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Old 29th April 2011, 14:50   #1
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Default A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Hello folks. Finally I am getting down to write and share with you ownership log of three cars in our immediate family:

1. A White Santro XG BS-II, purchased by me in Jan 2005. Currently at 131k km's. My first car! Let's refer this car as white santro in this ownership report
2. A Black Santro XL eRLX BS-III, purchased by my wife in Aug 2006. Currently at 75k km's. My wife's first Car! Let's refer this car as black santro in this ownership report
3. A Tata Manza Aura ABS Diesel BS-III, purchased by us in Feb 2010. Currently at 30k km's. Our first Diesel car!

I have over 2.25 lakh km's of talking to do in the next few posts! So please bear with me if they are long and get boring sometimes .

I am intentionally creating one thread for the three cars. It's going to be easy to keep the updates/ discussions at one place. However, to keep it simple for readers, I am going to ensure that from now on, in one post I refer to only one car with reference in subject line. Thank you in advance for reading and your suggestions.

Back in Jan 2005, I was working with Hyundai Motors in their Delhi office. It was my first job, barely 1 year of experience and I was commuting to office using my first bike, very reliable and VFM Hero Honda Splender. Travelling 35 km's a day in NCR traffic by bike was not easy. Hence the itching of buying a car was always there. It was even more, as I was working with a car OEM.

So finally decided to buy and it was a white Santro XG. Being Hyundai employee had it's own benefits. I got a Jan 2005 made car at Dec 2004 model price. This was roughly 30-35k benefit. However the bigger benefits I came to know of later. Got almost every Hyundai approved accessory at 50% price directly from the Hyundai vendors. I fitted Leather seats and steering cover, sony music system, Hyundai cobra security system with ultrasonic sensors, Minda gear lock. Went for own insurance. Floor mats and mud flaps were provided by the HMP (Hyundai owned operated dealership) in Delhi. Got the 4 year extended warranty at cost to Hyundai. It was a normal practice at that time to issue it to employees at cost to company (around 50% of normal price). Car was financed from ICICI bank and interest rate was lower by ~1% from normal due to Hyundai's retail finance tie-up with ICICI. All this might seem small now, but at that time I was in the beginning of my career, so these savings mattered.

Total OTR cost at that time came to about 3.6L. This is when I came to know how much margin dealers can make in selling accessories and insurance. And why they give free accessories and incurance instead of cash discount.

Car was delivered to me on 27th of Jan 2005. I drove it for about 2k km's in next 1 month (did a trip to Patiala, my hometown) and got an offer for a better job in Hyderabad. So I shifted to Hyd and car was transported there. Daily office commute in Hyd was only 4 km's and even with weekend commuting, I used to drive only ~300 km's a month. So in the first 18 months, till Aug 2006, car did only 6k km's. During this time, I got the free services done at Kun Hyundai in Hyd. No expenses, at that time, even engine oil and filters were covered in free services. Those were my pre-Tbhp days so I don't even know which engine oils etc they were using. I now feel how uneducated I was at that time!

In Aug' 06, I got an opportunity to go to a 6 month assignment to US. Though, initially it was planned for 6 months, I had a feeling it would get extended. I decided to send the white santro to my home town, so my dad can use it. It made sense since there won't be anyone in Hyd to look after the car while I would be away. Also, my dad's old Maruti 800 was showing signs of ageing so it was a good upgrade for him to use the Santro.

We sold off the 800 and he started using santro while I flew off to US. His annual running is about 25k km's. Yes, I know, this kind of running justifies a diesel. But that was time of pre CRDI's (some were there like accent CRDI but not in budget) and we already had a petrol. Did not make sense to sell of an existing car for a diesel. My dad is 60, drives the car himself and so far he has driven only petrols. We also did not want him to adapt his driving style to diesels and neither wanted to hire a driver.

So the car was with my dad will Jan 08 when I came back from US. Yes, as anticipated, my 6 month trip got extended to 18 months. During this time, the car was maintained by KLG Hyundai in Chandigarh. All regular services, oil, filter changes were done on time. No issues whatsoever with the car. Glad I did not leave the car in Hyd.

