[DeepChat]

Andy, I can understand the confusion since I am in the market for a hatch too. My requirements are quite similar to yours viz., city car with a running of less than 1000 kms per month and occasional highway excursions. I have test driven the i10 and the Jazz.

i10 is great for weaving thru traffic in a hurry. You will like the interiors and the peppy engine, and your wife will love the looks. But I think that it is way too expensive for what it has to offer.

The look and feel of the Jazz is great, plus its a Honda Quality interiors, peppy engine, lots of space and features. After the recent price cuts, its really VFM. Low end torque is not the best, but I didn't find that to be an issue.

So my vote goes to the Jazz.

I haven't TD-ed the diesel Beat since I felt my requirements didn't justify a diesel car. Hope this helps.

[parsh]

Originally Posted by adg_andy

1. I would myself go for Jazz, but the Road tax here in banaglore are killing. So the base variant for Jazz would come to about 6.7 L on road. A chevy beat hoever comes to 5.25 on road. Added to it is the diesel factor.

2. Also the trafiic in bangalore is terrible. hence a smaller car is desirable.

3. I also plan for weekend getaways(within 200kms) after I buy my car. So, wouldnt beat D be more sensible?

NOW, don't go thinking that I am trying to sell you any car. I am no advocate of any particular car and even Jazz. But felt like addressing the points you put above.

1. Beat and Jazz are way tooooo far off each other in terms of what they offer and what they stand for. The value difference is what it comes to from what they offer respectively, though Honda will still feel like asking a bit of premium, Still, it is Honda and one has to shell out the price to get what it offers

2. I would say this is particularly a mind-block. Once you are off to driving, small or big, once your hand sets in, which may take some time depending upon your driving skills and learning, does not matter. Jazz is also not too big like an MUV/SUV so you have little comfort there. But you will only marginally gain and in the initial days only while driving a smaller car. The only thing is if you have bigger car, you will be more cautious while driving until you get upto speed with it. I don't see this as a big issue. I know a case where a person in 60s who has never driven a car in his life is driving a Sedan in congested traffic of Pune, slowly initially with caution but catching up without any issues.

3. How does this make any case for Beat or for that matter any car?

[adg_andy]

Originally Posted by parsh

3. How does this make any case for Beat or for that matter any car?

Hi Parsh,

About point 3: I was trying to ask that : Is buying a diesel with low running an absolute no no? As I already said before- base version of Jazz is 6.7 On road in Bangalore, i10 magna will come to around 4.7 and for a little premioum , beat d comes to around 5.25 . So, I was wondering if going for the diesel is practical or not, since I will be spending less on fuel?

[parsh]

Now, I am going to try and put a very simple and silly arithmetic, ignoring all other aspects.

Say Petrol is 10 Rpl (Rupees per liter) more than Diesel.
Say Diesel car is Rs 1,00,000/- more than the petrol and that FE is better for Diesel by 5 kpl (which is actually the prime selling point of Diesels).

So you have an advantage of
10 Rpl / 5 kpl = 2 Rpk in Diesel car.

How far does this advantage can get you?
100000 R / 2 Rpk = 50000 k

The sooner you cross this mark, the more (mark MORE) beneficial to you. Are you sooner or even ever going to cross this mark? But is it really MORE BENEFICIAL or good?

I don't know how far this is going to help you, but check it out.

[adg_andy]

Originally Posted by parsh

So you have an advantage of
10 Rpl / 5 kpl = 2 Rpk in Diesel car.

How far does this advantage can get you?
100000 R / 2 Rpk = 50000 k

The sooner you cross this mark, the more (mark MORE) beneficial to you. Are you sooner or even ever going to cross this mark? But is it really MORE BENEFICIAL or good?

I don't know how far this is going to help you, but check it out.

Hi Parsh,
Thabnks for laying it out beautifully. I understand that you are trying to make me understand the logic of diesel for high mileage units, but in my case, the dilemma is different:
I have the same budget lets say 5L would be optimum, and at that price I get two options: one petrol and the other a diesel. So the premium of 1 L does not hold true. The reason being I am about 6'2" and do not fit in lower segment cars. Now what? confused as hell. Also, once my 4 month daughter grows up a bit ( 1 year) I intend to make long drives to goa and thereabouts..

