Fibreglass and Rubber mat damping for SAFARI

DerAlte · 27th July 2009, 23:09

@HappyWheels, your problem maybe needs a different solution. First stuff some rubber strips (old rubber tube pieces will do) between the dash and the A pillar bottom (where the cladding meets the dash) and the sides near the door hinges. If this removes the squeaks, remove, apply some rubber solution to the strip and stuff it back - this will prevent the strip from getting dislodged (the ghats are always going to be like that).

navin · 28th July 2009, 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Need to figure out how to get the engine noise out now! Fantastic work, Shreyas, shabash.

Best way is to rebuild the firewall with FRP and damping. Heatlon+Wurth spray on the engine side and DE/NK on the cabin side. If it worked on the noisy '74 Triumph Spitfire it will work on most modern cars.

Sometimes I really wish I had taken pics when I was active in audio. A picture = 1000 words.

shreyasma · 28th July 2009, 11:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by navin

Best way is to rebuild the firewall with FRP and damping. Heatlon+Wurth spray on the engine side and DE/NK on the cabin side. If it worked on the noisy '74 Triumph Spitfire it will work on most modern cars.

Sometimes I really wish I had taken pics when I was active in audio. A picture = 1000 words.

Yea..but sounds like an expensive and non-DIY option.
I am figuring out other 'desi' options. hope to find something soon

navin · 28th July 2009, 11:37

Then just damp the inner cabin walls under the carpet and behind the dashboard with DE or an equivalent.

DerAlte · 28th July 2009, 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by navin

... Heatlon+Wurth spray on the engine side and DE/NK on the cabin side. If it worked on the noisy '74 Triumph Spitfire it will work on most modern cars. ...

The degree of difficulty is a couple of notches less in an 'engine down rebuild' cases. With cars where down-time of more than a day is not desirable, the only-damp-inside-cabin method is preferable. Underbody Wuerth is still feasible, but not sure how much practical cabin noise reduction it gives.

The other problem I felt was the roof expanse in the Safari - a bit too messy to damp from inside. It resonates when the enginer RPM is 1100-1200rpm for some time, and hums loud enough to scare the ladies.

Safari engine bay has 4-sides felt (not tar-felt) damping (bottom and front impractical). But, the felt is not in contact with the metal expanses like firewall and bonnet. It acts only to prevent reflections and resonances in the bay - not transmission into cabin. Also, the sound reduces once you cross about 1200 rpm - at 1500 it is a fairly muted hum. The problem area is 850-1200 rpm, where one hears the traditional diesel chhakad-chhakad.

navin · 28th July 2009, 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAlte

The degree of difficulty is a couple of notches less in an 'engine down rebuild' cases.

DA you make me sound like a highly skilled person.

Trust me this was not not that diffcult. Yes the car was out of commision for about a week when we did it's car audio system but the Triumph is/was a particularly diffcult car to ICE. What with no room for decent front speakers and the rear speakers right at your ears. If we had TA in those days it would have helped.

The car presently sits in Palos Verdes LA becuase we do not have adequate parking in Mumbai. One day I do intend to get it transported to Mumbai (after my son has left the house for college) and then my wife and me can tool around town with it's top down! Man I am really looking forward to retirement!

Meanwhile the problems you are having with that Safari will only ever be solved if you can strip ti down to the chassis and damp it from inside out. Next time the car is due for a paint job would be a good itme to do the damping.

gigy · 28th July 2009, 19:26

you sure have good enough of patience to do this. great job. i will also try this after rains.

HappyWheels · 28th July 2009, 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAlte

@HappyWheels, your problem maybe needs a different solution... this will prevent the strip from getting dislodged (the ghats are always going to be like that).

Thanks for the pointer, DerAlte!

Let me first source out the required raw materials before I start dismantling the car!

akbaree · 28th July 2009, 23:48

I am not sure why I missed this thread for two days.

Great show Shreyas. And I can see that this thread has also kicked off some useful discussion on damping.

