Inverter Batteries

[khoj]

Originally Posted by ElantraGT

My Inverter is 2 years old and have Exide Inverter battery in them which went kaput. I am not confident on Exide inverter battery.

APC gives Prestolite battery as a package. Better go to them for battery replacement if your inverter is still under warranty. Inverter/Battery companies have a habit of pointing fingers at each other if the two are not sourced from the same source in case of problems under warranty. I am assuming that APC is covered under their standard 3 warranty.

[ElantraGT]

Originally Posted by khoj

I am assuming that APC is covered under their standard 3 warranty.

Khoj, Thanks I am surprised that APC is giving 3 years warrenty. I will check with the dealer then. When I purchased this inverter I remember that the APC guy was telling something about 1 year warranty on battery and 2 years on the inverter. I was in a hurry as I was going to US (was leaving the next day) I wanted to set things right at home so I didnt look in to the specs then. I will try to see the warranty card today and will update the thread.

[nirmaljusdoit]

HI Guys,

Need your advice, i want to go in for an inverter to be installed at my home in Bangalore, can you recommend a good installer ?

My requirement is for a 3 hour backup to run 3 fans and 4 tube lights (CFL's)

My doubts :

- Will the supplier give me a choice of battery or do i have to buy it ?

- The box that converts the DC to AC has some minimum requirement ? ISI, etc ?

- Wiring work to be done ?

Would be grateful if you can help me out with the approximate cost too of the individual components !

[khoj]

@nirmaljustdoit
It is best to buy the inverter and battery as a package though nobody is going to hold a gun to your head if you do not want to do that. When in doubt go with the big guys and in your case both are from South, APC is based out of Bangalore and Amara Raja (Xenon) is out of Chennai. It is just that Amara raja makes their own batteries which also happen to be the best in the country thus far.

The company's dealer who sells you the equipment will arrange for the installer, you just pay for the services and the wire used. just ensure that they use good quality copper wire like Finolex fire guard/fire resist etc. in the right gauge.

A 650 or 800 Va inverter with 160 Ah battery should see you through for the mentioned load. here is the link for Amaron/Xenon inverters Xenon ::Battery::
You should be paying within 14K for inverter(5 to 6K) + battery( 4 to 8K) + trolley (1.3K) + install(300 to 500) + taxes(variable state to state) bill is a must to claim warranty if required.

@ElantraGT
I helped a cousin purchase an inverter in Delhi last year from APC and they were with a 3 year warranty for the entire package. It could have been a seasonal offer, Delhi heat turns marketing guys brains to jello in summers. Still no harm in checking, you might save 5K or thereabouts. On the flip side you can buy a better battery.

[nirmaljusdoit]

Thanks Khoj !

Your reply has helped me very much, i did visit the APC & Amaron website for details. I have an AMARON battery in my swift from 2006 & it has performed very well ! APC i understand is a global name so there shouldn't be any issues on the performance front.

How about EXIDE ? i visited their website but could only get details about the batteries, do they have any authorized partners for installation ?

I would definitely prefer going for a established brand with a warranty to avoid any issues later !

[khoj]

@ nirmaljustdoit

Exide does not have a dedicated arrangement with any inverter company/installer(s). However since they are omnipresent everywhere they are the preferred make that most inverter installers go for/ recommended by most inverter manufacturers. So you may buy Sukam, Microtek or Luminous or one of the local brands and 8 times out of 10 the inverter retailer will give you an Exide Inva queen or Invared tubular. If you were in the North then the big three S,M & L would push their own batteries but beyond Haryana they still go with Exide most of the time OR if you want to use a Dry SMF battery in which case you must buy a battery supplied by the inverter manufacturer.

Personally I do not like to use regular/inverter duty lead acid batteries due to the issues with lead fumes, so Exide does not work for me.

At present I am using the following combos Sukam 1400Va pure Sine wave output inverter with 2 nos Sukam made Sealed maintenance Free Dry Batteries of 150AH each and a Xenon 800 Va pure Sine wave output Home UPS/Inverter with a single Xenon 150 AH Low maintenance battery.

All inverter cos and batteries are almost at par. The trick with the inverter / battery combo is to buy from a single source to avoid issues. Even then from a single vendor who is selling multiple brands be careful to buy the combo that is factory recommended and of course check on local support from the inverter manufacturer.

[Chipz]

dear nirmaljusdoit . I think a 100 ah battery will be enough for your 3 hour need. 3 fans and 4 tube is just 180+160=340 watts. so a 500 W inverter will be enough. as for the battery if you want good battery life go for fully tubular batter. the inverter battery( also called semi tubular) is a mix of tubular and automotive battery, it has less life. as for the sealed battery, ya they do not have any fumes but they have the shortest life and are more costly, and also they are difficult to repair (if they can be repaired). you can ask the inverter company to get you an exide fully tubular battery. It is good to have both inverter and battery from the same person, then they will not complaint each other if there is any complaints.

[khoj]

@Chipz
Short life on Sealed Maintenance Free batteries is nothing but an old woman's yarn. The companies that spread these rumors are now busy churning out the same SMF batteries from their spanking new battery plants in Baddi. I have been using SMF batteries for almost a decade now on 4 different applications without any frequent replacements.

Komatsu pair used since 9 odd years replaced with same make once three years ago.
Shield(semi sealed) also a pair used for nearly 5 years replaced with Quanta (sealed SMF battery made by Amaron) nearly two years ago.
Sukam SMF again 2 nos. bought with inverter from Sukam last year.
Xenon semi sealed (also made by Amaron) with Xenon inverter bought last year.