[ani_meher]

Sorry for complete OT, as this post doesn't help the original query. This is about the formula posted below.

Suppose the diesel car gives only 1Kpl more than petrol. Then advantage is
10Rpl / 1 kpl = 10 Rpk

How far does this advantage can get you?
100000 R / 10 Rpk = 10000 k

Sooner than what you would have got with 5kmpl more average!

The formula is not accurate, as the benefit should increase (i.e. the kilometers to achieve profit should decrease) with both the increase in difference between petrol and diesel, and increase in the difference in mileage. Here it is inversely proportional to difference in mileage, which is not correct.

Originally Posted by parsh

Now, I am going to try and put a very simple and silly arithmetic, ignoring all other aspects.

Say Petrol is 10 Rpl (Rupees per liter) more than Diesel.
Say Diesel car is Rs 1,00,000/- more than the petrol and that FE is better for Diesel by 5 kpl (which is actually the prime selling point of Diesels).

So you have an advantage of
10 Rpl / 5 kpl = 2 Rpk in Diesel car.

How far does this advantage can get you?
100000 R / 2 Rpk = 50000 k

The sooner you cross this mark, the more (mark MORE) beneficial to you. Are you sooner or even ever going to cross this mark? But is it really MORE BENEFICIAL or good?

I don't know how far this is going to help you, but check it out.

[parsh]

Originally Posted by ani_meher

Sorry for complete OT, as this post doesn't help the original query. This is about the formula posted below.

Suppose the diesel car gives only 1Kpl more than petrol. Then advantage is
10Rpl / 1 kpl = 10 Rpk

How far does this advantage can get you?
100000 R / 10 Rpk = 10000 k

Sooner than what you would have got with 5kmpl more average!

The formula is not accurate, as the benefit should increase (i.e. the kilometers to achieve profit should decrease) with both the increase in difference between petrol and diesel, and increase in the difference in mileage. Here it is inversely proportional to difference in mileage, which is not correct.

Would rather not like to hijack Andy's thread for this. Will just post a response on the run right now.

The formula is correct with the limited scope of parameters (as I had said ignoring all other aspects). You correctly mentioned one word "inversely". The benefit increases but for Petrol considering various other factors of duration etc and actually the "Inference" from the values obtained and "Decision" are "inversely" proportional ("beneficial") to the parameters considered. Its another topic for understanding or giving understanding so will stop here.

Andy, will revert back on your post later. Got to run.

[sraye]

Originally Posted by adg_andy

Hi Parsh,
The reason being I am about 6'2" and do not fit in lower segment cars. Now what? confused as hell. Also, once my 4 month daughter grows up a bit ( 1 year) I intend to make long drives to goa and thereabouts..

In terms of space and long term ownership, suggest you go for a Jazz if its within budget. To give a personal experience, I started off with a pre owned Santro, and within a year of ownership felt the need for a bigger car. I have booked a Jazz for these reasons:

1. Space - both for passengers and boot space ( picking up people from the airport showed up the limitations of the santro's boot)
2. Long term ownership - listed down my lifestyle and how requirements will change over 5 years . the Jazz seemed to fit my requirements for space, relaibility
3. Long drives : I usually drive Mumbai-Pune over weekends. Ideally the City would have been perfect here, but considering that this is at most once a month, the Jazz fit in beautifully for 80% city 20% long drive usage.
4. Fuel efficiency : for a petrol car , the Jazz owners report good mileage . The new swift scores better here, but the boot space/high loading might count against it.
5. Very personal opinion - the cabin makes me feel as if I am in a bigger car.
6. Safety features : Airbags/ABS present in all variants.

The other car I considered was the Figo, but have finally booked the Jazz ( major decision maker here was the better half)

Whatever you finally choose, look forward to a nice ownership report

[Geo_Ipe]

You're one lucky fella to have GTO as the first responder to your query. It has to be the Jazz. The Beat any day is a compromise and you will realise and regret it more as the days go by.

