[PontiacBandit]

With a hot hatch, I feel people are not giving up too much practicality for the performance oriented car. Depending on family needs, rear legroom may not be of that much importance for you, or boot space for that matter. A performance oriented hatch that can seat four people decently is good enough in my books to beat a more practical sedan or SUV at a similar price point.

[CountryDriver]

The presence of budget friendly hot hatches came into our country with the Abarth Punto and the VW GT twins. But now , that is a fading segment. It's almost like the old saying that one doesn't know the value of something until he / she loses it. The Indian market now sorely misses Abarths, The JTP twins and the old GTs. Iam a huge fan of the Abarth Punto and keep track of those for sale in the country. Even now, it's hard to find a well maintained one for sale and it usually gets sold within a week. IMO, cars like that should be launched in the country, within the "budget-friendly" price range, so that anyone with the spark of an enthusiast has the chance to own his dream car.

[yd_gli]

Voted No! I owned a 2006 GTi for ~ 3 years before I made the unwise (wise then) decision of coming back from the US in 2008. I drove it all over the eastern and western US seaboards and the car was a hoot to drive to put it mildly. It had the 18in rims for summer and a set of 17in rims for winter. It's the only car I still miss to this day.

Would I buy the same car in India? No.

Back in 2016 on an urge to get back some of the GTi part of my life, I bought a Polo GT which was the closest thing available to it. The GT was fun to drive and seemed relatively fast in the Indian conditions. I sold it off in 2019.

Reasons:
- The car was too low and I never felt confident driving it over the monstrous speed breakers that we see on our city roads and highways. I scraped the bottom one time too many. I had initially planned to lower the car with a Bilstein setup but since the car would bottom out on stock suspension, the idea of lowering springs was out of the window. A near miss on a random and huge speed breaker on a KA state highway meant that I would never bother taking the car on the highways again.
- The DSG on it had started showing symptoms of failure with the occasional violent jerk and skipping of gears. I had no interest in spending ~ 1L on the mechatronics replacement.
- The ASS experience with VW was miserable. They would never replace parts without trying to repair them first. The technicians had very little knowledge on the technicalities of the DSG, re-setting it etc. If they couldn't work with a locally made GT, resolving issues on the GTi would be near impossible. The only feature they knew of was to disable the horn during lock/unlock.
- The GTi used to feel bumpy and harsh on the smoothest California freeways. The same suspension on Indian roads would probably end up dislodging your tooth filling. No thanks!

[Mjaswal]

I have a golf 2.0 TDI 4 motion in Finland. It's an absolute beast of a machine and I love driving it. Drive it hard all day and still returns a milage of over 18kmpl. But, I would not like to own the same car here in India because of the following reasons
1) I don't want to deal with the remarks of relatives and family members , so much money for such a small car. You could have bought a much bigger car. Indian relatives just don't understand what driving pleasure means.
2) The Volkswagen ASS here.
3) The qaulity of VW cars India not being at par with VW cars Europe. I feel that we get a lower quality product in India and I have felt this even with Hyundai and Toyota cars.


Here are a few pictures of my golf. She's called Fiona.
Black rims are 17 inch summer tyres and silver ones are 18 inch winter tyres

[Mustang Sammy]

2 words why these cars are impractical for India.
Ground Clearance.
How can you have any fun with them when you have to brake every 2 minutes for gigantic speedbreakers and potholes, even when there is no traffic.

[shancz]

Originally Posted by RoadMonkey

Life just feels more exciting, I love driving my car more and more every day. I have a smile plastered on my face every time I get to take it out on a highway. These joys of life are what make it more than mere survival while dealing with life's troubles.

Second that and thanks for bringing it up.
The impact of driving a good car on your mood is highly underrated. After an exhausting day it makes a difference if you are heading back home in a car that you love driving or just a "mode of transport". If you are stuck in traffic then good stereo and interiors help, else the powertrain and mechanicals will. Worst case the weekend is just around the corner

Originally Posted by deetjohn

I just couldn't feel that connection with the car whenever I drove it. There were two big problems, something that is essential in a driver's car for me. 1) Seating position 2) Gearbox. I need to sit low and away from the windshield in any car, and it is never possible in a Punto. It was always like a semi-squat position. And enough has been said about the gearbox on this forum already! A good transmission must complement the engine, and in the Abarth Punto, it was anything but that. Also, the feel of the shifts etc. made the car real feel outdated. And the car was really that back then. Not just the model, but the brand itself was on its last leg.

