[ringoism]

Originally Posted by akshay4587

The trick of driving in snow even in a 4WD without chains, is to not lose momentum, if you lose it, there is a fat chance that you will get stuck and if you lose traction, the snow below the Tyres quickly turns into ice making them spin freely without any movement.

Now to move forward, I had to ensure that I do not lose traction, else I would have got stuck as well.

Shifted to 2L and gently released the clutch, and I slowly inched forward and parked my thar ahead after finding a flat patch with less snow.

Hey, quite an adventure...

Not sure if you meant to say you shifted into 4Lo (you wrote 2L, which is only an option on slightly modded 3-lever Dana-Spicers, afaik!)...

To preface my thoughts/advice here:

Apart from a couple years' hiatus in South India, I've been driving in snow in hilly places since I got my driving permit in 1985... actually even before that on our (sloped) driveway, and always rode around in snow a lot with dad as a kid (mom refused to join our joy-rides); Also had a little time in the plow trucks of a friend who ran a snow-removal service and was careful to observe some of his techniques in really deep, heavy snow (which vs. powder is mostly what we get at hill-station altitudes in the Indian Himalayas). Personally our family never owned a 4x4 despite residing in the "snow-belt", and yet managed quite a bit of hill driving incl in "virgin" snow (sans salt/sand/dirt/ash/cinders added) with 2wd's over the years without ever getting seriously stuck. Though indeed there were a couple of harrowing experiences when we pushed the limits of our cars / tyres.

As you say, you don't want to lose traction, don't want to spin your wheels at any time (unless you're out doing power-drifts in a parking lot) especially whilst attempting to get going from a stop.

That said, 4-Low is not generally going to be a good choice in snowy conditions, actually can be counter-productive. Gives too much torque too suddenly, even when you're trying to release the clutch as slowly as possible - and right there, you've broken traction!

What I do when I get near my limits of traction in the really slippery stuff is actually leave it in high range (if you have a 4x4), and in fact forego 1st gear for starts, in favor of using 2nd or even 3rd... May sound contrary to logic, but in truth it really works. In this case DO NOT touch the accelerator unless absolutely necessary... Instead half-clutch at idle or just off-idle till you get rolling at a decent speed - may take ten seconds or more to release the clutch slowly enough to maintain grip and gain speed, but this, in my experience, is the best way to apply power super-gently. Same thing when approaching inclines... do NOT downshift as you would normally to get the engine into its more powerful range... you do not want power - if you have a turbo, absolutely must keep revs out of the boost range. As you say you want momentum. As such, I "short-shift" (upshift very early) when accelerating, and keep in a higher gear than usual when climbing. Normally this would be bad for a clutch and engine main bearings, but hey - sometimes you gotta do whatcha gotta do!

This worked for me/us on just about everything from old 1970's American RWD tanks (though those were automatics, which I do not prefer in snow) and MT 2wd pickups, Datsun Z cars (incl. turbo), old fwd Honda Civics, the 7-series BMW, Mitsubishi Starion turbo, etc... to our present Marshal 4x4... which does admirably well in the white stuff (I do have proper imported Blizzaks on it at present, but the old JK Trak-Tuff 6.00x16's were really something to rave about) - IF it will start in that cold!!!

Of course there are different types of snow, and no one tyre is best on all of them.

Also should note that limited-slip diffs (which a few of the aforementioned were equipped with) are a two-edged sword here - they DO help you move out in situations where one wheel is on a more slippery surface than the other... BUT they also tend to make rwd cars fishtail or go sideways (oversteer)... particularly if applying power in turns. Locking diffs are even worse in that regard. Many would argue that the best setup for snow is a 4x4 with open diffs... of course in the modern age we have AWD's with traction-control/ ESC, etc, which may help give the best of both, assuming they've also got the requisite ground clearance.

Having said all this, 8-10" is a far amount, and on big sheets of glare ice, well, without metal-studded winter tyres, all bets are off! Chains may push forward a bit better, but do not help at all for control there.

Hope this proves useful for someone...

And always remember: 4x4 / AWD are not miracle-workers... and sometimes it is just best to stay home in front of the fire (if you have one)...



-Eric

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by ringoism

Hey, quite an adventure...

Not sure if you meant to say you shifted into 4Lo (you wrote 2L, which is only an option on slightly modded 3-lever Dana-Spicers, afaik!)...



And always remember: 4x4 / AWD are not miracle-workers... and sometimes it is just best to stay home in front of the fire (if you have one)...



-Eric

Yes, I meant 2nd Gear and 4Low, however my thar has Lambda Manual Hubs, so I have this option of 2L too.
After having done a few snow drives now, I agree with the last part; the photos definitely look cool, however the drives like these are much cooler and freezing

Originally Posted by androdev

Wow, all that in a days work? Thoroughly enjoyed reading it and the photos are epic! I wish I get to live in that part of India for few years to explore such lovely landscape.

Yes, Blessed to be in this part, Snow is accessible, within a few hours.
Hope to see you someday here

Originally Posted by Ace F355

Awesome! You trully have the advantage of living in plains yet so close to the hills. While we do make our plans impromptu for snow drives too, ours are at least 2-3 days and can not be one day like the one in your post. Always great to see the Thar coping up with all that's thrown at it.



Naah, MTs in snow are the worst. I have done many drives with my BigHorn 764s and while they are absolutely fine in fresh snow (which is very much like sand to be honest), in a day old snow or with black ice patches, MTs are scary to drive. I haven't tried the new gen of MTs with better compound (BFG KM3s or Maxxis RAZRs etc) - however for snow I would always recommend good All Terrain rubber with severe snow rating.

However, having said this - nothing beats snow chains. A pair of snow chains can make the car tackle the situation to a great extent. Two pairs will make the car invincible (quite literally) on the icy roads.

I meant MT's are better in fresh snow only, On Ice, it's just the chains that work. Btw, It feels cold again, let's plan something together this time.
Two endeavour's 2.2 and 3.0.

[dadu]

Good tips from ringoism, but if you are in your 4x2 modern cars, Traction control can also help you wade through unless you encounter deep snow, which is a different situation to tackle altogether.

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by dadu

Good tips from ringoism, but if you are in your 4x2 modern cars, Traction control can also help you wade through unless you encounter deep snow, which is a different situation to tackle altogether.

Having driven an AWD in snow with Traction control, it barely makes any difference. When I didn't have any experience of driving in snow, I had a firm belief that ABS and Traction Control will make it very easy for any vehicle to tackle some snow, but that isn't the case.
There is no replacement for AWD/4WD

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by ringoism

Hope this proves useful for someone...

And always remember: 4x4 / AWD are not miracle-workers... and sometimes it is just best to stay home in front of the fire (if you have one)...

Attachment 2222927

-Eric

Fabulous tips. Really good to read and learn. Indeed driving in snow requires a lot of care and a good deal of common sense as well.
I like that comment about sitting at home in front of the fire unless unavoidable. Thats what most people who live in places with really heavy snowfall tend to do, unless they absolutely have to be out and about tending to their livestock or performing essential duties or similar. And in such cases its good to go in tandem with one more person in an equally capable or better vehicle.