When I came back, the ODO was at about 60k km's. Car was at the Delhi IGI airport to pick me up when I landed and I drove it back to Patiala. It drove smooth, as good as new. No issues. I drove Hertz rented cars in US for 18 months. One to two months rentals at a time and as you can imagine, I was spoilt. Some cars I got to drive there were - Pontiac Grand Prix, Ford 500 (later named as 2009 Taurus), Subaru Forrster, Toyota Camry, Hyundai Sonata and some 4WD's during winters. This was my best time in terms of driving experiences at no cost to me . Ah.. more on this later!

So I was back home. Stayed with the parents for a few weeks and it was them time to go back to Hyd and join office. Obviously, my dad offered that I can take the santro to hyd and he will buy another. I decided to buy something myself in Hyd and let him continue to use the white santro in Patiala itself.

I did not have plans to stay in Hyd for long. Wanted to move back to North soon to be able to closer to family and friends. So picked up a used Corsa sail from a collegue in Hyd. The car was in good condition. I used it for about 1 year and 8k km's there and sold at a depreciation of Rs.5k. So in Feb' 09, I changed my job and came back to Noida. During this one year, met my better half in Hyd. Got married and it was the two of us who in Noida and w/o a car temporarily. At this time, White Santro was at about 80k km's and only asking for regular services. No issues whatsoever. What an ownership experience. Everything in the car including battery, clutch was stock. Only things changed were tires (at 75k).

Last edited by .anshuman : 3rd May 2011 at 11:05. Reason: Posts Merged.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 11:09   #2
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Incidently, my wife is also from Punjab and she was working in Hyd when we met. Before Hyd, she was also working in Delhi and she happended to buy a Black Santro XL in Aug 06 from the same dealer (HMP, Delhi). So, when she moved to Hyd, she left her car at her parents place in Punjab. The car was used by her brother for daily college commuting.

So, we were in back to Noida in Feb' 09 and needed a car. Wify got back her Aug 06 model, Black Santro XL with 36k km's. I drove it first and was amazed at how smooth, clean this car was. I don't have much to write about this car's purchase history since my wife does not remember much. I do remember that this was also financed through ICICI, a 5 year loan which will be over in Jul' 11.

This car did not have any accessories except gear lock. So the first thing I did was to add some. Added car seat covers, Sony music system and Auto cop remote locking. Feature wise XL is same as XG with the exception of body colored bumbers, internally adjustable OVRM's and rear wiper (XG have these).

So here we were, living happily in Noida with a black Santro with us while the white santro was with my dad in Patiala.

In next 3 months, black santro was due for 40k service. I went to HMP on Mathura road for service. No issues except for a little bit of tic tic sound coming from right from wheel when driving below 40kmph. They did the following:

1. Paid Service ~800
2. Engine oil flush ~350
3. Engine oil change ~550 and added something called supercharger to it ~350
3. Oil filter change ~80
4. Radiator flush ~350, coolant change ~500
5. Front brake pads change ~1150

Total cost ~4k. Felt a little on higher side but these were my pre-Tbhp days. ODO wire was creating the tic tic sound and was adjusted/ greased and it fixed the issue.

One of the best things happended this time. I was hooked to T-bhp by an office collegue. Thanks so much GoSlow. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/members/goslow.html. So here started my journey on this wonderful forum with so much information and very nice members.

In Dec 2009, black santro was touching 50k. Time for a service. This car (well all of them actually) continued to serve us very well. Did many Delhi - punjab trips. FE was always 18-20 on highways. Local was 14-16. Lower numbers are with AC. So again went to HMP for service. No issues to report. They did the following.

1. Paid Service ~800
2. Engine oil flush ~350
3. Engine oil change ~550 and added something called supercharger to it ~350
4. Oil filter change ~80
5. Suspension check and other ~400

Total ~3k. At this service, I let the SA do what he suggested. They flushed the engine oil at 40k and again at 50k. After this service, I decided not to go to HASS any more. The car was anyways out of warranty. And with T-bhp I had gathered good amount of information myself and understood how easy it is to maintain a reliable petrol car yourself with the help of a good mechanic. So this was last time for me to visit HASS for a service.

Before this service, at about 45k, the tyres were changed from crappy goodyear GPS2 to Apollo acelere tubeless one's. This made a very good difference to the comfort. Total cost 8,100. 7,600 for tyres (4) and 500 for tyre change, rim straightening, balancing and air valve nozzels.