Quality is something you have to pay for. And with the price cuts Honda's offering it at our doorsteps. Wouldn't be wise to ignore it.

And the new Jazz is not a compromised product like the Etios. It very much retains its original values offered at an unbelievable price.

The choice has to be Jazz. Period.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by adg_andy

I have the same budget lets say 5L would be optimum, and at that price I get two options: one petrol and the other a diesel. So the premium of 1 L does not hold true. The reason being I am about 6'2" and do not fit in lower segment cars. Now what? confused as hell. Also, once my 4 month daughter grows up a bit ( 1 year) I intend to make long drives to goa and thereabouts.

As you intend to keep the car for 5 years, I recommend the Jazz. As your child grows, she will need and enjoy the space and comfort the Jazz offers. IMHO, the Beat is good as a city workhorse, but I am sure at some point within the next couple of years your aspirations would make you think of a bigger car, at least in terms of space.

If you think a new Jazz is a bit out of reach, please consider the preowned car market. I got my Jazz at 5.25 (and this was before the garage sale and price reduction).

Do consider how comfortable your child will be in either car 3 years down the line and how much stuff you would need to carry for your weekend drives/ vacations. And in any case, diesels take at least 4 km just to get their mileage appetite going! As your daily commute is low, I recommend you pedal to work instead. Thinking out of the box a bit, but the Jazz works like a dream however often or rarely you drive her around

Also, please do buy your child a comfy child car seat whichever car you buy. She will be comfortable, well rested and safe. And the best time to get her used to it is immediately when she rides in a car

[vishygk]

Some pointers which may help..

Jazz if you have the budget. If you don't the next best choice is i10.
Jazz definitely has more space and quite versatile (means you can load more on your weekend/grocery trips),however i10 is also a proven product,a tad less spacious than Jazz,
There is a price diff of more than 1 lakh (assuming Sportz version of i10) between them (so you will need to make the call).
An additional aspect is i10 also has an AT (more expensive) but is an option if you are worried about city driving.

I personally feel Beat Diesel is underpowered, I would suggest Beat petrol as a better alternative looking at your limited usage.

[Cooltronics]

Hi Andy,
There is nothing better than taking the wife's command as order and doing accordingly and in this case she has hit on the right car (JAZZ) as far as a complete package is concerned. You get the best of interior space, high quality interiors, amazing boot space, alloy wheels to name a few.
Close your eyes and go for Jazz if it fits your budget and you are looking for a petrol hatch

[adg_andy]

Originally Posted by Cooltronics

Hi Andy,
There is nothing better than taking the wife's command as order and doing accordingly and in this case she has hit on the right car (JAZZ) as far as a complete package is concerned. You get the best of interior space, high quality interiors, amazing boot space, alloy wheels to name a few.
Close your eyes and go for Jazz if it fits your budget and you are looking for a petrol hatch

I think I am falling for Hyundai Eeon. There is a plethora of choices coming up in the next one month. Can some one please let me know the date of launch for Eon? Consumer is spoilt for choice really

[Cooltronics]

Originally Posted by adg_andy

I think I am falling for Hyundai Eeon. There is a plethora of choices coming up in the next one month. Can some one please let me know the date of launch for Eon? Consumer is spoilt for choice really

Eon would be an entry level car in direct competition with Alto and may be replacing Santro. Might be a good choice for entry level segment but considering your budget, I shall still vouch for JAZZ. It has a royal touch to the otherwise hatchback body

[adg_andy]

Originally Posted by Cooltronics

Eon would be an entry level car in direct competition with Alto and may be replacing Santro. Might be a good choice for entry level segment but considering your budget, I shall still vouch for JAZZ. It has a royal touch to the otherwise hatchback body

But now I have a choice at lower budget isnt it? Plus i get to know that I can fit my long legs inside the eon ( If adil from zigwheels says its spacious , then I am optimistic). EMI reduces with the reduction in budget.And yes it is positioned below the santro. Santro continues to exist.