[Gotcha]

Ever changing policies, rising fuel prices and uncertainty:

https://www.thehindu.com/business/Ec...le37103252.ece
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...w/87193346.cms

I had booked a MG Astor yesterday but this news about introduction of flex fuels is making me feel jittery about going ahead with it. Should I cancel buying a petrol car now and instead wait to buy an EV after a year?

[abhishek46]

Whenever Flex Fuel (E20,E80 or E100 etc.) arrives, I am hoping that it will be sold along alongside the existing regular Petrol (which is E8 or E10 already).

That is how it was introduced in other countries.
Customers should be able to chose the the correct blend which will be suitable for their vehicle.

[aargee]

Originally Posted by Gotcha

Should I cancel buying a petrol car now and instead wait to buy an EV after a year?

Well, if I were you, I go with today's water than tomorrow's (promised) milk!! Why?

• First of all we don't know whether the vehicles will be available in 6 months or 6 years
• Even if available, we don't know if they will be niggle free
• Even if they're niggle free, we don't know about their long term reliability
• Just one news on a mishap is sufficient to instill fear & regret the decision of flex fuel vehicles
• By then the price of whatever vehicle we intent to buy today goes up slightly north
• All the waiting, hope, expectations goes to drain or the hope keeps ongoing & somewhere at someplace a compromise has to be made for the unexpected

Basically this is a difference between using a tried & tested product versus trying & testing a product!

Edit - See the price hike is imminent right now

[SS-Traveller]

Flex fuels is the newest indecisive step towards achieving enviromental nirvana and clear blue skies 365 days a year, after initially affirming that CNG will save our cities from pollution for ever, followed by the declaration that EVs will be the final word in urban personal transportation in India.

Buy what is the most desirable vehicle now, use it as much as you can, hope to keep it for 10-15 years, then sell or scrap it and cut your losses once government policies change. Hold no regrets for the decision you take today, because 5 years later, it might not be flex fuels but gobar gas that the government wants you to run your vehicle on.

[aargee]

This is nearly an OT post...

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Buy what is the most desirable vehicle now, use it as much as you can, hope to keep it for 10-15 years, then sell or scrap it and cut your losses once government policies change. Hold no regrets for the decision you take today, because 5 years later, it might not be flex fuels but gobar gas that the government wants you to run your vehicle on.

Sir, I couldn't help agree with you very very strongly on every word above because I'm reminded of my own decision 20 years ago...

Around early 2000, govt was proposing the end of 2 strokes which indeed happened somewhere by mid of 2000 (I think Max 100 was the last one to be off the production line) & there were rumors that govt will buy the 2S vehicles from owners & will pay a meagre sum; so many were frantically trying to get rid off their 2S motorcycles.

Thus I got a Rx that was totally crap in appearance for a sum of 30K & over the years I burnt my fingers for being motorcycle illiterate (as if I'm in primary school now ); learnt how not to power-up, then scrapped & rebuilt to pristine with my hands all by myself after learning lessons in hard way; ofcourse burnt money there as well, but after all it wasn't ownership experience, it was love affair.

Like how I consider myself lucky to have bought a Rx, I consider myself unfortunate to have forgone buying a beautiful RD 350 around mid 2000 on the same account of 2S ban.

So, I'm a perfect example of your statement above & living a life of both content & regret; content for Rx & regret for RD 350!!

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Flex fuels is the newest indecisive step towards achieving enviromental nirvana...
...
...5 years later, it might not be flex fuels but gobar gas that the government wants you to run your vehicle on.

Indecisive indeed...
https://www.cartoq.com/union-ministe...kari-bs4-cars/

Union minister Nitin Gadkari wants BS4 norms to come back: Here’s why

Union Minister of Road Transport and Highways, Nitin Gadkari has said that he will file an affidavit to the Supreme Court seeking relaxation in the emission norms. He has asked sugar-producing companies to set up ethanol dispensing stations across the stations to ensure timely availability of the fuel when the need comes.

The government rolled out the BS6 emission norms for the automobile manufacturers last year which forced the BS4 engines to go out of production. The current BS6 compliant engines will not be compliant with the emission norms with the higher quantity of ethanol blend in the fuel.

Gadkari plans to increase the quantity of ethanol in the fuel and for that, he will also mandate automobiles manufacturers to produce flex-fuel engines in the automobiles.

In a webinar organised by the Indian Sugar Mills Association (ISMA), Nitin Gadkari said, “Why doesn’t the sugar industry start setting up ethanol dispensing stations? That will help the blending programme in the country. The problem is flex engines using a mix of ethanol and petrol of up to 100 percent, are not compliant with BS VI emission norms. But as compared to BS VI petrol engine norms having 20 per cent ethanol, the flex engine where we are using 100 percent ethanol in BS IV, the (resulting) pollution is very negligible. So I will file an affidavit before the SC to seek permission for BS IV norms for the flex petrol engine.”

