[mobike008]

Fellow BHPians,

I’m in a bit of a dilemma (I wish such dilemmas come more often into my life) and need some outside-in perspective to clear my mind.

As you may be aware, I own a 2021 BMW X3M40i that I leased brand new in January 2021 and have clocked ~ 30,000 miles ( 48,000 kms) in last 32 months of ownership) with “zero dollars” spent out of the pocket till date on its maintenance. I have been using it like the age-old adage of Hero Honda Splendor “ Fill It, Shut it and Forget it”

Touchwood- There are zero issues with the car and build quality is excellent and car looks almost new inside and out. Even till date, it still runs on stock Pirellis run-flats that I got with the car.

This is one of the most enjoyable gasoline vehicle that I owned in my entire life.

BMW is a renowned brand for their sporty vehicles, luxurious interiors and solid build quality. Now pair that to the B58 engine and ZF transmission, it’s a match made in heaven and gives it a Jekyll and Hyde personality. It can become a race-car monster or ramble along the freeways at 80mph with equal ease.

I just cannot express how much joy it brings to me when I drive this car. But, by nature I am a progressive individual and believe in furthering the passion and pushing the goals even further to bring more and more excitement into my automobile ownership experiences.

Come January 2024, our BMW X3M40i lease comes to an end and I have 4-months to take a decision on “ Which Next SAV”.- Yup, only SUV’’s to be considered as we have an EV sedan at home that does duties of teleporting us from one place to another like a “missile”.

Well, the whole reason to come up with this thread is primarily because of an unfortunate incident- I recently came into contact with my “magical BMW lady” who gave me a fabulous deal on my BMW and she has some lucrative offers that is making me think all these options. She needs to be squarely blamed for igniting all these stupid thoughts into my gullible mind.LOL!!

Financially, I can afford all options but, having wasted lot of money on “new” automobiles it's not a priority at all and will surely receive a lot of flak at home.

I need an outside in perspective from the following view points

1. Performance, Ride and Handling ( I have always loved performance vehicles and don’t really care for any other parameters in a car as they are more or less good for all cars)

2. Financial sense-While I can afford it, does it really make sense to make this switch?

3. BMWX3 M40i had been totally reliable and was an awesome experience from a performance perspective. Will I get the same experience with the new car?

Keeping monthly outflow in-mind. I am considering the following cars to lease for next 3-years.

1. 2024 BMW X3M Competition (3.0 L, In-Line 6 S58 engine detuned to 473 HP)

2. 2023 Porsche Macan ( 2.5 Liter, 4 Liter with their famed PDK gearbox and 275 HP)

3. 2023 Porsche Macan S (3.0 Liter, 6 Cylinder with their famed PDK gearbox and 375 HP)

With that as a background, here are some options that I am considering and have 4-months to choose one of the below options :

Option 1 (Most Sensible and No Cost Option)

Once lease ends, it sounds like a good idea to buy it back from BMW and refinance it for same $$$$/month. I buy it back from BMW and pocket $5K-$7k as there is some equity in the car as I had negotiated a super awesome residual deal when I signed the contract for my BMW.

My car has just 30,000 miles and as per BMW forums where I see many X3M40i's doing great even at 90,000 miles with almost no issues.

If I spend a small amount ($2K) and get a VRSF catless downpipe and JB4 tune. This beast can easily be turned into a ravaging monster with power going up to 500 horsepower. This should keep me suitably engaged and excited for at least 2-years and cut-out this stupid itch.

Option 2 (Expensive Option)

Once lease ends, I buy it back from BMW and sell it in outside market and pocket $5K-$7k as there is some equity in the car as I had negotiated a super awesome residual deal when I signed the contract for my BMW.

Basically, pocket $5k-$7K and get the BMW X3M which will cost me approximately 50% higher outflow per month with zero downpayment.

Positives- Brand new BMW X3M that I can drive for next 3-years with zero maintenance costs.

Negative- I’m not sure if the X3M will be drastically different from the X3M40i from a performance aspects. I see many people sell the X3M and buy the X3M40i as they think the X3M is not good for daily driving especially the complaints are on the harsh ride.

Another negative, I will still be in BMW world which is not really moving to next level from a brand ownership experience.