The connection, like you mentioned is essential.
Engine and gearbox are the soul of a car, everything else comes later.
Thanks for bringing up the seating position, it isn't much talked about but is vital.
Fiat being on last legs would've turned away buyers from the Abarth as well. So this reinforces the point about the "hot hatch" being from a reliable manufacturer to get good sales as this will remove the concerns over maintainability over a long time. Just the performance and cost of ownership will remain.

Originally Posted by deetjohn

And we will totally miss the big picture if we make all future decisions based on that single outcome.

Exactly, seems like the execution and timing of the product wasn't good. And like you rightly said we should look at the Polo GT for reference, so we will.

Originally Posted by deetjohn

Yes, Ford is well placed on this I would say! Just like VW themselves. The latest Fiesta can really be GT TSi Part 2. I think there will be numbers - think about all those in the market looking for the next GT TSi! Potent engine + great MT/AT + little more room and taking it further with the dynamics - that's what we are looking for.

Second that, I have high hopes with this partnership but they won't be the first in the market for a hot hatch though.

Originally Posted by deetjohn

The company has always blown hot and cold for me ever since its inception. For a few years, the company will be super aggressive meeting all requirements in the market annihilating the competition with a host of new models, variants, some technical improvements etc. and then they will go completely missing in the next phase. Currently, I think we are in that later period now - it looks totally out of their depth to really do something for the enthusiasts. Sadly the alliance with Toyota has taken them further back in their shell. If they change gear, the first priority should be a 6 speed AT for their commuter cars.

Innovation and Maruti don't go together and its ironical because they introduced us to the 800, 1000 and Zen.
My observation is that Maruti does something only when their revenues take a hit. The first time they moved was when the Koreans came knocking and Santro and Matiz started hitting their sales. I think internally they would have a minimum sales/profit threshold number for each segment and the moment that threshold is breached they just axe the model(original Baleno, Kizashi, SX4, Grand Vitara).
Maruti are excellent at selling cars, seems like making them comes second.

Originally Posted by yd_gli

It's the only car I still miss to this day.

Same here for the Golf(not the legendary GTi though, it was out of reach)

Originally Posted by yd_gli

- The car was too low and I never felt confident driving it over the monstrous speed breakers that we see on our city roads and highways. I scraped the bottom one time too many. I had initially planned to lower the car with a Bilstein setup but since the car would bottom out on stock suspension, the idea of lowering springs was out of the window. A near miss on a random and huge speed breaker on a KA state highway meant that I would never bother taking the car on the highways again.
- The DSG on it had started showing symptoms of failure with the occasional violent jerk and skipping of gears. I had no interest in spending ~ 1L on the mechatronics replacement.
- The ASS experience with VW was miserable. They would never replace parts without trying to repair them first. The technicians had very little knowledge on the technicalities of the DSG, re-setting it etc. If they couldn't work with a locally made GT, resolving issues on the GTi would be near impossible. The only feature they knew of was to disable the horn during lock/unlock.
- The GTi used to feel bumpy and harsh on the smoothest California freeways. The same suspension on Indian roads would probably end up dislodging your tooth filling. No thanks!

Thanks for sharing the ownership experience. Your points nail the concerns for the hot hatch.
- Decent GC is needed else it won't be the only car
- DSG is my biggest concern with with any VW/Skoda, the repairs bills are dreadful. Maintenance costs are expected to be higher but rationally, more on consumables rather than component failures.
- A.S.S. for VW is surprising, I thought they would be better in technical competence and service.
- GTi tune shocks, like you said won't work. That's why I would prefer a regular hatch with good driving dynamics provided with powerful engine and transmission options and related adjustments to other components if needed.

