comparing audio systems and components

navin · 4th May 2005, 10:29

I hear a lot of "this is better than that". I dont consider this is a fair. sound varies based on so many phenomena (many of them not related to technical specs alone) that one has to use one's ears. I would suggest giving every system component about 30 mins of your time.

I maintain that the best way to audition a car audio component is to have it fitted in YOUR car and listen to it using YOUR favourite music WITH the engine running.

This gets even more complex when one has outboard amplifiers, component speakers, DVD/CD changers, subwoofers, etc.

I still find many who will invest in a audio system costing upwards of 50,000 and consider invensting in good cables, fuse blocks, and connectors a "waste of money".

so...
1. Please use your ears and TRUST only your ears. It is your money and your car.
2. Dont starve your amplifiers.
3. If your car audio installer does not carry a brand you want to try in stock find one who does.
4. establish a relationship with you car audio installer and they will be able to pull some strings for you.

and before you fall for the "Peter Belt" syndrome conduct ABX testing yourself. see.
http://www.belt.demon.co.uk/
http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/787/index1.html
http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue1/beltpen.htm
http://www.soundstage.com/synergize/synergize199912.htm

opinions? flames?

mithun · 24th March 2007, 06:23

And how can we find out that the installation carried out is perfect ?

OR

And which is the best way to rate the quality of the ICE installation ?

low_bass_makker · 24th March 2007, 10:35

I would say only one thing.....

"a good product installed in a bad manner would sound bad than a bad product installed in a good manner......

navin · 24th March 2007, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by mithun

And how can we find out that the installation carried out is perfect ?

OR

And which is the best way to rate the quality of the ICE installation ?

3 magic words.

USE YOUR EARS!

kvish · 26th March 2007, 20:39

Problem is in auditioning. I cannot find out how a system sounds until it is installed in my car....thats the sad part. Very few dealers show demos on a car.. I dont think anyone offers demo under driving conditions. I am not blaming the dealers here... its obviously not possible to have all Head units and all speakers in the car.

My experience with the dealer was that the moment you ask for a demo, they set it to the highest treble levels and put Himesh Reshmiya numbers

... Cos the guy who showed the demo was actually the mechanic who was fitting the speakers....Dont want to name the dealer...but it was for JBL speakers....

I think the only way to go about it is listening to the setups of colleagues/friends etc... and ofcourse through reviews...

These days, for home audio, I see more demo rooms and a better atmosphere to choose audio components, I think its just a matter of time before such a culture creeps into car audio as well....more so, since people are spending more time with their car audio than with their home audio

blueraven316 · 26th March 2007, 21:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvish

My experience with the dealer was that the moment you ask for a demo, they set it to the highest treble levels and put Himesh Reshmiya numbers

... Cos the guy who showed the demo was actually the mechanic who was fitting the speakers....Dont want to name the dealer...but it was for JBL speakers....

I think the only way to go about it is listening to the setups of colleagues/friends etc... and ofcourse through reviews...

These days, for home audio, I see more demo rooms and a better atmosphere to choose audio components, I think its just a matter of time before such a culture creeps into car audio as well....more so, since people are spending more time with their car audio than with their home audio

I think you have not met the right dealers yet, there are demo vehicles with some dealers and some of them sound pretty neat too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvish

the moment you ask for a demo, they set it to the highest treble levels and put Himesh Reshmiya numbers

...

OUCH! That must have hurt!

navin · 27th March 2007, 10:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvish

Problem is in auditioning.

You are in Bangalore. I think some of the best car audio dealers in India are in Bangalore. Find a better dealer.

Note: A better dealer might charge you a bit more but I think it is well worth it. You get better service, better product advice and a better install.

I have seen some people who use the better dealers to audition the products they are interested in and then go to the grey market or small discount shops and buy there. If this practice continues the better dealers will cease to exist then where does one go to audition?

low_bass_makker · 27th March 2007, 11:50

In delhi there are hardly any demo vehicles....and the 90% cars are filled with pioneer and sony stuff....and only it sells as it is cheap and everybody uses it....this makes a huge problem to the dealer of other good products.....

WoodenKnight · 28th March 2007, 00:38

The situation in Chandigarh is pathetic then. There are a few dealers who are considered 'major vendors' but they too employ uniformed hack-n-tape armies of 'technicians' who do a shoddy installation. Nobody sells damping equipment (far as I know). Those who have the ear (and the money) go to Delhi to get a little better service but most people here are about how-loud-how-much variety who either want to brag how much money they've spent and will gladly pay double for the same Chinese **** if you told them it was 'special' or who will play punjabi truck-driver songs at 300db!

