URGENT help needed: Ford Ikon issues

gaurav_diavolo · 6th May 2009, 19:04

Hello fellows......my Ikon 1.6 zxi 2005, got hit by a stone at high speed and the chamber (engine oil sump) got broken. The engine oil drained (rather sprayed out) and within 5-10 more seconds of my driving to get the car on the road side the engine sound changed (normal sound + grrrrr like a diesel vehicle). I did not start the car and got it towed to the ford service centre in Jaipur. There, the car was again started by the technician and it starts absolutely fine, just that small grrrr with the normal sound.

Now, to my surprise the technician told me 'engine most probably seize ho gaya hai, expect a mota kharcha of 1-1.5 lacs). Agar 'head' gaya hai to 50-60 hazar hee lagega, insurance sirf sump aur labour etc. ka milega, so be prepared. I was shocked and did not agree with him as my very good family friend and also a knowlegable guy about technical stuff in cars told that this is not a big deal as the car got run (no matter only for a few seconds) without engine oil, and hence once new engine oil is poured and new sump is placed, the sound should go. If not, then also some minor engine servicing of the bearings.....coz the engine is firing just fine, the car has not STOPPED. But Ford guys telling me about big kharcha and all that. Worse, my car is in the service station for the last 2 days and they are saying the engine specialist guy will attend your car after 2 more days. What is the issue guys, I do not wish to pay Ford Guys in lacs if they are not being genuine? Scared. Should I tow my car back....but to do what?

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silver_shadow · 6th May 2009, 20:45

i'm not an expert by any means, but i don't see how a modern IC engine (which is quite hardy) could seize and make a grating noise due to that seize in just a few seconds of oil loss.

but anyway, ask them to do a compression check first. i guess if it does require an engine job, then the first symptom would be low compression. there are a few ways to isolate what the cause of compression loss is once you do get it done.

idea1979 · 8th May 2009, 00:05

Oh. Really Sad. I just love Ford Ikon looks and feel. But *** keeps me away from buying. It is very Expensive and they are always ready to rip off.

Not sure about technicality, however , logically Ask them to give details and estimate of What to replace and Why?

Not to mention, dont give any green signal of work till you are satisfied with their reasons. Also consult your insurance guy about what is covered and what is not.

Last time when my Car was in workshop due to major accident, insurance guy indirectly helped me out, as service provider was more inclined to change most of parts (even not affected) just to increase the bill while insurance guy was trying to restore car with minimum claim. My job was to maintain job quality - a golden mean.

Make up your mind to spend some dedicated time in workshop and meeting managerial level staff to discuss things out.

Last time i have also managed to get discount on my bills (where insurance was not applicable). But al this before work start and stick to % of Bill amount instead of a value.

Hope that Helps.

nitrous · 8th May 2009, 02:19

Wasn't there a sump guard in the Ikon?

gaurav_diavolo · 9th May 2009, 20:39

No there wasn't a sump guard, there isnt any, all these parts are cheap, heavy price is to be paid for the engine opening and parts associated with it. Plus the insurance doesnt cover engine damage which takes place post accident, not in the accident. I hope they give me an estimate of 20-30 grands and the matter settles. The true value of car is 2-3 lacs and I intend to sell it off this year, feel sad if I have to pay in lacs for this repair work :(

MBG_Evo · 9th May 2009, 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by silver_shadow

...but anyway, ask them to do a compression check first. i guess if it does require an engine job, then the first symptom would be low compression. there are a few ways to isolate what the cause of compression loss is once you do get it done.

Excellent! This is your best answer. Get the oil sump fixed and ask them to do a complete oil/filter service. Next - Compression Test. You should be able to find the tester in the market for like 1200 Rupees or something if you wanna do it your self. This is will help you know if you have any damage with piston rings. See them do the compression test, im sure all the readings will be positive.

Best of luck and do let us know!

Mpower · 9th May 2009, 22:02

Similar thing happened to my friend in a Mazda3, except his is an aluminum casting sump and he hit the concrete block used for parking spots. Damage will depend on how much you drive after losing oil pressure.

His insurance paid so he got an engine rebuild, and you should do the same. Main things to check are crank bearings and oil pump and to a lesser extent piston+bore, cam bearings.

govigov · 10th May 2009, 02:49

get the sump replaced and pour some oil in it and fire it up. you mayneed to flush all fluids because of the dirt that might have gotten into it. other than that i dont see a need for opening up the engine.

vdiatech · 10th May 2009, 17:52

Yes, fix the sump, change the oil and compression test is the way to go. I absolutely agree.

Servicing a car which is not under warranty is the main source of income for an authorised dealer. They make scores of money on parts+labour etc. For warranty related work, their profits are minimised because they have to stick to the manufacturers reccomended labour time for specific jobs.

So, they are notorious in advising replacement of expensive parts when seldom required for non-warranty jobs.

