How come Swift DDiS and Indica Vista have such soft clutch?

DCEite · 14th December 2008, 18:10

There used to be a saying that diesel cars have a very hard clutch which can be unforgiving during long drives.
But to my surprise, i didn't find the clutch of Swift DDiS, DZire DDiS and Indica Vista any harder than my 800/WagonR/Santro Zipplus/Alto.
Is it to do something with the clutch being hydraulic? Is that the case in both Swift and Vista but not in the other MJD - Palio MJD ? I find Palio's clutch heavy and truly Diesel car like.

Whats the secret

Jaggu · 14th December 2008, 21:51

Guess its due to hydraulic assist, but yes they are heavier compared to say Swift P :P

Vid6639 · 14th December 2008, 22:05

Are they hydraulic clutches? The swift P has a cable operated one IIRC.

phamilyman · 14th December 2008, 23:22

yeah, Jaggu has said it.

Thad E Ginathom · 14th December 2008, 23:47

I've heard people say that the Swift Diesel has a hard clutch: I have never found mine to be hard, just sort-of-normal

m-hawk · 15th December 2008, 01:28

Is it generalised that all hydraulic clutches are soft ?? What about my accord why is it so tight inspite of being hydraulic !! It s a real pain to hold it in traffic accord owner s can confirm that i am sure !!

Zappo · 15th December 2008, 01:34

Actually this is something I find very dicey. In the Indica V2 NA version the clutch is extremely easy. Its just like in any other car.

And yet in the Turbo DLG the clutch appears at least 5 times harder. It gives a pain in the shins if I have to work it continuously in heavy traffic. I asked TASS guys as well as a Tata engineer once about this difference. But I am not sure any of them knew why it is so.

greenhorn · 15th December 2008, 06:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zappo

Actually this is something I find very dicey. In the Indica V2 NA version the clutch is extremely easy. Its just like in any other car.

And yet in the Turbo DLG the clutch appears at least 5 times harder. It gives a pain in the shins if I have to work it continuously in heavy traffic. I asked TASS guys as well as a Tata engineer once about this difference. But I am not sure any of them knew why it is so.

is it ? I drove the NA indica only for a while in driving school , so dont remember much about it.
the turbo does have a bigger dia clutch. could that be the reason?

and we should ask bouncer about the clutch in the vista TDI

DCEite · 15th December 2008, 13:17

Forgot to add mHawk Scorpio to the list. Very easy clutch.

Ajaybiz · 15th December 2008, 13:48

Its just coz of using hydralic pressure to operate the clutch assemble rather than cable,
seen few bikes also to make the clutch operation easy with hydralic system.

ramie2400 · 15th December 2008, 13:50

Yesterday i was driving a friends 2months old indica diesel,i did not find the clutch as smooth as the petrol cars???but i found it was much smoother than the Sumo DX i used to own

absolutely no idea about the Swift DDiS as never drove one.

"Or might we are getting stronger day by day"

ramkya1 · 15th December 2008, 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCEite

Forgot to add mHawk Scorpio to the list. Very easy clutch.

Easy clutch? That's a spurprise !!!!!

In my CRDe, its pretty hard, on long drives and in city if I drive in thick traffic for long hours, gives me a pain in the knees. When I complain, the ASC does some tinkering but after a while its back to being hard, though it's hydrolic. Compared to my earlier car Ford Fusion and present Wagon R, working on the Scorp clutch is a pain.

So it's a surprise that it has improved all that much in the mHwak.

--Ramky
======

sanagg1 · 12th July 2009, 20:04

help from gurus needed
what is the experience on the clutch tightness in vista(TDI)?
how can we make a hard clutch soft?
thanks in advance

FourWheelDrift · 12th July 2009, 21:02

Generally speaking, all other things remaining constant; the higher the engine torque, the bigger the clutch required, and thus more the effort required to operate it (keeping foot travel constant).

Once this is understood, one can mitigate this by playing with leverage ratios (of the clutch pedal), orifice diameters (of clutch master cylinder and slave cylinder).

For the technically minded, one can browse "Light and Heavy Vehicle Technology by Malcolm Nunney" online : Light and heavy vehicle technology - Google Books

A nice primer at Exedy's site http://exedy.co.uk/techinfo/jtunerad.pdf

Cheers,

FourWheelDrift

.anshuman · 12th July 2009, 21:33

Softest of the lot - Punto.