It's very hard with these guys to spend the time and trust to your ears. After I got my amp LPF set, I had to get it done again because earlier my ears got confused from the bass that was coming in from the car parked next to mine. heh...

But guys, Navin is spot on and so is low_bass_makker -- if you're reading this, it means you care a little about the audio in your car -- pay attention to all the components that make up for a good experience.

mithun · 28th March 2007, 05:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvish

My experience with the dealer was that the moment you ask for a demo, they set it to the highest treble levels and put Himesh Reshmiya numbers... Cos the guy who showed the demo was actually the mechanic who was fitting the speakers....Dont want to name the dealer...but it was for JBL speakers....

The exact same thing happened to me yesterday when I was shopping for JBL Speakers !!!

Sam Kapasi · 28th March 2007, 17:02

lol, it's not that all JBL dealers are Himmesh fans. Though I've heard that Himmesh might be a JBL fan lol.

This is what happens at almost all dealers actually, over all brands. Sadly, this is what they define as good music. The more chik chik there is, the more CLAARITEE there is. Listen to our bollywood recordings, most of them are unbearable. We add jhankaar to everything. Dhisssss Shisssss Chakkkk chakk dhisssss!!!!!!

Did you know India blows more tweeters, annually than all of europe, but consumes less than 15% of the number of speakers sold there? This is who we are, as a nation. Listen to our taxis, our rickshaws. Chiller circuits and chilling chik chik sound and tweeters everywhere. Enough treble than you can shake a stick at and we're still not getting enough.

Let's add DSPs and Graphic equalizers, let take that last band and push it all the way up, lets turn the treble to +10 (that's what it's there for), let's mount additional tweeters on the B pillar so that we can inject the treble straight into one ear.
What?? You don't get 12 inch tweeters?

What about 6 way thali speakers? 6 way speakers have 1 boofer and 5 tweeters, so that is clearer and better. Clarity clearity chilling sound tisss tisssssss!!

Aaaah, it's got so much claaariteeee!! TS TWENTEEEEE!!! Bolo tararara.

low_bass_makker · 28th March 2007, 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi

Let's add DSPs and Graphic equalizers, let take that last band and push it all the way up, lets turn the treble to +10 (that's what it's there for), let's mount additional tweeters on the B pillar so that we can inject the treble straight into one ear.
What?? You don't get 12 inch tweeters?

What about 6 way thali speakers? 6 way speakers have 1 boofer and 5 tweeters, so that is clearer and better. Clarity clearity chilling sound tisss tisssssss!!

Aaaah, it's got so much claaariteeee!! TS TWENTEEEEE!!! Bolo tararara.

bolo tararara.....

...ya that is true what Sam Bhai said....clarity in india means tremble.....ya I mean TREMBLE not treble......

navin · 29th March 2007, 13:14

Why do I even try?

low_bass_makker · 29th March 2007, 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by navin

Why do I even try?

for what sir....treble.....

navin · 29th March 2007, 13:48

Try to convert everyone from BOOM-TIZZ to a nice neutral sound that allows the voice (even Hitesh-Himesh's vioce) to be heard.

4th May 2005, 10:29	#1
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,199 Thanked: 9,307 Times	comparing audio systems and components I hear a lot of "this is better than that". I dont consider this is a fair. sound varies based on so many phenomena (many of them not related to technical specs alone) that one has to use one's ears. I would suggest giving every system component about 30 mins of your time. I maintain that the best way to audition a car audio component is to have it fitted in YOUR car and listen to it using YOUR favourite music WITH the engine running. This gets even more complex when one has outboard amplifiers, component speakers, DVD/CD changers, subwoofers, etc. I still find many who will invest in a audio system costing upwards of 50,000 and consider invensting in good cables, fuse blocks, and connectors a "waste of money". so... 1. Please use your ears and TRUST only your ears. It is your money and your car. 2. Dont starve your amplifiers. 3. If your car audio installer does not carry a brand you want to try in stock find one who does. 4. establish a relationship with you car audio installer and they will be able to pull some strings for you. and before you fall for the "Peter Belt" syndrome conduct ABX testing yourself. see. http://www.belt.demon.co.uk/ http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/787/index1.html http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue1/beltpen.htm http://www.soundstage.com/synergize/synergize199912.htm opinions? flames? Last edited by navin : 4th May 2005 at 10:32.
	() Thanks