As you can see the average life I have got is 5.5 years which is pretty good and that coupled with the absence of lead fumes capable of mutating the human DNA and the convenience of a fit and forget product.. you will not see me recommending the normal batteries.

Regarding the cost, the last ones I bought were the Sukam pair of 150AH @ 7800 each and the Xenon 160AH semi sealed was somewhere around 5.5K, I have no idea what a same rating tubular would cost but I still would not buy a tubular for indoor use.

[shajufx]

My Home UPS is APC HI 800 SQBT which was installed on 2nd April 2009. It has the Prestolite battery. APC gives a 2 year warranty on the UPS and 18 months warranty on the battery. Thats answer to few posts above on the warranty part.

I also have another APC Back UPS 1500 RS with the extra battery pack that supports my desktop, printer, router etc for 3 hours+. This unit is with me for over an year without a single complaint.

I was going through the manual of the home UPS and found the writting "It supports switchover time for PC", claiming an auto changeover in 20 milliseconds. But the output waveform is 'stepped approximation to a sinewave', its not a pure sinewave. Anyway I thought of connecting my desktop directly to the plug point thats backed up by home UPS. It was fine for few days, therefore I put my APC 1500 RS for sale (its still in the classified here).

Now the issue is, when the fan or TV (42 inches plasma) is ON and the power goes off, home UPS is not able to manage the switchover lag, thereby cutting the desktop power, forcing it to go OFF. It happend few times in the last 2 days, each time making me to restart the system to continue working.

Solution: Is there any gadget or attachment that I can think of connecting to the power outlet for my PC which will not get affected by the switchover time ?

Bangalore city has over 4 hours of powercut in a single day, including sundays. I dont know what this city is coming to. UPS is equal to drinking water, we cant pass a day without it.

[nirmaljusdoit]

Thanks for all the inputs guys !

I have decided to go for a Xenon Inverter with the Xenon battery. Had called up the Xenon guys and would go in for the combo as i dont want warranty issues later. Will be going in for a sealed type battery as i want the convenience of fit and forget, no leakage issues and fumes.

They are quoting me around 16.5 K for the combo of 800 VA UPS, 160 Ah Battery & trolley. Wiring at actuals, installation Rs. 300. Can i negotiate this downwards ?

This is also based on my satisfactory experience with the Amaron battery in my Swift from 2006 !!

[nirmaljusdoit]

Originally Posted by shajufx

quot;, Bangalore city has over 4 hours of powercut in a single day, including sundays. I dont know what this city is coming to. UPS is equal to drinking water, we cant pass a day without it.

+ 1 to that !! Tell me about it, its becoming a nuisance & there's no standard time for the power cut too !!

[khoj]

[quote=shajufx;1737560]Solution: Is there any gadget or attachment that I can think of connecting to the power outlet for my PC which will not get affected by the switchover time ? [quote]

Yes, it is the APC 1500 RS that you have put on sale. Use it, you will hardly get any money for it. You are overloading your home UPS and that is why it is tripping your pc.


[quote] But the output waveform is 'stepped approximation to a sinewave', its not a pure sinewave. Anyway I thought of connecting my desktop directly to the plug point thats backed up by home UPS. It was fine for few days, therefore I put my APC 1500 RS for sale (its still in the classified here). [quote]

The square sine wave or the Quasi sine wave is bad for your normal electrical appliances and will surely fry your PC's circuits.

Originally Posted by nirmaljusdoit

Thanks for all the inputs guys !

I have decided to go for a Xenon Inverter with the Xenon battery.

They are quoting me around 16.5 K for the combo of 800 VA UPS, 160 Ah Battery & trolley. Wiring at actuals, installation Rs. 300. Can i negotiate this downwards ?

Good choice on the semi sealed battery. I bought the same combo last year for 14 + installation was 300(wiring was included as they needed only about 10 meters or so and existing MCB's were used) + Plastic trolley from Sukam was extra @1200. Total works out to 15500/-. Factor in the inflation and maybe you can still squeeze them for 500 odd and get them to include the wiring.
Do ensure that a good quality wiring is used. My installer had Finolex as his standard.

[pachchu77]

Solution: Is there any gadget or attachment that I can think of connecting to the power outlet for my PC which will not get affected by the switchover time ?

i had similar problem earlier. but now i have found solution for that just use capacitor before pc.

[shajufx]

Originally Posted by khoj

You are overloading your home UPS and that is why it is tripping your pc.

Thanks for the response, but here in this case I never overload the home UPS. It can take a total load of 500 watts, but tripped situations are mostly when only the PC (usually 120 watts max as measured many times) and one or two fans ( 80 watts each ). So here we have a total usage of 60% or less from the home UPS. So does it cause a trip ?

Originally Posted by pachchu77

i had similar problem earlier. but now i have found solution for that just use capacitor before pc.

Thanks, could you give me some details on what exactly you did ? I am aware that the capacitors retain the power for a while even after cutting off power. In this situation, what would I need and how should I take it as a DIY work (if possible) ?

Worst case situation, I have to retain the 1500 RS exclusively for PC protection and back up.

[gopalnayak]

Originally Posted by pachchu77

Solution: Is there any gadget or attachment that I can think of connecting to the power outlet for my PC which will not get affected by the switchover time ?

i had similar problem earlier. but now i have found solution for that just use capacitor before pc.

I would recommend going for a good SMPS for the PC. Most SMPS sold locally do not provide the much needed holdup during UPS switchover. Please get a branded SMPS with about 20ms holdup time and your issue should be solved. I had a similar issue and change of SMPS did the trick.