Alas, I missed one more opportunity to have some hands on exercise

.

DerAlte · 29th July 2009, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyWheels

... Let me first source out the required raw materials ...

Go to the nearest "pancher" shop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyWheels

before I start dismantling the car!

Oh no! No need to dismantle anything.

shreyasma · 29th July 2009, 11:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyWheels

....before I start dismantling the car!

HappyWheels, You will not be a happy with your wheels if you dismantle

mohang_j · 29th July 2009, 11:56

I have used a material called Armasound duct in side door panels of Alto and it reduced most of the vibrations.. Basically it is a closed cell foam used in ducts for thermal and for some extent sound isolation. 5mm sheet cost about 125rs/sq mtr( i got 1sq mtr as free sample). Also i have brought Armasound super silence (10mm) not yet used and costs around 900rs/sq mtr.- thought this info helps.

HappyWheels · 29th July 2009, 12:06

^^ Oh, I get the idea!

Guess if I dismantle, I will just be the "wheels" and no longer "happy"!

And as for raw materials, guess I will use the tubes that are lying from my previous tires.

shreyasma · 29th July 2009, 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by mohang_j

I have used a material called Armasound duct in side door panels of Alto and it reduced most of the vibrations.. Basically it is a closed cell foam used in ducts for thermal and for some extent sound isolation. 5mm sheet cost about 125rs/sq mtr( i got 1sq mtr as free sample). Also i have brought Armasound super silence (10mm) not yet used and costs around 900rs/sq mtr.- thought this info helps.

Mohan can you post few pics of the material. I have a new idea after your post

mohang_j · 29th July 2009, 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by shreyasma

Mohan can you post few pics of the material. I have a new idea after your post

Sure Shreyas, but only in the evening or tomorrow morning. I can give you the contacts of Armasound dealer. you can sandwich both materials and get good result.

Armacell.In company link.

27th July 2009, 23:09	#16
DerAlte Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 8,069 Thanked: 2,919 Times	@HappyWheels, your problem maybe needs a different solution. First stuff some rubber strips (old rubber tube pieces will do) between the dash and the A pillar bottom (where the cladding meets the dash) and the sides near the door hinges. If this removes the squeaks, remove, apply some rubber solution to the strip and stuff it back - this will prevent the strip from getting dislodged (the ghats are always going to be like that).
	() Thanks

28th July 2009, 11:37	#19
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,199 Thanked: 9,304 Times	Then just damp the inner cabin walls under the carpet and behind the dashboard with DE or an equivalent.
	() Thanks

28th July 2009, 19:26	#22
gigy Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: mumbai Posts: 1,321 Thanked: 47 Times	you sure have good enough of patience to do this. great job. i will also try this after rains.
	() Thanks

28th July 2009, 23:48	#24
akbaree BHPian Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Ahmedabad Posts: 613 Thanked: 107 Times View My Garage	I am not sure why I missed this thread for two days. Great show Shreyas. And I can see that this thread has also kicked off some useful discussion on damping. Alas, I missed one more opportunity to have some hands on exercise.
	() Thanks

29th July 2009, 11:56	#27
mohang_j BHPian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 270 Thanked: 18 Times	I have used a material called Armasound duct in side door panels of Alto and it reduced most of the vibrations.. Basically it is a closed cell foam used in ducts for thermal and for some extent sound isolation. 5mm sheet cost about 125rs/sq mtr( i got 1sq mtr as free sample). Also i have brought Armasound super silence (10mm) not yet used and costs around 900rs/sq mtr.- thought this info helps. Last edited by mohang_j : 29th July 2009 at 11:57.
	() Thanks

29th July 2009, 12:06	#28
HappyWheels Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 4,106 Thanked: 537 Times	^^ Oh, I get the idea! Guess if I dismantle, I will just be the "wheels" and no longer "happy"! And as for raw materials, guess I will use the tubes that are lying from my previous tires.
	() Thanks