Let's see how Altroz turbo performs, if it feels nice it would tick the boxes for GC(165mm), reliability and maintenance costs since the same TC petrol is used on the Nexon but will have to see how the engine performs in this guise.
I know we already have the new i20 but for some reason I never connected with that car(2017 i20 Elite 1.2 petrol), especially the feel and handling but that's just me.

Wishful thinking but I wish Tata would also launch an Altroz JTP and 2-3 years down the line launch a brilliant 1.2-1.6 4 cylinder petrol NA and TC

[Shome]

Votes Yes.

But not for a brand new one and not as the primary vehicle. But I'd probably be willing to pay slightly higher for a well maintained pre-worshipped one. A Polo gti or an Abarth will definitely have a smile plastered all across my face on drives when practicality is not a priority (read vacays with fam)

[McLaren Rulez]

No for a hot hatch but yes for a big hatch! I'd happily get a Golf if I could but the only car in India that's sort of there is the S-Cross.

[benvsben]

Even if Toyota considers to bring this WRC beast to India, these are the prospective highlights...

1. 1.2L Petrol Engine with MT/AT
2. 16" GR Wheels - Anthracite (Top end only)
4. 60/40 Rear seats - Cheers!
5. Rain-sensing wipers and headlamp
6. Pilot vanity mirror
7. Chrome and another extra dash of chrome
8. Easy EMI
9. 5 Colour HUD Cluster
10. Cruise control w. Dead pedal in red brick edition

I know what you are thinking... but, I could only come up with such asinine features.

Psst! Please add a few more to make it look lustfully lucrative for the Indian market.

Originally Posted by Swap_Abarth

Happy to report that, support from Jeep/Fiat service center in Thane is good. So I am not much worried about near future.

Thane is a bit far off for a PY Fiat Punto. Fiat's move (out) totally reflects Italian's arrogance. I am getting it serviced at a Bosch service centre. And, I am still not happy about the outcome. I have tried the neighbouring cities as well. My heart rages with fire, whenever I see a Jeep rolling around in my city!

[karanddd]

Surprised to see so many people against hot hatches (the only kind of affordable "sports" car) on what's ostensibly a forum for driving enthusiasts. I mean the joy that a hatchback with adequate power and good handling brings to the driver is infinitely greater than whatever run-of-the-mill underpowered cars (irrespective of category) can offer. And it's not that you sacrifice all that much in the way of practicality, you can still seat 4-5, carry some luggage etc. I mean most families in India already make do with one small car for the whole family. If anywhere in the world should have hot hatches, it's here. The real problem is the perception that's built up in people's heads about the hierarchy of cars, small is worse than large, small hatchback worse than sedan worse than crossover/SUV. We're highly conscious of what our neighbours or the parking attendant or coworkers will think of driving a little car, and thus far more willing to put down money for large bodyshells than for large engines. Just look at the comments the new I20 is getting, and had Hyundai doubled down a bit on the hot hatch thing, they may have brought it with a larger engine with more power, starting at, say, 12 lakh, but Indians would've balked hard ("so much money for a hatchback!"). That's why we can't have nice things. Sorry for the rant.

[deetjohn]

Originally Posted by Mustang Sammy

2 words why these cars are impractical for India.
Ground Clearance.

Let me say that Ground Clearance is overrated. Instead a well tuned suspension is what one needs. I drive a sedan with a GC of 156 mm. And that's the old school calculation, so if it is rated now, it might be even lower. Anyways, the point is that it doesn't touch ground.

Sure, one needs to be careful if the car is packed full and the speed breaker was built by someone who didn't do that well with math or shapes at school and felt that need to compensate for 'lift' elsewhere. But the car can definitely handle most bad roads or no roads with ease.

My point is that manufacturers resorted to easiest and cheapest way by jacking up spring height to cover the lousy suspension geometry the car came with. And a hatchback will do slightly better than sedans in this regard anyways - so, not a big concern if you ask me!

[Fan@Automotive]

Voted Yes!

2 liter NA/Turbo Petrol Engine, Sorted Driving Dynamics, 3/5 Door, 2/4 Seats, low slung car with good lights and brakes and safety kit. I am willing to pay the money.

I wish Toyota brings GT86 to India. 2 more manufactures were rebranding the same car in international markets. Pity us.