Should the TATAs spin off a new brand for passenger cars?

kvish · 2nd May 2007, 13:14

Tata's success has been majorly due to the Sumos, cabs and the indicas and the ACE. I am not saying that their passenger cars havent done well, but their image is suffering a bit because of the success of the other segments. Most of the car manufacturers use different brand names to signify different segments. I wonder why TATAs shouldnt do so.

Just recently I suggested the Indigo SX to someone looking for a nice chauffer driven car, and I got a blank look from them!!!.. Infact lot of my friends dont want to buy it because of the 'taxi' branding associated with it...I think its better if they push core passenger vehicles under a new brand.

Something like a 'lexus' or an 'acura' kind of brand (of course, take it from an Indian context)....

srishiva · 2nd May 2007, 13:58

and call it "bye bye"

theMAG · 2nd May 2007, 14:15

The better option would be to make the taxi variants of a personal car completely different to look at - and I dont mean cosmetically. And sold thru their exisitng CV showrooms

v1p3r · 2nd May 2007, 14:20

Interesting question. But I'd have to say no. A lot of people buy Indicas and Indigos because they are solid, reliable and built truck-tough. You and me may not think so, but there's no way hundreds and thousands of cabbies would stake their livelihood on it otherwise.

Mahesh, I think you've got it right. Change a few panels on the yellow-board versions, and sell them alongside the Ace and whatnot.

GTO · 2nd May 2007, 14:43

Interesting suggestion but no ways! The Acuras and Lexus' were brands that were created to compete with Mercs and Beemers i.e. for a segment where brands and prestige counts the most.

That is not applicable to the segments that Tata competes in. Period. Plus the Tata badge is a hallmark of trust and value.

Quote:

The better option would be to make the taxi variants of a personal car completely different to look at

Darn smart suggestion, man! I hope Tata is reading this.

rahul_intlad · 2nd May 2007, 14:55

Dont think tata needs a separate division unless they are targetting the premium segment[mercs,beemers]

Brings to focus the fiat brand actually,does it not enjoy tata service,reputation of building solid cars and so on.But is that actually translating into anything significant yet.

Rtech · 2nd May 2007, 15:00

What's stopping the tourist taxi owners from buying the regular version? Unless they artificially price it higher.

But then, does this "taxi" business really affect a buyers decision? Frankly, if i was in the market for a no-frills economiser with the maximum space inside (which is basically what the Indica/go market is), I really wouldn't care if the same car is being used by tourist taxi operators. It hasn't affected the Innova market, nor has the Corolla image been diluted with the multitude of corolla taxi's around these days.

however, as they move up the food chain, I think separating the brand would be important. Nobody wants a 12 lakh car from a manufacturer that built its name on a 3 lakh one. Hyundai learnt this the hard way.

tsk1979 · 2nd May 2007, 15:12

Tata should go for a new brand in the higher segment.
A 12 lakh large sedan, no matter how better feature wise vis a vis competition, will not sell with "Tata" logo.
As for taxi image, Tata has something called "Indicab" priced slightly lower, but most taxi's I see are normal DLS and in some cases DLS Turbo.
So unless they increase price(scare away customers) segregation will not happen.
For that matter if anybody makes a < 4lakh car with great FE and amazing interior space, the Taxi market will lap it up.

Zappo · 2nd May 2007, 15:28

Brand segregation is one thing and segmentation is another. In the case of Tatas even if they do not want to spin-off a separate brand (considering the cost of doing a true separation), a-la Lexus and Acura they may still want to think of segmentation. In fact they are doing that for quite sometime.

The Indicabs have been deliberately left in a time warp. Those are actually the pre-2003 Indicas with bare minimum fitments. The difference in looks and even the quality and level of accessories and fitments between the Indicabs and the 2007 Indicas is huge. This alongwith the difference in costs of the Indicabs and the new Indicas ensure to some extent that cab owners mostly veer off to the Indicabs. However that still does not stop many others from using the 'personal' variants as cabs. Here Tatas can trump the practice (if they at all want it that bad) by adding a disclaimer to the warranty statement that any vehicle (except for the cab variants) that has a yellow board or is otherwise used to rent out as a taxi will not be covered by any warranty or free services. I think this will immediately stop this practice.