Option 3 (Reasonable Option)

Sell the BMW X3M40i, pocket the $5k-$7k and get a Porsche Macan AWD ( Base Model) and this will not impact my monthly outflow too drastically as it will be an additional 20% more than what I am paying currently each month for the BMW but, with zero downpayment.

Positives - I will enter the next level which is owning a Porsche which is definitely one level above BMW from a brand ownership perspective.

Negatives- I am not too excited about the Porsche’s entry level Macan offering as it seems to be not at same performance level as the BMW X3M40i level. But, this YT reviewer has something interesting to say about the Base Macan.

BMW X3M40i owner drives the base Porsche Macan and his views :

https://youtu.be/9Ud78t4DxNc?si=FhW9pb0Q1E4rB0fF

Option 4 (Expensive but, Desirable Option)

Sell the BMW X3M40i, pocket the $5k-$7k and get a Porsche Macan S and this will significantly impact my monthly outflow and will be similar to the BMW X3M payments which is 50% higher than my current monthly payments. But, again with zero downpayment.

Positives- Macan S has a lovely spec and is a true performance car. But, is it as good as my BMW X3M40i or there is no comparison? I need to test drive myself and see the real world difference.

Negative- It’s expensive from a monthly outflow perspective.

This reviewer says the Macan S is so capable that it’s almost boring.

https://youtu.be/EkfpONW0ORU?si=z-_acXTS9wEBFKjm

Porsche Macan GTS is out of budget and based on some reviews the performance difference is too marginal to warrant spending an extra $15K on this variant.

Please feel free to propose other car options (you may have noted that I didn’t even consider the Audi SQ5 or SQ8 as they don’t stand a chance in front of a BMW or a Porsche) that are in similar price and performance category.

BMW or a Porsche happens to be my most favorite choice.

[moralfibre]

Purely from a numbers perspective the Macan GTS is the first natural progression choice given that you'll push your bhp figures in the 400s territory. The X3M would be the next fair choice to propel you into the upper 400s territory and place you in a lucrative territory of 500bhp cars.

Other options are just moves around the equatorial regions. You'll simply change badges without much of an change in weather. I'd vote for an X3M or a Macan GTS depending on your budget.

I hope you are opting to lease these because you are a prime candidate for whom this option of vehicle possession is carved out. Lease a car, enjoy it for 3 years and move on to the next upgrade.

[Tgo]

Even before reading through your entire post I had the Macan S pop up in my head.

Disclaimer: I haven’t driven any or the options or your current ride. Just an opinion of an internet surfer who spends way too much time thinking about the next progressive update, 3/4 steps too early in life.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Purely from a numbers perspective the Macan GTS is the first natural progression choice given that you'll push your bhp figures in the 400s territory. The X3M would be the next fair choice to propel you into the upper 400s territory and place you in a lucrative territory of 500bhp cars.

Please don’t go by the horsepower numbers. My current BMW has 382 BHP and people have dyno'ed stock BMW X3M40i and they usually are way higher than what BMW quotes (440 BHP).

It’s been said time and again by many reviewers that it feels like a 100 BHP more in real world and I feel that on a daily basis. B58 is really a fantastic engine.

Porsche is a similar OEM who underquote their horsepower numbers and with their even better driving dynamics the whole performance experience is probably better. I don't know, have to experience it myself.

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Other options are just moves around the equatorial regions. You'll simply change badges without much of an change in weather. I'd vote for an X3M or a Macan GTS depending on your budget.

I would love to get the GTS as some people say it’s like a Cayman on stilts but, it’s ridiculously expensive for what it delivers.

Macan S is 95% of what Macan GTS delivers (something similar to a X3M40i vs. X3M) and folks just don’t see any difference in power as its same 2.9 liter engine but, with a 60 hp difference.

Originally Posted by moralfibre

I hope you are opting to lease these because you are a prime candidate for whom this option of vehicle possession is carved out. Lease a car, enjoy it for 3 years and move on to the next upgrade.

Absolutely. I love to lease cars as I anyway think of cars as depreciating assets.

To get the value you paid for a car, minimum 7-years ownership is required and I don’t have so much patience to drive the same car for those many years. LOL!

Originally Posted by Tgo

Even before reading through your entire post I had the Macan S pop up in my head.