Beginning 2010, we felt the need of a second car. We already had two petrols in the family. The running costs needed to be kept in check and it was sure that the next car will be a diesel. We needed more space so it had to be a sedan. The budget allowed a max of 7L. Recently, Tata Manza was launched and I was smitten by T-bhp review on it. So we test drove the Manza twice and finally booked the 2010 model in Jan 2010. The variant selected was Aura ABS QJD Satin Gold. Did not consider Dzire for many reasons (space, looks etc). Ikon and Logan also did not click to mind. Anything else was above budget. No offence to anyone but Manza appealed more to us.

I booked the car with the Tata dealer in Patiala as we wanted to register it in Punjab. 2% road tax at that time was the reason. The car was delivered to us on 1st Feb 2010 with 2 km's on the ODO. The prices were as follows:

Ex-S/R 630k
Ins 10k (tfd 50% NCB from White Santro)
Regn 14k
Extended waranty 5k
Tata OE alloys (4) 16k

Added seat covers and gear lock later for about 5k. Total OTR including accessories was 6.8L. Immense VFM for the space and features and in our budget .

With this purchase, Manza becase our main family car and Black santro as my wife's office car.

Last edited by .anshuman : 3rd May 2011 at 11:07. Reason: Merged Posts.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 12:58   #3
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Default March 2010: White santro - first problem and current stage

Around Mar'10, white santro was at 115k km's . Doing her duty very very reliably. This is when the first problem surfaced. Power steering pump started creating whining sound. Bearings went kaput. Got it checked at HASS in Chandigarh, they wanted to change the whole PS unit. Cost 15k. So instead of the whole unit, Dad got the bearing replaced at a local mechanic. Problem fixed, or we thought so. 2 weeks later, the sound again started. This time the PS unit oil seal went kaput. Dad got it fixed at HASS. PS oil was refilled. Problem fixed, or again we thought so. Well the PS problem was fixed for sure but the mileage of the car dropped to 14-15 from earlier 18-19.

With dad's running, the drop in mileage was costing a lot. So I suggested him to get a full service done at HASS with engine tuning. This did not help. I decided to pitch in and got the white santro to Noida. The black santro at this time was around 58k. I got a full service of black santro done at a reliable local mechanic (see next post). Sent the black santro after service to dad and got the white one here.

After detecting the drop in mileage, at about 122k km's I got the following things done:

1. A major service. Engine oil, oil filter, air filter, fuel filter, gear oil, spark plugs, coolant, brake fluid etc were changed. Injectors and throttle body was cleaned. TB was opened and cleaned.
2. Since the car was on original clutch at 122k km, got the clutch changed. Again due to open roads of punjab, original clutch lasted this much.
3. Doing the above did not solve the problem, so went to HASS and got the engine scan done with OBD. This did not detect any problems whatsoever. All sensors are working fine and according to them, everything is okay

After all this the car was still on 14/15 mileage. Driving the car did not give any clue of any problem whatsoever. There was no loss of pick-up, no jerks, no missing, new clutch seemed to be okay. Infact driving it gave the feeling that it's almost a new car with no problem at all. That's the reason we didn't want to sell it but use for another couple of years. It's in perfect shape mechanically and otherwise. Also we have not done any mods to the car, it's on stock size tyres.

So we were not able to detect the reason for drop in FE. And it was a sudden drop not gradual which can be associated with the age of vehicle. The other black Santro returns a mileage of 18/19 in similar conditions.

I put up my queries on the thread below and go some proposed answers.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...eage-woes.html

At 131k km's, I got another service done at my mechanic's place and this time flushed the engine. Engine oil and filter was changed. Also replaced the battery to Amaron. The OE battery was exide and lasted good 6 years and 131k km's!

This was 5 months back. My wife went on maternity leave and after this the car has not been used much. I take it out every weekend for a 4-5 km spin to keep the battery charged. Well, now my wife is starting her office back after mat leave so she will start using this car again. Will see how the mileage comes now. In summary, in last 6+ years and 131k km's all she needed is the following:

1. Fuel and regular services
2. Tires at 75k km's
3. PS pump bearing and seal at 115k km's
4. Clutch at 122k km's
5. Battery at 131k km's

No breakdown, no insurance claim.