6th May 2009, 19:04	#1
gaurav_diavolo BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Jaipur Posts: 148 Thanked: 91 Times	URGENT help needed: Ford Ikon issues Hello fellows......my Ikon 1.6 zxi 2005, got hit by a stone at high speed and the chamber (engine oil sump) got broken. The engine oil drained (rather sprayed out) and within 5-10 more seconds of my driving to get the car on the road side the engine sound changed (normal sound + grrrrr like a diesel vehicle). I did not start the car and got it towed to the ford service centre in Jaipur. There, the car was again started by the technician and it starts absolutely fine, just that small grrrr with the normal sound. Now, to my surprise the technician told me 'engine most probably seize ho gaya hai, expect a mota kharcha of 1-1.5 lacs). Agar 'head' gaya hai to 50-60 hazar hee lagega, insurance sirf sump aur labour etc. ka milega, so be prepared. I was shocked and did not agree with him as my very good family friend and also a knowlegable guy about technical stuff in cars told that this is not a big deal as the car got run (no matter only for a few seconds) without engine oil, and hence once new engine oil is poured and new sump is placed, the sound should go. If not, then also some minor engine servicing of the bearings.....coz the engine is firing just fine, the car has not STOPPED. But Ford guys telling me about big kharcha and all that. Worse, my car is in the service station for the last 2 days and they are saying the engine specialist guy will attend your car after 2 more days. What is the issue guys, I do not wish to pay Ford Guys in lacs if they are not being genuine? Scared. Should I tow my car back....but to do what? Note from the Team-BHP Support Team : Please take the time to use proper punctuation as per Team-BHP rules. Avoid...typing...like...this. Thanks. Also avoid typing in SMS\Slang language. We advise you to visit our board rules to get thoroughly acquainted with them before proceeding further. Thanks Last edited by Technocrat : 6th May 2009 at 19:32. Reason: see note in post
	() Thanks

6th May 2009, 20:45	#2
silver_shadow BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 366 Thanked: 3 Times	i'm not an expert by any means, but i don't see how a modern IC engine (which is quite hardy) could seize and make a grating noise due to that seize in just a few seconds of oil loss. but anyway, ask them to do a compression check first. i guess if it does require an engine job, then the first symptom would be low compression. there are a few ways to isolate what the cause of compression loss is once you do get it done.
	() Thanks

8th May 2009, 00:05	#3
idea1979 BANNED Join Date: May 2009 Location: Pune Posts: 234 Thanked: 0 Times	Oh. Really Sad. I just love Ford Ikon looks and feel. But *** keeps me away from buying. It is very Expensive and they are always ready to rip off. Not sure about technicality, however , logically Ask them to give details and estimate of What to replace and Why? Not to mention, dont give any green signal of work till you are satisfied with their reasons. Also consult your insurance guy about what is covered and what is not. Last time when my Car was in workshop due to major accident, insurance guy indirectly helped me out, as service provider was more inclined to change most of parts (even not affected) just to increase the bill while insurance guy was trying to restore car with minimum claim. My job was to maintain job quality - a golden mean. Make up your mind to spend some dedicated time in workshop and meeting managerial level staff to discuss things out. Last time i have also managed to get discount on my bills (where insurance was not applicable). But al this before work start and stick to % of Bill amount instead of a value. Hope that Helps.
	() Thanks

8th May 2009, 02:19	#4
nitrous Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: UAE/Lon/Madras Posts: 6,965 Thanked: 325 Times View My Garage	Wasn't there a sump guard in the Ikon?
	() Thanks

9th May 2009, 20:39	#5
gaurav_diavolo BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Jaipur Posts: 148 Thanked: 91 Times	No there wasn't a sump guard, there isnt any, all these parts are cheap, heavy price is to be paid for the engine opening and parts associated with it. Plus the insurance doesnt cover engine damage which takes place post accident, not in the accident. I hope they give me an estimate of 20-30 grands and the matter settles. The true value of car is 2-3 lacs and I intend to sell it off this year, feel sad if I have to pay in lacs for this repair work :(
	() Thanks

9th May 2009, 22:02	#7
Mpower Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 10,409 Thanked: 1,730 Times View My Garage	Similar thing happened to my friend in a Mazda3, except his is an aluminum casting sump and he hit the concrete block used for parking spots. Damage will depend on how much you drive after losing oil pressure. His insurance paid so he got an engine rebuild, and you should do the same. Main things to check are crank bearings and oil pump and to a lesser extent piston+bore, cam bearings.
	() Thanks

10th May 2009, 02:49	#8
govigov Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Cochin!!!!! Posts: 1,690 Thanked: 1,092 Times View My Garage	get the sump replaced and pour some oil in it and fire it up. you mayneed to flush all fluids because of the dirt that might have gotten into it. other than that i dont see a need for opening up the engine.
	() Thanks

10th May 2009, 17:52	#9
vdiatech BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 414 Thanked: 10 Times	Yes, fix the sump, change the oil and compression test is the way to go. I absolutely agree. Servicing a car which is not under warranty is the main source of income for an authorised dealer. They make scores of money on parts+labour etc. For warranty related work, their profits are minimised because they have to stick to the manufacturers reccomended labour time for specific jobs. So, they are notorious in advising replacement of expensive parts when seldom required for non-warranty jobs.
	() Thanks