[BlackPearl]

I drive a car (Baleno) that has a direct shift gear, but today drove an accent with cable shift and quite liked it. My previous car was a Palio which had a cable shift and I liked it too. However when I started studying about this I found out that hardcore racers like direct shift over cable shift because of the feedback. This is very confusing as why any feedback is required during shifting. The smoother the shift the better it will be. In that case IMO cable shift makes better sense. I would like to know what the people in this forum like. Another question is - is there any difference in robustness and reliability between the two?

@Moderators - if this is a duplicate thread then please remove it.

[kuttapan]

What do you mean by direct shift? A shifter that has no linkages? Then I doubt baleno has one.

I know the 118NE came with one, but does any modern car have them, is it possible on a FWD car?

[BlackPearl]

I am not very sure about this. i may have stated something technically incorrect. But what I tried to state is that there is a distinct difference between the gears in an esteem and that in a Palio or an Accent. I have driven Palio, Accent, Swift and Lancer which seem to have a very smooth gearshift which I had heard is called cable shift whereas those in esteem, baleno, indica are of a different kind (maybe called rod-shift).

[1100D]

He is talking about Cable actuated/remote gear shift versus the lever being operated directly from the gearbox.

However trend is to use Short Shifters, that offer precise control, and right feedback.

[BlackPearl]

Originally Posted by 1100D

He is talking about Cable actuated/remote gear shift versus the lever being operated directly from the gearbox.

However trend is to use Short Shifters, that offer precise control, and right feedback.

@1100D - thanks for putting in proper technical terms. Now the question is what is meant by feedback and why is it needed?

[1100D]

Originally Posted by BlackPearl

@1100D - thanks for putting in proper technical terms. Now the question is what is meant by feedback and why is it needed?

I was trying to answer that when the session went kaput.

First recall driving your car. The "feedback" is the feel you get when you guide the lever to a certain slot and it appears that the gear lever has been pulled into slot by itself. In contrast to having you push it into position.

Racecars, make this "Khatak" sound of the gears meshing and can also be felt from the gearlever.

Now remote/cable actuated gearshift is used in certain daily driver applications where the placement of the gear lever linkage will not allow an ergonomic gearshift position. This is more prominent with same engine gearbox combinations on platform sharing.

A huge example can be the old ALL busses direct shifters versus the new Tata "on the cowl cable operated" shifters.

The Tata ones are maintenance trouble, and the old systems need the driver to bend back to change.

However, like I said, most Racers use a Direct link operated by a short shifter, which places the knob nearest to him and also offers feedback.

[Mpower]

IIRC Baleno is also a cable shift. All FWDs are

[BlackPearl]

Originally Posted by 1100D

I was trying to answer that when the session went kaput.

First recall driving your car. The "feedback" is the feel you get when you guide the lever to a certain slot and it appears that the gear lever has been pulled into slot by itself. In contrast to having you push it into position.

Racecars, make this "Khatak" sound of the gears meshing and can also be felt from the gearlever.

Now remote/cable actuated gearshift is used in certain daily driver applications where the placement of the gear lever linkage will not allow an ergonomic gearshift position. This is more prominent with same engine gearbox combinations on platform sharing.

A huge example can be the old ALL busses direct shifters versus the new Tata "on the cowl cable operated" shifters.

The Tata ones are maintenance trouble, and the old systems need the driver to bend back to change.

However, like I said, most Racers use a Direct link operated by a short shifter, which places the knob nearest to him and also offers feedback.

Ok, understood this... but still a few doubts - why does maruti give cable shift in Swift and direct shift in Esteem? Is one more costly than the other? My point is why do these cars differ when cable shift is clearly more appealing to the common man? one can easily feel the difference when one drives a lancer for example after driving a baleno.

[1100D]

Originally Posted by BlackPearl

Ok, understood this... but still a few doubts - why does maruti give cable shift in Swift and direct shift in Esteem? Is one more costly than the other? My point is why do these cars differ when cable shift is clearly more appealing to the common man? one can easily feel the difference when one drives a lancer for example after driving a baleno.

Thats the answer.

Originally Posted by 1100D

Now remote/cable actuated gearshift is used in certain daily driver applications where the placement of the gear lever linkage will not allow an ergonomic gearshift position. This is more prominent with same engine gearbox combinations on platform sharing.

Measure the distance from the Gearbox centerline on the esteem to the gearlever position. Then with the same distance see where the swift's gearlever would generally fall if it was direct linked. Now compare the throw on the Esteems stick to that on the Swifts, that will give you another idea. Most new cars have cable operation for daily applications. Very soon a shortshifter kit is available for the enthusiasts.

[1100D]

Originally Posted by Mpower

IIRC Baleno is also a cable shift. All FWDs are

Mechanical linkage vs cable linkage. In anycase shifting directly from top of the gearbox is not possible on FWD's.

[Rehaan]

In terms of feedback, from my limitied understanding, the direct connection provides more feedback in terms of shifting as well as vibrations. Also, when you accelerate and decelerate you feel the gear lever move (backwards and forwards) a bit...thats one way to tell.

cya
R

[JustStarted]

are Mechanical linkage gearboxes are more reliable and easy on maintenance ?

planning to buy i10 and a friend in service told me i10 gearbox is cable one (not like santro) so even there is small glitch full gearbox need to be opened

how true is it ? anything i should consider seriously ? guess all new cars comes with cable driven gearboxes.

Thanks

[jalsa777]

Originally Posted by Rehaan

In terms of feedback, from my limitied understanding, the direct connection provides more feedback in terms of shifting as well as vibrations. Also, when you accelerate and decelerate you feel the gear lever move (backwards and forwards) a bit...thats one way to tell.

cya
R

a wagon R gear shifter moves during acceleration and deceration.
But i dont think its a direct shifer.

Correct me if i am wrong

[mmmjgm]

Palio & the Accent/Santro have a cable shift mechanism, the esteem has linkages (rods connecting the gear shift to the gear box selector mechanism) &mostof the mahindra jeeps have a direct connection, the shifter yoke (part which goes into the gearbox) comes out of the gear box (into the cabin) to be the gear lever.

The 118NE had a direct link to the gear box, i.e. the gear lever went inside the gear box.

Direct = no linkages, - most authentic gear box feel.. (most of the times heavy due to mechanical leverages being low (couple/moments law)

Indirect by way of cables or linkages = the car designer can change the feel of the gear box,

All FWD have linkages , there is no possibility of the gear lever being connected to the gearbox like in Mahindra Jeeps. (trucks/busses etc excluding the volvo busses). Qualis has a direct link, I think Innova too has a direct link.
my 2 cents.

Regards
M M

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by mmmjgm

Qualis has a direct link, I think Innova too has a direct link.
my 2 cents.

Regards
M M

So that explains why the Qualis gearbox feels sweet to use(compared to other MUVs and old WagonR) and joy to slot into each gear.