Will update further experience on this car as available. I know I need to add some snaps of this while beauty to this thread, will do so soon. As of now, I do not have any plans to sell this car (not for atleast 3-4 years). Even at 131k km's, she is in a perfect condition mechanically and otherwise (only a few scratches on bumpers). She is still so reliable that I have no issues with my wife using this car. Again, what an ownership experience!

Thank You for reading.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 3rd May 2011 at 09:55.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 13:46   #4
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Default June 2010 : Black Santro - 58k service and current stage

As I mentioned above, I sent to black santro to my dad after getting a full service done at a reliable local mechanic with oils etc procured by me. This was at 58k km's. I got the following done:

1. Changed the engine oil to Mobil 1 0W40, changed oil filter
2. Change Fuel filter, air filter, gear oil and spark plugs
3. Got the brakes cleaned, alignment, wheel balancing and tyre rotation done.

Cost despite of fully synthetic oil was around 4k. So much less than HASS. Car drove as good as new. No issues whatsoever.

Since then, black Santro is doing active duty with my dad. Mileage around 17-19 in general. Open roads of punjab contribute a lot to this. Current ODO at ~75k km. Since I used Mobil1, plan to drain it at 20k km interval. At 70k km's, I changed the engine oil filter and topped up the oil. The battery was also changed to Amaron at 70k mark. The OE battery was again exide and lasted 4.5 years and 70k km's. Next service at 80k km mark with timing belt change. The clutch is a little harder now but is not slipping. Will probably change it as 100k mark unless it starts slipping earlier.

Again, no breakdown ever, no insurance claim, no issues at all. Will add some snaps soon. Will update further experience on this car as available. The expectations from this car are already very high due to benchmark set by her white sister! I am sure she won't disappoint ever. All she needed so far apart from fuel and services is a set of tires and a battery.

Thank You for reading.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 2nd May 2011 at 16:20.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 15:01   #5
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So as I mentioned, we purchased Tata Manza Aura ABS on Feb 1, 2010. So a Tata car huh?

How will it age? Will it be reliable? Will it be as reliable as our other two cars? How about snob value. Blah.. blah.. blah. So many questions in wify's and my mind.

Well, the car is here and has done 30k km's already in last 15 months . How they were will be updated in detail in the next few posts. Here I will put a summary of the Manza experience so far. Please read on!

1. Very spacious car - front, rear, boot space is from above the segment
2. VFM to buy - at 6.8L OTR, I would have normally got a mid model hatchback like punto or i20
3. VFM to run - I get average mileage of around 18-19 (50% local, 50% highway). It comes to around 2rs per km to run
4. VFM to maintain - I spent around Rs.9k so far in services in last 30k km's (including free labor services)
5. Is this car niggle free - No. There are smaller things which need attention off and on. The only issue I have with the car is that there has not been a service in which I did not have any small problems to mention. I would love to go for a service and say, no issues with the car, please do the scheduled oil, filter changes and general check-up. I had many services like that with our two santros. None with Manza so far. At the same time the issues have been minor and considering what the car offers in return, can be ignored.

6. If I am again looking at below 7L budget and need a diesel sedan, will I buy this car again - Yes
7. If there is no budget constraint, will I buy this car again - No

1st free service at 1000 km:

Problems to report - car pulling to the left, warning buzzer not working. Both problems from Day 1

Resolution - wheel alignment done. Problem solved. Warning buzzer not in stock. They wanted to charge for alignment but since it was a brand new car, they finally agreed to do it for free. General check-up, washing and cleaning done. Total cost - 0.

2nd Free service at 5000 km:

Problems to report - jerk while releasing clutch after a down or upshift especally at lower gears, warning buzzer not working.

Resolution - SA took a test drive. Said the clutch is okay but even if the jerking is there, it will reduce after a few thousand km's as clutch plate will run-in. I did not agree to this but decided to observe till next service at 10k. Warning buzzer again not in stock. General check-up, washing and cleaning done. Total cost - 0.

3rd Free service at 10000 km:

Problems to report - sounds from suspension, jerk while releasing clutch after a down or upshift especally at lower gears, warning buzzer not working.

Resolution - SA again took a test drive. Said the clutch is okay but he will do bleeding. It was done and seemed like the problem is resolved. Anti roll bar rubber bushes were relaced. Warning buzzer was replaced in warranty. General check-up, washing and cleaning done. Total cost - ~30 (anti roll bar rubber bushes).