It is another matter that Tatas may not want to do that at all.

SuMo · 2nd May 2007, 16:20

I am from Mumbai and whenever I go out of Mumbai in interior Maharashtra I dont see many ( rather any in some parts) Honda City's or Toyota Corollas or all those hi-fi brand of vehicles. These are seen only in cities. Out on real Indian roads its mainly the TATA , Mahindra Jeeps ( Not many Scorpios though) and Tempo trax etc. So I do not know if Tata looks at it that way and that's why they are not so much bothered yet to put in an effort to compete with Honda and Corolla and so on. Can someone give a Country wide sales data of various models presently in the market. I think this may give some idea as to how the companies make their strategies. What ever it is I am sure everyone will agree that Tata n Mahindra vehicles are tough and best suited for current Indian road condition.

theMAG · 2nd May 2007, 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuMo

What ever it is I am sure everyone will agree that Tata n Mahindra vehicles are tough and best suited for current Indian road condition.

Absolutely. Unfortunately they're talking about a completely different topic in this thread.

navdeep · 2nd May 2007, 17:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Tata should go for a new brand in the higher segment.
A 12 lakh large sedan, no matter how better feature wise vis a vis competition, will not sell with "Tata" logo.
As for taxi image, Tata has something called "Indicab" priced slightly lower, but most taxi's I see are normal DLS and in some cases DLS Turbo.
So unless they increase price(scare away customers) segregation will not happen.
For that matter if anybody makes a < 4lakh car with great FE and amazing interior space, the Taxi market will lap it up.

I fully agree here.. Tata was the first one enter with these attributes so taxi segment grabbed it with both hands. Suppose Swift D is priced near to Indica. It may go the same way.

But Qualis and now Innova did affected Toyota brand in India. Qualis was a big hit in taxi segment but Qualis was not that popular for personal use. Innova is a hit both ways. Tavera has been accepted in taxi segment but ..

It has something to do with existing brand image, segment and design of vehicle.

directinjection · 2nd May 2007, 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvish

Just recently I suggested the Indigo SX to someone looking for a nice chauffer driven car, and I got a blank look from them!!!..

IMHO, even if the Indigo SX was named something else, your friend's response would have been the same. The image ain't because of the name but because of the product.

directinjection · 2nd May 2007, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zappo

The difference in looks and even the quality and level of accessories and fitments between the Indicabs and the 2007 Indicas is huge.

Yeah, the Indicab with the original, undisturbed styling from IDEA looks better!

Mpower · 2nd May 2007, 18:22

Its a great idea. TATA should keeep their existing brand of "TATA" and also launch an upmarket one.

To make sure they do it right , the new car has to have better fit and finish, interiors and NVH, otherwise they'll ruin that brand too. The brand has to be communicated properly to the customer.

Saturn, Scion, Lexus, Infinity, Maybach are all brands that were successfully created to attract new type of customer.

You also have to realize that TATA brand is a very trustworthy one overall (not just for cars)