24th March 2007, 06:23	#2
mithun BANNED Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Cochin Posts: 2,195 Thanked: 268 Times	And how can we find out that the installation carried out is perfect ? OR And which is the best way to rate the quality of the ICE installation ?
	() Thanks

24th March 2007, 10:35	#3
low_bass_makker Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Faridabad Posts: 6,815 Thanked: 305 Times View My Garage	I would say only one thing..... "a good product installed in a bad manner would sound bad than a bad product installed in a good manner......
	() Thanks

26th March 2007, 20:39	#5
kvish BHPian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 627 Thanked: 195 Times	Problem is in auditioning. I cannot find out how a system sounds until it is installed in my car....thats the sad part. Very few dealers show demos on a car.. I dont think anyone offers demo under driving conditions. I am not blaming the dealers here... its obviously not possible to have all Head units and all speakers in the car. My experience with the dealer was that the moment you ask for a demo, they set it to the highest treble levels and put Himesh Reshmiya numbers ... Cos the guy who showed the demo was actually the mechanic who was fitting the speakers....Dont want to name the dealer...but it was for JBL speakers.... I think the only way to go about it is listening to the setups of colleagues/friends etc... and ofcourse through reviews... These days, for home audio, I see more demo rooms and a better atmosphere to choose audio components, I think its just a matter of time before such a culture creeps into car audio as well....more so, since people are spending more time with their car audio than with their home audio
	() Thanks

27th March 2007, 11:50	#8
low_bass_makker Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Faridabad Posts: 6,815 Thanked: 305 Times View My Garage	In delhi there are hardly any demo vehicles....and the 90% cars are filled with pioneer and sony stuff....and only it sells as it is cheap and everybody uses it....this makes a huge problem to the dealer of other good products.....
	() Thanks

28th March 2007, 00:38	#9
WoodenKnight BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Chandigarh Posts: 35 Thanked: 0 Times	The situation in Chandigarh is pathetic then. There are a few dealers who are considered 'major vendors' but they too employ uniformed hack-n-tape armies of 'technicians' who do a shoddy installation. Nobody sells damping equipment (far as I know). Those who have the ear (and the money) go to Delhi to get a little better service but most people here are about how-loud-how-much variety who either want to brag how much money they've spent and will gladly pay double for the same Chinese **** if you told them it was 'special' or who will play punjabi truck-driver songs at 300db! It's very hard with these guys to spend the time and trust to your ears. After I got my amp LPF set, I had to get it done again because earlier my ears got confused from the bass that was coming in from the car parked next to mine. heh... But guys, Navin is spot on and so is low_bass_makker -- if you're reading this, it means you care a little about the audio in your car -- pay attention to all the components that make up for a good experience.
	() Thanks

28th March 2007, 17:02	#11
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but wat Posts: 6,997 Thanked: 2,378 Times View My Garage	lol, it's not that all JBL dealers are Himmesh fans. Though I've heard that Himmesh might be a JBL fan lol. This is what happens at almost all dealers actually, over all brands. Sadly, this is what they define as good music. The more chik chik there is, the more CLAARITEE there is. Listen to our bollywood recordings, most of them are unbearable. We add jhankaar to everything. Dhisssss Shisssss Chakkkk chakk dhisssss!!!!!! Did you know India blows more tweeters, annually than all of europe, but consumes less than 15% of the number of speakers sold there? This is who we are, as a nation. Listen to our taxis, our rickshaws. Chiller circuits and chilling chik chik sound and tweeters everywhere. Enough treble than you can shake a stick at and we're still not getting enough. Let's add DSPs and Graphic equalizers, let take that last band and push it all the way up, lets turn the treble to +10 (that's what it's there for), let's mount additional tweeters on the B pillar so that we can inject the treble straight into one ear. What?? You don't get 12 inch tweeters? What about 6 way thali speakers? 6 way speakers have 1 boofer and 5 tweeters, so that is clearer and better. Clarity clearity chilling sound tisss tisssssss!! Aaaah, it's got so much claaariteeee!! TS TWENTEEEEE!!! Bolo tararara. Last edited by Sam Kapasi : 28th March 2007 at 17:14.
	() Thanks

29th March 2007, 13:14	#13
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,199 Thanked: 9,307 Times	Why do I even try?
	() Thanks

29th March 2007, 13:48	#15
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,199 Thanked: 9,307 Times	Try to convert everyone from BOOM-TIZZ to a nice neutral sound that allows the voice (even Hitesh-Himesh's vioce) to be heard.
	() Thanks