First 10k km's happened in about 6 months. Car returned FE of about 16 local and 22 highway with AC.

At about 15k km's, one day while going to office I saw that the temp meter in was going into the red zone. When I observed this for first time, assuming the car was overheating, I turned off the engine and opened the bonnet. It was all normal in there. Water/coolant full, no steam, engine temp seemed okay (to my hands of course), no smoke or smell. Then why was the needle in red? I cranked the car in idle while the bonnet was still open. The needle was still above the half mark and engine sound was fine but fan radiator did not start. At that temp, I expected the fan to start in high speed. I turned on the AC and both fans started. Went to office and parked the car. Next saturday went to TASS. Till then drove only with AC on.

They first connected the OBD tool to read the actual water temp. To our surprise, the water temp after some high revs was only 97-98 while the temp guage was going in red. At about 99 the fans also started and now the guage was at the end of red. So we knew that the engine is fine, the car actually never got heated, it was the guage acting up. It was a good releif for me! Now the temp meter could be going wrong either due to bad temp sensor or bad meter iself. They first changed the temp sensor but the problem remained, then also changed the meter, still the problem remained. Finally it turned out to be faulty earthing connection which caused this. I had also seen the internal car lights flickering which I reported to them. That also got fixed after fixing the earthing. RPM meter in the car used to fluctuate sometime, which has not happened after this. At the start up, the ABS check light used to remain on for 10-15 secs earlier. I used to think that may be ECU takes time to ensure ABS system is fine. Also it used to go off after 10-15 secs so I did not bother earlier. After fixing the earthing, it goes off in 1-2 secs.

I did not think one earthing issue could cause so much problem and make us feel that engine is overheating. This was the first time I had to go to a service centre for a non service related visit. That too for a car with 15k on the ODO.

While I was at the TASS, got the engine oil and filter replaced. I wanted to maintain oil change interval of 15k km's instead of 20k as suggested by Tata. They filled 3.2 litres of Mobil1 0W40 (more on this later) and replaced filter. Total Cost 4.1k. Got the wheel alignment, balancing and rotation done from outside.

Completed 20k 4th free service in Dec 2010. Costed Rs.2.3k. Parts changed were Fuel Filter (Rs.2k approx) and Air Filter (Rs.300 approx). AC filter was cleaned. Had a few small issues which I do not recall now, but they were small except the jerking issue which came back again. I am yet to get a resolution for this problem. I got the Engine Oil and Filter changed at 15k km's and that was for Rs.4.1k. So maintenance cost of about Rs.6.5k for first 20k km's. Also got the underbody anti rust treatment done. Costed another 2.5k.

First 20k km's happened in about 10 months. Average FE of about 16-17 local and 22-23 highway.

The SA tried to push for wheel alignment and balancing which I refused. I got that + rotation done at 15k km's outside, next at 30k, unless feel there is any alighment or balancing issue e.g. pulling or viabration. He also wanted to do some fuel lines cleaning etc for Rs.1,650 which seemed very expensive to me so again refused. His initial service estimate was Rs.6k and I was like people buy Tata as they are VFM cars (to maintain as well). 6k for Manza service (w/o oil and filter change)! But then being a member of TBHP helps, my bill was 2.3k from initial estimate of 6k.

Inquired about the paid service and they said it's Rs.1250+taxes. Seemed a little high, should be less than 1k, but then this must be Tata fixed rate. Also, there is not much to do at 30k, 50k service. Those services do not require any part changes (unless something is wrong), so all they will do will be washing/ cleaning and general check-up (of course Air Filter cleaning, which is a must at every 10k km). Overall those services seem like a waste of time and money. I think they should have suggested a 15k service interval for Manza like Linea with oil change at every service.

As I mentioned above, at 15k km's, got the engine oil changed at TASS and they filled Mobil1 0W40. Their recommended drain interval is 20k km. To my surprise, after driving for 10k km's since last oil change the engine tone on the car had become pretty rough. It felt strained. I did some research and found out that Mobil1 0W40 is primarily a petrol oil (API-SM), but for diesel it's rated only at API-CF. I even went to the TASS to check the ratings on their 210L drum and it is indeed CF. I came to know that Mobil's syn oil for diesel is Delvac 1 5W40 which is rated at CI4+. Stupid TASS people.

