[VPJ74]

Originally Posted by gururajrv

Btw, are we sure VW group 2.0 TDI’s are meeting Europe norms? Hope they aren’t resorting to cheating again

You raise a very interesting point.
In Germany, lawsuits have already been admitted against VW in Courts claiming that the VW 2L diesel ie EA288 engine also has a Cheat-device software installed.

This can be potentially disastrous for VW as the Diesel-Gate lawsuit had agreed on a heavy statute of limitation (ie a cap on fines, billions already) provided no more cheating happens. If the EA288 is proven to have a cheat device, all settled cases and fines are open again. The financial implications are massive.

I have not quoted my source but you can Google it for the official court announcements.

[gururajrv]

Originally Posted by VPJ74

You raise a very interesting point.
In Germany, lawsuits have already been admitted against VW in Courts claiming that the VW 2L diesel ie EA288 engine also has a Cheat-device software installed.

This can be potentially disastrous for VW as the Diesel-Gate lawsuit had agreed on a heavy statute of limitation (ie a cap on fines, billions already) provided no more cheating happens. If the EA288 is proven to have a cheat device, all settled cases and fines are open again. The financial implications are massive.

I have not quoted my source but you can Google it for the official court announcements.

If that’s true, seriously VW group is on its way to put all their Diesel engines & their status to grave. It’s seriously disheartening to see these guys resorting to cheap tactics of screwing up nature. We’re looking at integrity issues from this manufacturer. Next question, is Audi playing safe knowing they can’t bring their emissions down?

Can we get an estimate of how many VW group diesels are plying on Delhi’s streets?! We can give at least 20% of air pollution contributed by their diesels in Delhi

[Flash777]

Is it just me who loves Big Torquey Diesel Engines?

Their versatality is amazing and as GTO rightly pointed out, there is still a night and day difference in the fuel efficiencies when you drive hard.

In SUVs, the lesser said the better. SUVs and Diesel Engines are simply made for each other.

Infact there can be argument made that advanced diesels are refined than ever before, have performances nearly on par with their petrol counterparts and have better range and practicality.

So why not Diesel over Petrols when they are still 10% cheaper and Atleast 30% more efficient ?

Anyways, The Electric wave is going to take over both of them very soon. So enjoy them while they last.

[Turbohead]

Guess I actually agree with Audi's decision.

Audi's customers are rarely the enthusiast, who appreciates cars for their ride, handling and power. Audi customers tend to be car noobs and prefer cars which are comfortable, high on interior quality and status (else they would stick to Innovas). And it is usually these customers who are actually repelled by the banning of diesel cars and it's uncertainty, unlike many enthusiasts who have a better understanding of whats going on. These are the customers who would tend to go for petrol cars. I know many non enthusiasts who have sold their diesel cars for petrol powered ones- knowing very well about the lower FE they'll have, And they find it absolutely fine as there is some peace of mind, unlike banning of diesels, and also because they would have a predictable resale value.


It's no longer about running costs. In fact, many luxury car owners claim not to care about mileage. But what will really kill Audi is their decision to bring in more of that 1.4 TSI, which loses out on the whole point of buying a luxury car- power, bragging rights and status. Atleast for their customers.

[AirbusCapt]

Petrol, high power and efficiency don't go hand in hand. Let me explain. The moment a petrol engine reaches about 100 bhp per liter, it stops being fuel efficient. Point in case, any decent big bike engine, say a Kawasaki Versys 650. The engine produces 69 ps with only 649 cc, and the best efficiency you can squeeze out of it is a measly 22/25 kmpl (90kmph in 6th gear, cruising along a highway). The moment you try to extract the performance, the average drops further down to the teens.

The above, versus a turbo diesel. A 2 liter diesel now produces a decent 200 bhp (again 100 bhp/liter) and even when coupled with a torque converter automatic, will still given 8/9 kmpl per liter in crawling traffic and in excess of 15 kmpl at 80/90 kmph on the highway.

The above is an extreme example of a light petrol application with a manual (195 kg bike) versus a heavy application of a diesel (2000 kg suv with automatic gears), and yet a petrol engine is simply not as efficient as a diesel one.

[TN13Sleeper]

When every major motorsport team in LeMans were using gasoline/petrol, Audi was the first to break the mould and use a diesel powered car. The R10 TDi even managed to finish first, outperforming all it's petrol powered competitors. Just imagine the amount of R&D that would have been done on the TDi technology that would eventually boil down to the commercial passenger cars.

[84.monsoon]

Originally Posted by Turbohead

It's no longer about running costs. In fact, many luxury car owners claim not to care about mileage. But what will really kill Audi is their decision to bring in more of that 1.4 TSI, which loses out on the whole point of buying a luxury car- power, bragging rights and status. Atleast for their customers.

Yes, it is impossible to imagine why Audi went with this decision, to standardize on 1.4 TSI in the A4, which makes 150 PS and 250 NM. In comparison, the BMW 330i in the same segment (only Petrol available in the 3) makes 258 BHP and 400 NM! And it is only 2 lakhs more than the Technology trim of the A4 which has equivalent features. This is despite Audi having a more powerful engine homologated and available in India (The 2.0 TSI in A6 and Octavia RS). BMW has taken the smart route of launching the petrol 3 series int he more powerful 330i variant only, which uses the same engine as the 530i.

Audi is reverse-positioning itself out of the power corner of the map, i.e., ensuring that customers dis-associate any perception of power away from the Audi Brand. This is not going to help them in any way and makes it hard for them to market performance brands in the future such as the S5 or R8.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnuNSTgYlXQ

Mercedes claims that 70% of its sales still come from diesel engines. Did Audi make a terrible mistake in this regard? Sure looks like it.