , chirping, grinding noise coming from the pulleys - that too is a sign of a V belt not in healthy condition.

IMHO - your predicament could have been avoided - but am sure this experience would have taught you more about the importance of pre-drive self-checks.