India wants to reduce the dependency on fuel imports
India is a net fuel importer with about 85% fuel demand met with the crude oil import. In many countries like Brazil and even the parts of the USA, blending ethanol with petrol is a common practice. It is a way to reduce the fuel import bills. India also produces excess sugar and with the step of blending ethanol with petrol, the problem of excess production will get addressed too.

The procurement of ethanol by the oil companies has already increased in the recent past. In 2014, the oil companies acquired Rs 38 crore worth of ethanol that has now increased to an estimated Rs 173 crore in FY 2020. The government has also increased the blending from 1.52 per cent to over 5 per cent.

The final target of blending ethanol to petrol is 20 per cent. Earlier the target was set to achieve the same in 2030 but the government has revised the timeline and now aims to achieve the same by 2025. By April 2020, the government aims to blend 10 per cent ethanol into petrol.

Gadkari has repeatedly asked the automobile manufacturers to launch flex-fuel based engines that are capable to use even higher amounts of the blend. The flex-fuel engines can even run on up to 100 percent ethanol. Once the 10% blend is achieved, the phased rollout of the ethanol-based fuel will begin in the country.

[Vitruvius]

EV charging is yet to catch up to the convenience of refueling your vehicle at a fuel pump.
If I was you, I'd get the Astor.
Rest assured, you will find a pump that sells petrol

[navrddy]

EVs are distant luxury dream.
Where is the infrastructure build up for EV's.
To have reliable (good infra) petrol and diesel fuel stations, it took so many years.

I challenge anyone to take EV's on longdistance run as part of normal life like in Petrol or diesel counterparts.

Combustion engines will stay, they may be polluting. But they are reliable sources of motive power.

[Hayek]

Gadkari has the habit of shooting his mouth off in every random direction. But as those who have watched Yes Minister would recall, politicians love telling their audience what they want to hear - and a Maharashtra politician is bound to be nice to the sugar lobby, irrespective of what he really thinks.

Moving back on topic, the fact is that the existing parc of cars cannot use flex fuels. So the government will need to make normal E10 Petrol available for at east the next 15 years. Go ahead and buy your petrol car.

[anjan_c2007]

I think the Union Cabinet needs FLEXI MINISTERS and the Babudom FLEXI BABUS to better run the country. That is, if one Minister/Babu looks tired in thought, word or deed, he or she could be rested to make place for the other. Then, if this other one looks tired the other one can take over.

[aargee]

Originally Posted by Gotcha

Ever changing policies, rising fuel prices and uncertainty:

Some good news for you - https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post5182718 (Maruti sleeping at the wheel | Where are the new car launches? | Why is Maruti missing new trends?)

Only question is the uncertainty of availability still prevails

[rakesh_r]

Originally Posted by aargee

Some good news for you - https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post5182718 (Maruti sleeping at the wheel | Where are the new car launches? | Why is Maruti missing new trends?)

Only question is the uncertainty of availability still prevails

Sometimes I wonder if Maruti has good amount of influence on decision making of the govt, flexing its muscles to suit its interest, especially when they started bad mouthing diesels. Their marketing team did try to brainwash the mango man for sure.

[aargee]

Originally Posted by rakesh_r

Sometimes I wonder if Maruti has good amount of influence on decision making of the govt...man for sure.

In a pure undulatory theoretical terms it's called lobbying & yes all auto makers do it & MSIL for sure has to be forerunner

[Brishti]

About two years ago I was pondering to buy a Compass or wait to buy an EV 'Kona' and use my current car till that point of time.

Sadly my current car at that time gave me so much issues that I had to buy a new car but today when I look at the EV charging is still not there and had I bought the Kona I would be left stranded. Promises from politicians and car companies have to be taken with a bucket load of salt.

[Chrome6Boy]

Buy an EV but not because of flexi fuel.

I see people choosing IC engines over EVs purely because of a trip or two they may make long distance every year. Complaining about the government and their policies, complaining about India and its charging infrastructure. Unfairly comparing India with developed countries and their Tesla superchargers. All for something they'd do once or twice a year.

Most people use their cars inside the city and charge overnight in their homes. Nothing can beat the EV in acceleration, quietness, environmental contribution and of course fuel costs. One thing which is likely is that the cost of fossil fuel costs going up.

So if you need to regularly take your car on long distance trips buy a petrol. Otherwise go with your instincts and buy an EV.