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Hi to everybody,
With so much discussion happening on automatics and manual shifts, I found a useful article on DSG. Here it is

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/DSG-faq-VW-Audi.htm

When I moved to India, I switched from an automatic to a manual. Initially, I switched gears by looking at the speedometer, but then it came more naturally. Some people exclaim, "You are in 5th gear at 45 km/hr!!!," and all I could say is that it's the way the gearbox was setup for the Esteem Di.

I'm glad I've got a manual transmission because with the kind of brakes that come with a Maruti, downshifting while the AC is running is something that becomes a second nature when you reach for the brake pedal (you'll have to drive an old diesel Esteem through flood waters to know exactly what I mean).

If we have better quality cars in India, perhaps an automatic transmission would be the choice for people who don't care about getting 22 kmpl instead of 24 kmpl (pretty much all of us on this forum; it's mostly the taxis that try to get every bit of distance out of the fuel).

Sir, We've got world class cars out here in India. Are you willing to put your money for that is the question.

You could buy the Rolls Royce or a Porsche or a Ferrari in India now clap:

Modern automatic trannys are designed to be more efficient and quicker than manual cars.

While most of VAG shares the DSG 'box under different monikers like S-Tronic, PDK, etc. Mercedes is working on a DCT and it won't be long before it trickles down from the SLS to all the lesser Mercedes cars.

Ford has it on the Fiesta. You even find a similar system in the Mitsubishi EVO X.

Even the Japs are going the dual-clutch rout. It will take some time before manuals are completely eradicated - for the purpose of achieving enhanced efficiency and performance. But it will happen.

How?
It will be interesting to see some data from the regular cars (not sports cars which are designed for tracks).
I agree that the gap (in terms of FE and acceleration) between the two is reducing but I believe manuals are still ahead.

^^ DCT/DSG gearboxes are by design faster than manual transmissions since they have two clutches corresponding to different sets of gears (e.g. 1,3,5 and 2,4,6) and the upshifts/downshifts are practically seamless. Check here for more details.

In the non-luxury segments, only VW AG and now Ford offer these type of boxes. The rest are mostly torque convertors with the odd CVT tossed in.

Theory apart, can you post some figures for comparing?

I should have been more clear Guna, sorry. :)

The difference with respect to efficiency and performance is marginal. DTCs ensure that the highest gear is selected for sedate cruising thereby making sure that the engine runs in 'efficiency-mode' if you will.

The 'box pre-selects the clutch and gear accordingly, much faster than an average human being would. Two clutches help swag cogs seamlessly and also reduces lag between shifts. This not only reduces shift-times but also allows the driver to exploit the conditions, the steering and the abilities of the car while concentrating on cornering and braking.

I don't have real-world or published figures but I have read that the DSG has shaved off acceleration times in cars like the VW Golf GTI and the SEAT Leon Cupra. - Both of which by the way are popular and affordable hatchbacks.

The DSG does need improvement though. The 7-speed dry-clutch DSG 'box in the older Superbs were prone to failure. Also, from what I've read on other forums and blogs, it doesn't feel as tactile, involving or intuitive as it should have. Some say it isn't as fun as a manual, and some swear by it because it offers the best of both worlds. Basically, it all comes down to priorities. I would recommend a DSG if the car is a daily-driver, but NOT in a weekend car.

NOTE: Even though Porsche were the first to pioneer dual-clutch technology back in the '80s, the technology found its way into normal everyday cars (VWs) while Porsche continued to hone the technology in order to harness greater levels of power and torque. And they'd finally achieved it a few years ago.

Here is a back to back test of DSG vs Manual by Autocar UK

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRwfv...e_gdata_player

Edit: Another one from Fifth gear

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EdjE...e_gdata_player

Pulled the numbers from ACI, and yes DSGs are quicker then manuals!

0-100 kmph
Jetta 2.0 TDI A/T =10.02 secs
Jetta 2.0 TDI MT =10.92 secs

Laura 2.0 TDI A/T= 9.72 secs
Laura 2.0 TDI MT= 11.40 secs (I think this number is wrong. This seems to be for 1.9 TDI)

As a lot of posters have commented, erstwhile clearly distinguishing attributes like performance and fuel economy have now been blurred when it comes to choosing between a manual and an auto, so at the end of the day it boils down to what matters to you.

So... if you're looking for which is faster, my response would be - who cares?
At the end of the day whether a manual tranny or a slushbox is faster is irrelevant unless you're on a track. What matters is (a) your driving preference and (b) your driving circumstances.

If your driving preference is to feel more integrated with the car and to enjoy a more mechanical aspect of driving, get a manual. If your preference is comfort and convenience, get an auto.

Manuals are like old carburetor engines whereas automatics are like Fuel Injected engines.

The last decade has witnessed a splurge of Fuel Injected vehicles thanks to the tightening emission norms and the Pollution control board of India finally calling the shots for improvement in technology.

I am positive in another decade, India would have migrated to auto boxes :thumbs up

Correct em if I am wrong but I am of the opinion that no self respecting enthusiast will ever be seen driving an Auto Box.

Yes, cars like Bugatti Veyron and BMW M5 have DCT transmission. But DSG will be slow in case of downshifting 2 gears.
No the Laura manual has 110 bhp engine while the auto has 140 bhp engine. That explains the difference in timing.

You gotta drive one of the new gen cars with auto box to believe what it can do!

I had a similar view many years ago ;)