BTW it was at Oberoi Cars in Noida and they are a new dealership. I wish I had known a little about these oil grades earlier. I also checked the Petronas Selenia they are filling in Linea and Puntos is also CF rated. So much for paying for syn over Rs.1000/L.

So at 25k km's, I changed the engine oil and filter outside TASS. I filled Mobil Delvac MX. Costed Rs.250/L and Rs.120 for Elofic oil flter. Rs.50 for oil change. Total damage ~900. Drove the car for about 500 km after the oil change and it felt smooth, much better than earlier. This was in Feb 2011.

More details on engine oil grades etc in the threads below:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...gine-oils.html
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modify...neral-oil.html

Last edited by .anshuman : 3rd May 2011 at 11:09. Reason: Posts Merged.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 17:21   #6
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In Feb 2011, I changed the tires on our Manza to Apollo Acelere 195/60R15. OE tires were Bridgestone B250 185/60R15 and were 1 year and 25k km old. New tires are mounted on the OE Manza Alloys from tata (5.5Jx15). Have driven for about 350km after the tire change. A couple of observations :

1. Steering feel has improved a lot, it's slightly heavy now and earlier high speed vagueness (very little) is gone.
2. Car feels more stable and planted now, body roll has reduced a bit as well. Ride quality has improved even further, thanks to the 6mm more sidewall. Also, I think due to better tires, unsteer will reduce a bit. Not yet checked on this.
3. Wider tires go very well with exterior dimensions of the car. While theoretically 195 are 10 mm more than 185, but in fact they are 15 mm more. Section width on 185 tires is 185 while on 195 it's 200. Please see this link http://www.apollotyres.com/downloads...ar_acelere.pdf. Though overall circumference is larger only by 2%, they fill the wheel arches better as well.
4. Speedo/ ODO got corrected by earlier error of 2%. Those who travel on NH1 will know that distance between Delhi ISBT to Ambala Cantt bus stand is exactly 201km. On my earlier tires ODO used to show 205 km for this 201km distance. That's corrected now.
5. FE does not seem to have come down. Except for may be 2-3% which in a way is due to correct ODO readings now.

Those planning to change tires on Manza (QJD), I would highly recommend to go for 195/60R15 than going for stock size. On petrol this may affect FE. I am not yet aware that this will affect the warranty or not. It may not as I am continuing the OE alloy rims and tires are very slightly upsized. Tata folks may not even notice this.

Now the cost part. I got the new tires @4.2k (195/60R15) per piece and sold the 25k km used one's @1.7k (185/60R15) per piece. Had to pay exact 10k for 4 tires. Also changed to steel wheel nuts, OE one's were iron and very small in size. Had to get a new wheel spanner as well. Additional 600 for this. Tire change, alignment and balancing was done free. Any comments on the prices? I was also getting Michelin Primacy LC @5.2k per piece, but did not want to spend that much.

We have been using Acelere on our santros (3 sets so far) and are more than happy with these. Low noise, decent grip, long life and reasonable price. Santro size is 155/70R13, but I think they should perform the same in large size as well. Any comments?

Towards the end of April' 11, Manza was at 30k km's. Time for first paid service. As usual, had a list of problems to be resolved at 30k service. Problems (Manza has hydraulic clutch):

1. The clutch has become harder than earlier and I was experiencing this for about last 15k km's.

2. While shifting between 1st, 2nd, 3rd gears (both up and down shift) and releasing clutch after shift results in a one time jerk (no matter how slowly the clutch is released).

3. Gear lever has developed a little bit of play. Like in neutral or any gear I can feel that there is up/down and left/right play in the lever. It's not much but ~1 inch of movement on the top of the lever.

4. AC compressor creates noise and viabrations only when the car is stationary. As car moves and RPM increases, the noise and viabrations go away. I can hear the sound with windows closed and viabrations are felt at steering, gear, clutch etc.

