Ok. lets take GTO's reply pointwise.
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Originally Posted by GTO Rt, yes the engine oil forms a significant component of the service costs, but it is still a part of every service isn’t it? Why should I view that number as an exclusive and not as a part of the whole? Any car owner is going to look at the *total* service costs. And if a 10 lac car costs 7,000 - 9,000 to service each time (as in the case of this thread starter), it is simply not justifiable. |
I agree. You look at total cost. What I cannot find here is a break up of service costs for a Honda Accord or Civic. I don't own one, so cannot comment. From what I have seen, the costs of filters, brake pads, oil filters etc are basically on par, be it the Corolla, the Accord/Civic, the Optra or the Octavia.
The difference then would be solely the cost of the oil, which would be around Rs.2,000. So on average, the Skoda would cost Rs.2,000 more than one of the above cars to service, and no difference if the owner is an enthusiast and want the good stuff for his engine.
I would be obliged to see a few actual out of warranty servicing costs for the Accord/Civic, Corolla and Optra (parts cost, labour charge, tax etc, just as the thread starter has put up). I've heard figures of it being done for Rs.2000 or so. If so, I must say that is truly amazing. More power to them!
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Originally Posted by GTO Quick research shows me that VW doesn’t compulsorily require synthetic oil in their TDi cars everywhere they are sold. They simply have recommended grades…grades which some regular / semi-synthetic also meet. |
Links please. To the best of my knowledge Skoda / VW do indeed specify only synthetic oils for their diesels. Well, actually they have their own specification for oils, and I have yet to see a mineral oil that meets that specification. They specify a mineral oil only for top up if nothing else is available.
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Originally Posted by GTO If Skoda India truly cared about offering value to the customer, they would sell that cheaper oil officially and at a lower price (like Honda does). It’s also called adapting to local circumstances. |
Huh. You want Skoda India to turn the tide and get the parent company to approve the use of oils that do not meet the VW standards or cheaper mineral oils here. Would be great if it would happen, but I don't see it because...
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Originally Posted by GTO Mobil 1 doesn’t cost $20 / liter elsewhere in the world. |
Exactly! Its only here that we have the privilege of paying absurd prices for this stuff. Again I ask, do we blame VW/Skoda for this or Mobil or maybe our Govt. who taxes it? I don't know?
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Originally Posted by GTO Also, like someone mentioned, the service interval for a Canadian VW is 10000 miles / 16000 kilometers. So each liter of synthetic oil is used for a longer duration. |
umm. Again, VW/Skoda would be happy to provide this interval to us if we had roads and that wonderfuly clean driving environments like they do in Canada. Also this is clearly noted it your own thread in the Advice section is absurd. This is what You had to say in
This Advice thread: (ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil) Extended oil change intervals?: Even though most synthetic oil brands boast of extended oil change intervals, Team-BHP recommends that you still change your engine oil every 5,000 – 7,500 km. Indian driving conditions put a lot of stress on your engine with low average speeds, bumper-to-bumper traffic and harsh environmental conditions.
Skoda India recommends an interval of 7,500km. They, like any manufacturer would, like to err on the side of caution. Also, please note that Skoda only mention an oil change every 7,500 km. Not a full service. That is to be done every 15,000km.
The diesel fuel filter is to be drained every 15,000km and replaced every 30,000km.
The Air filter is to be cleaned every 15,000km and changed every 30,000km or 24 months.
(hahaha, are they kidding!).
Maybe those worried about the costs of changing these along with the oil change should follow exactly what Skoda India says and not what the dealers say (selfish interests to them you see).
Almost all manufacturers have a Hard use service interval and regular use interval. In India, its almost always the hard use interval which is adopted due to our conditions.
Again, I wait for one of the other car owners to tell us what is given in their manual. I'm sure it would be a mileage + time frame for a change.
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Originally Posted by GTO To car enthusiasts like you and me, the price differential between regular and synthetic oil may be justified. But to the other overwhelming majority of car owners, it simply isn’t. Primarily because the car functions just as well on regular oil too! The Octavia TDi engine aint no complex modern marvel; it’s a plain ol’ TDi that uses old school technology albeit very efficiently. Heck the Scorpio common-rail is more modern....can you imagine what would happen if Mahindra started charging 7,000 per service ONLY for the engine oil? Rural India would strike! |
GTO, CRD-i technology differs to direct injection yes. But it is the way the fuel is injected that is the difference, not the way the engine itself functions.
A CRDi engine can be made as well or as badly as any DI engine in terms of manufacturing tolerances, heat dissipation and basic design. The tighter the build tolerances, the better the oil has to perform from the moment you start the car (cold engine) to running is 45 degree heat.
Simply saying that a CRDi engine can run fine on x oil so a DI engine should have no excuse is an incorrect statement.
Also, the days of mineral oils in modern passenger cars are slowly coming to an end. Almost every car above a certain price bracket now comes with fully synthetic oils as OE. This is filtering down just like airbags and ABS did. Soon, even the equivalent of a M800 would run with 100% synthetic. Also, the price of synthetics would drop. Thats progress.
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Originally Posted by GTO I remember seeing a comparison between an Octavia’s service costs versus that of an Optra / Corolla. For 50,000 kms, the Octavia cost anywhere between 3 – 6 times that of its competition. To me, that does make a car expensive to service. Relative to its competition. |
I tried finding it, but could not. I've found real prices from Skoda owners mentioned, but couldn't find the same for the others.
Infact, I think we need to split this into a new thread and lets have some accurate figures put up for all cars. Pre & post warranty period servicing costs. Would be of immense help to new buyers. Standard consumable to be priced (filters/oil/labour). What say?