14th December 2008, 18:10	#1
DCEite Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: NCR Posts: 3,418 Thanked: 2,570 Times	How come Swift DDiS and Indica Vista have such soft clutch? There used to be a saying that diesel cars have a very hard clutch which can be unforgiving during long drives. But to my surprise, i didn't find the clutch of Swift DDiS, DZire DDiS and Indica Vista any harder than my 800/WagonR/Santro Zipplus/Alto. Is it to do something with the clutch being hydraulic? Is that the case in both Swift and Vista but not in the other MJD - Palio MJD ? I find Palio's clutch heavy and truly Diesel car like. Whats the secret
	() Thanks

14th December 2008, 21:51	#2
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,907 Times	Guess its due to hydraulic assist, but yes they are heavier compared to say Swift P :P
	() Thanks

14th December 2008, 22:05	#3
Vid6639 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 17,730 Thanked: 43,483 Times View My Garage	Are they hydraulic clutches? The swift P has a cable operated one IIRC.
	() Thanks

14th December 2008, 23:22	#4
phamilyman Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 5,968 Thanked: 4,642 Times	yeah, Jaggu has said it.
	() Thanks

14th December 2008, 23:47	#5
Thad E Ginathom Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Chennai Posts: 11,005 Thanked: 26,446 Times	I've heard people say that the Swift Diesel has a hard clutch: I have never found mine to be hard, just sort-of-normal
	() Thanks

15th December 2008, 01:28	#6
m-hawk BHPian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: mumbai Posts: 218 Thanked: 9 Times	Is it generalised that all hydraulic clutches are soft ?? What about my accord why is it so tight inspite of being hydraulic !! It s a real pain to hold it in traffic accord owner s can confirm that i am sure !!
	() Thanks

15th December 2008, 01:34	#7
Zappo Team-BHP Support Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 5,922 Thanked: 2,699 Times	Actually this is something I find very dicey. In the Indica V2 NA version the clutch is extremely easy. Its just like in any other car. And yet in the Turbo DLG the clutch appears at least 5 times harder. It gives a pain in the shins if I have to work it continuously in heavy traffic. I asked TASS guys as well as a Tata engineer once about this difference. But I am not sure any of them knew why it is so.
	() Thanks

15th December 2008, 13:17	#9
DCEite Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: NCR Posts: 3,418 Thanked: 2,570 Times	Forgot to add mHawk Scorpio to the list. Very easy clutch.
	() Thanks

15th December 2008, 13:48	#10
Ajaybiz BANNED Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,440 Thanked: 320 Times View My Garage	Its just coz of using hydralic pressure to operate the clutch assemble rather than cable, seen few bikes also to make the clutch operation easy with hydralic system.
	() Thanks

15th December 2008, 13:50	#11
ramie2400 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,903 Thanked: 66 Times View My Garage	Yesterday i was driving a friends 2months old indica diesel,i did not find the clutch as smooth as the petrol cars???but i found it was much smoother than the Sumo DX i used to own absolutely no idea about the Swift DDiS as never drove one. "Or might we are getting stronger day by day"
	() Thanks

12th July 2009, 20:04	#13
sanagg1 BHPian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: HIMALYAS Posts: 279 Thanked: 6 Times	help from gurus needed what is the experience on the clutch tightness in vista(TDI)? how can we make a hard clutch soft? thanks in advance
	() Thanks

12th July 2009, 21:02	#14
FourWheelDrift BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mumbai/PNW Posts: 630 Thanked: 555 Times	Generally speaking, all other things remaining constant; the higher the engine torque, the bigger the clutch required, and thus more the effort required to operate it (keeping foot travel constant). Once this is understood, one can mitigate this by playing with leverage ratios (of the clutch pedal), orifice diameters (of clutch master cylinder and slave cylinder). For the technically minded, one can browse "Light and Heavy Vehicle Technology by Malcolm Nunney" online : Light and heavy vehicle technology - Google Books A nice primer at Exedy's site http://exedy.co.uk/techinfo/jtunerad.pdf Cheers, FourWheelDrift
	() Thanks

12th July 2009, 21:33	#15
.anshuman Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Good-Gaon Posts: 7,763 Thanked: 11,064 Times View My Garage	Softest of the lot - Punto.
	() Thanks