I get my car serviced at Sterling Automobile in Noida (don't have better options, I guess). Last week I called for a test drive of new Manza to check on any of these issues. The new car did not have any of these issues. I know the clutch in my car is not slipping as I get very decent mileage (17-18 local and 22-23 highway). Also RPM is consistant with the speed at relevant gear (say about 2k rpm at 85 in 5th gear). There is no juddering on releasing the clutch.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Got the service done. They changed the second (lower) fan and that fixed the viabrations issue. They also changed the indicator stalk as it was doing minor kat kat when turning. Both in warranty. SA wanted me to go for cat con cleaning. This is not costly (~400 bucks) but I told him will do at 40k service. Or should I have got that done? Does it help?

They adjusted the gear linkage and that reduced the gear lever play and associated jerking. Clutch hardness was measured at 11.5 which is much within tolerated limits (16) so was okay. Apart from general check-up and washing cleaning, nothing else was needed to be done. Car felt better than earlier. Cost Rs.1,250+tax (only paid service charge). After the service, got the oil changed outside with engine flush. Again used Mobil Delvac MX. STP engine flush was used. My next oil change has be at TASS to keep the warranty intact. Will see what to do.

Total Maintenance Cost so far at 30k km's:

1. Oil + Filter change at 15k - 4,100
2. 20k service - 2,300
3. Oil + Filter change at 25k - 900
4. Oil + Filter change at 30k - 1,100
5. 30k paid service 1,400

Total of about 10k for 30k km's. Apart from this, underbody treatment costed 2.5k and tires change costed 10.6k.

So as of now, Manza is a little over 30k km mark. Next planned service is at 40k km. I am being told that I need to get the oil changed at TASS for warranty to be in effect. How can I make them use oil provided by me and still have warranty? If not possible, then I plan to ask them to fill Selenia WR 5W40 (Fiat recommended oil). Heard from many that it's good. Other that these TASS fills only Mobil1 0W40 or Castrol EDGE 5W40 (both are petrol specific synthetics). What do you suggest? Is Selenia WR 5W40 good for a Diesel? I have plans to do the following at 40k service:

1. Engine oil+filter change
2. Diesel filter change
3. Engine decarb, Cat con clening and intercooler cleaning (are these required?)
4. Fix Small ratteling from dashboard under the steering
5. Fix any other issues (if any)

So, in summary, with a few hiccups, life with Manza has been good. 15 months, 30k km's, low running and maintenance cost, good space and practicality.

One thing is clear, owning a car with some niggles teaches you a lot about cars, oils and spares in general. With some of my Manza experiences, I have gained decent amount of knowledge about engine oils, cooling system of cars etc.

Tata makes good cars and sells them at VFM prices, what they lack is attention to detail in Tata Service dept and service stations and hence their cars turn out to be less reliable in long run. These are just my views and I am sure all dealers are not the same. Some would definitely be very good. Please take a look at the following post.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2270096

I have some plans of modifications for this car but only after a year from now. First I need to make up my mind as to if I would like to keep this car for long enough like the santros (atleast close to 1.5L km's).

Will keep updating this thread and surely add photographs of this car as well. Thank You again for reading.

Last edited by .anshuman : 3rd May 2011 at 11:08. Reason: Posts Merged.
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Old 3rd May 2011, 11:24   #7
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Bumping this thread once as per rules to bring it in new posts. Thanks
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Old 3rd May 2011, 14:50   #8
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Very nice thread! Well written with plenty of detail and good observations! Only thing missing are some pics of the cars!

Looking forward to regular updates.
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Old 3rd May 2011, 15:25   #9
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

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Originally Posted by anekho View Post
Very nice thread! Well written with plenty of detail and good observations! Only thing missing are some pics of the cars!

Looking forward to regular updates.
Thanks. Yes, pics are the next step to add.

I just realised that many of the posts above have been merged by moderators. I had structured them in a certain way to help read through easily.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 3rd May 2011 at 15:55.
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Old 11th May 2011, 13:54   #10
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Hey Amit, Congratulations on the cars, and thank you for the d-e-t-a-i-l-e-d description of the ownership experience and cost of ownership of the Manza in particular.

I'm glad to see that the vehicle is performing its duty well, though let down by poor TATA A.S.S. I wonder when they'll pull up their socks in that department. Will truly bring many many more customers without investing too much more in QA.

Please keep us posed as you continue to clock up the miles on this beauty. And yes - PICS!!
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Old 20th June 2011, 17:24   #11
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Hey, Amit, thanks for such a wonderful thread, especially on the Manza. I have been wanting to write on my Manza for sooo long, but was too lazy.