2nd May 2007, 13:14	#1
kvish BHPian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 627 Thanked: 195 Times	Should the TATAs spin off a new brand for passenger cars? Tata's success has been majorly due to the Sumos, cabs and the indicas and the ACE. I am not saying that their passenger cars havent done well, but their image is suffering a bit because of the success of the other segments. Most of the car manufacturers use different brand names to signify different segments. I wonder why TATAs shouldnt do so. Just recently I suggested the Indigo SX to someone looking for a nice chauffer driven car, and I got a blank look from them!!!.. Infact lot of my friends dont want to buy it because of the 'taxi' branding associated with it...I think its better if they push core passenger vehicles under a new brand. Something like a 'lexus' or an 'acura' kind of brand (of course, take it from an Indian context)....
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 13:58	#2
srishiva Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Bengaluru Posts: 4,375 Thanked: 2,256 Times	and call it "bye bye"
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 14:15	#3
theMAG Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Avon, CT Posts: 7,217 Thanked: 1,807 Times View My Garage	The better option would be to make the taxi variants of a personal car completely different to look at - and I dont mean cosmetically. And sold thru their exisitng CV showrooms
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 14:20	#4
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,334 Thanked: 6,896 Times View My Garage	Interesting question. But I'd have to say no. A lot of people buy Indicas and Indigos because they are solid, reliable and built truck-tough. You and me may not think so, but there's no way hundreds and thousands of cabbies would stake their livelihood on it otherwise. Mahesh, I think you've got it right. Change a few panels on the yellow-board versions, and sell them alongside the Ace and whatnot.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 14:55	#6
rahul_intlad Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 1,579 Thanked: 4 Times	Dont think tata needs a separate division unless they are targetting the premium segment[mercs,beemers] Brings to focus the fiat brand actually,does it not enjoy tata service,reputation of building solid cars and so on.But is that actually translating into anything significant yet.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 15:00	#7
Rtech Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 5,770 Thanked: 359 Times View My Garage	What's stopping the tourist taxi owners from buying the regular version? Unless they artificially price it higher. But then, does this "taxi" business really affect a buyers decision? Frankly, if i was in the market for a no-frills economiser with the maximum space inside (which is basically what the Indica/go market is), I really wouldn't care if the same car is being used by tourist taxi operators. It hasn't affected the Innova market, nor has the Corolla image been diluted with the multitude of corolla taxi's around these days. however, as they move up the food chain, I think separating the brand would be important. Nobody wants a 12 lakh car from a manufacturer that built its name on a 3 lakh one. Hyundai learnt this the hard way.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 15:12	#8
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Tata should go for a new brand in the higher segment. A 12 lakh large sedan, no matter how better feature wise vis a vis competition, will not sell with "Tata" logo. As for taxi image, Tata has something called "Indicab" priced slightly lower, but most taxi's I see are normal DLS and in some cases DLS Turbo. So unless they increase price(scare away customers) segregation will not happen. For that matter if anybody makes a < 4lakh car with great FE and amazing interior space, the Taxi market will lap it up.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 15:28	#9
Zappo Team-BHP Support Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 5,922 Thanked: 2,699 Times	Brand segregation is one thing and segmentation is another. In the case of Tatas even if they do not want to spin-off a separate brand (considering the cost of doing a true separation), a-la Lexus and Acura they may still want to think of segmentation. In fact they are doing that for quite sometime. The Indicabs have been deliberately left in a time warp. Those are actually the pre-2003 Indicas with bare minimum fitments. The difference in looks and even the quality and level of accessories and fitments between the Indicabs and the 2007 Indicas is huge. This alongwith the difference in costs of the Indicabs and the new Indicas ensure to some extent that cab owners mostly veer off to the Indicabs. However that still does not stop many others from using the 'personal' variants as cabs. Here Tatas can trump the practice (if they at all want it that bad) by adding a disclaimer to the warranty statement that any vehicle (except for the cab variants) that has a yellow board or is otherwise used to rent out as a taxi will not be covered by any warranty or free services. I think this will immediately stop this practice. It is another matter that Tatas may not want to do that at all.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 16:20	#10
SuMo BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Mumbai Posts: 27 Thanked: 4 Times	I am from Mumbai and whenever I go out of Mumbai in interior Maharashtra I dont see many ( rather any in some parts) Honda City's or Toyota Corollas or all those hi-fi brand of vehicles. These are seen only in cities. Out on real Indian roads its mainly the TATA , Mahindra Jeeps ( Not many Scorpios though) and Tempo trax etc. So I do not know if Tata looks at it that way and that's why they are not so much bothered yet to put in an effort to compete with Honda and Corolla and so on. Can someone give a Country wide sales data of various models presently in the market. I think this may give some idea as to how the companies make their strategies. What ever it is I am sure everyone will agree that Tata n Mahindra vehicles are tough and best suited for current Indian road condition.
	() Thanks

2nd May 2007, 18:22	#15
Mpower Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 10,409 Thanked: 1,730 Times View My Garage	Its a great idea. TATA should keeep their existing brand of "TATA" and also launch an upmarket one. To make sure they do it right , the new car has to have better fit and finish, interiors and NVH, otherwise they'll ruin that brand too. The brand has to be communicated properly to the customer. Saturn, Scion, Lexus, Infinity, Maybach are all brands that were successfully created to attract new type of customer. You also have to realize that TATA brand is a very trustworthy one overall (not just for cars)
	() Thanks