One thing I would like to add - in Mumbai, we have a Tata company service centre, owned, run, managed by Tata Motors, all people are Tata employees, etc. My repair costs come to about half that of normal service centres. These guys make a sincere effort to put as much as possible under warranty (I have taken 2+2 years extended warranty). Also, the booking of the servicing on the internet is a great +. In case you have such a Tata company service centre in Delhi / Punjab, would recommend you try it out.

Had a query - how much did OE alloy wheels cost? They did not have them when I bought the car (Apr. '10).

Cheers!
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Old 21st June 2011, 10:55   #12
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

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Originally Posted by essdee1972 View Post
Hey, Amit, thanks for such a wonderful thread, especially on the Manza. I have been wanting to write on my Manza for sooo long, but was too lazy.

One thing I would like to add - in Mumbai, we have a Tata company service centre, owned, run, managed by Tata Motors, all people are Tata employees, etc. My repair costs come to about half that of normal service centres. These guys make a sincere effort to put as much as possible under warranty (I have taken 2+2 years extended warranty). Also, the booking of the servicing on the internet is a great +. In case you have such a Tata company service centre in Delhi / Punjab, would recommend you try it out.

Had a query - how much did OE alloy wheels cost? They did not have them when I bought the car (Apr. '10).

Cheers!
Thanks. Too bad we don't have Coco type Tata service centres in NCR area. OE alloys costed 4k each w/o exchanging the steel rims. Wheel centre hub caps are additional 160 rs each I think.
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Old 21st June 2011, 11:23   #13
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White Santro completed 133k km's last week. It was running perfectly fine but obviously showing signs of aging. ~6.5 years and 133k km's. Moreover, recent hikes in petrol prices was costing a lot to run this car for about 2k km's per month.

So we decided to sell this car and get a Diesel hatchback. As soon as we decided, we got a buyer for the car. Finally we have sold the White santro on 13th June to a used car dealer in Delhi. We got 1.55L. I feel this is a good price but the car was in very good condition both mechanically and otherwise. Still it was a 6.5 years and 133k km's old car. This was my first car and with a heavy heart, I let it go. This car served us very well throughout. No breakdown, major problems etc in 133k km's. Amazing ownership experience .

As a replacement, a Diamond White Ford Figo Titanium 1.4 Diesel has been booked by me through my co's car lease scheme. Expecting to get the car by this monthend. Will start a seperate ownership thread for that as we get the car and drive a little bit.

~~~~~~~

Black santro is nearing 80k km's mark and is scheduled for service at my friendly mechanic this Saturday. I plan to do engine oil change (Total 7000), oil filter change (Elofic), air filter change (Elofic), clutch change to Valeo (became too hard, but not slipping), gear oil change (Castrol), timing belt change (Gates), Power steering fluid change and Brake fluid change. Spark plugs, brakes will be checked and cleaned. TB will be cleaned. Wheel alignment, balancing and rotation will also be done. No problems to report in the car otherwise.

~~~~~~~

My Manza just thouched 34k km's mark. She is doing just fine, not as great as our other cars. But then may be it's me expecting too much from her.

Thank you for reading.
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Old 15th July 2011, 15:54   #14
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Default Re: Updates

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
Black santro is nearing 80k km's mark and is scheduled for service at my friendly mechanic this Saturday. I plan to do engine oil change (Total 7000), oil filter change (Elofic), air filter change (Elofic), clutch change to Valeo (became too hard, but not slipping), gear oil change (Castrol), timing belt change (Gates), Power steering fluid change and Brake fluid change. Spark plugs, brakes will be checked and cleaned. TB will be cleaned. Wheel alignment, balancing and rotation will also be done. No problems to report in the car otherwise.

.
Hi Amit,

Great write up thanks again for the tips that you have provided for my Santro cooling issues.

please provide the contact details of your friendly mechanic , there is 80000 km service due for my santro.

thanks
SRI
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Old 15th July 2011, 16:09   #15
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Originally Posted by svpatra View Post
Hi Amit,

Great write up thanks again for the tips that you have provided for my Santro cooling issues.

please provide the contact details of your friendly mechanic , there is 80000 km service due for my santro.

thanks
SRI
I have sent the details in a pm.
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