Disclaimer: I haven’t driven any or the options or your current ride. Just an opinion of an internet surfer who spends way too much time thinking about the next progressive update, 3/4 steps too early in life.

Me too. Macan S hits the sweet spot.

Now I just have to drop into a dealership and decide for myself by driving Base, S and GTS if they are true upgrades to an excellent performance car like BMW X3M40i

[moralfibre]

Originally Posted by mobike008

Please don’t go by the horsepower numbers. My current BMW has 382 BHP and people have dyno'ed stock BMW X3M40i and they usually are way higher than what BMW quotes (440 BHP).

Wouldn’t the same logic apply to the X3M and The Macan GTS as well? They would be grossly underquoted for the performance they offer.

I would love to get the GTS as some people say it’s like a Cayman on stilts but, it’s ridiculously expensive for what it delivers.

Macan S is 95% of what Macan GTS delivers (something similar to a X3M40i vs. X3M) and folks just don’t see any difference in power as its same 2.9 liter engine but, with a 60 hp difference.

Well a Macan S is some 375hp and the GTS at 425 something. I don’t think it accounts for 95%. People who drive the X3Mc can run in circles around the M40i. The difference is clear and beyond comparison.

Absolutely. I love to lease cars as I anyway think of cars as depreciating assets.

Me too. Macan S hits the sweet spot.

It seems to me like you’ve made up your mind on the Macan S.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Wouldn’t the same logic apply to the X3M and The Macan GTS as well? They would be grossly underquoted for the performance they offer.

Absolutely it applies to them as well. Straight line acceleration they would be a tad quicker (3 or 4 10th's of a second not a whole second quicker though) and due to their stiffer suspensions (and, horrible fuel efficiency) it would be tough to live with them as a daily driver.

They would be great track tools not a daily driver.

I need a daily driver which I can drive fast like every other regular Joe.

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Well a Macan S is some 375hp and the GTS at 425 something. I don’t think it accounts for 95%. People who drive the X3Mc can run in circles around the M40i. The difference is clear and beyond comparison.

That’s what I mentioned. They are 60 HP apart and even I thought as you, that's a lot of difference.

Well, not all folks who have reviewed it can be wrong. Right?

Check this video out :

https://youtu.be/fVYGmww3Io0?si=sNhEnsUexDQxpq3r

One more comparison of the GTS vs. S. He claims the performance difference is negligible.

https://youtu.be/tC1FWwbZhgk?si=ifUzhjHLX8hihLve

Well, there is only one way to find out. Drive them in real world. lol!

Originally Posted by moralfibre

It seems to me like you’ve made up your mind on the Macan S.

Actually no. My first priority would be make these changes to my X3M40i :

1. Slap on some delicious Michelin PS4’s ($1200)
2. JB4 Tune ($600)
3. VRSF Catless Downpipes ($700)

Spending $2500 can bring my car to X3M territory.

Macan S has to really bowl me over to take the decision to sell the X3M40i and get it. Only coming days will tell if they can bowl me over.

Macan GTS doesn’t make too much sense either financially nor performance wise. I can save that money for my dream car-Porsche Cayman GTS 4.0.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by mobike008

Macan GTS doesn’t make too much sense either financially or performance wise. I can save that money for my dream car-Porsche Cayman GTS 4.0.

If you can hold on to your purchase and get something that will make you fulfil your long wish, I will certainly keep that X3M40i. Any newer cars you buy today will depreciate faster and more than if bought three years ago. This madness of crazy deliveries and multiple yearly increases is behind us. The kind of interest one has to pay today is already reflected in the market.

Your Model 3 can do everything your X3 does and some more. If you need a SAV vehicle, Maccan or even the new Cayenne makes a good case. I won't recommend another BMW, irrespective of the trim or the model. You are in the best place to get a Porsche cheap (relatively). Maccan may feel similar to X3 once you are past the initial days, and since you travel long distances, consider a Cayenne seriously. I will pay little attention to 0-100 or some YT videos. Drive back to back on familiar roads for a distance; the best will be to take your family along as they should feel more comfortable in the Cayenne.

[GTO]

Are you going to be in the USA long-term? If yes, then I suggest holding onto your X3M340i that you are clearly so happy with, and enjoying to the bits (going by your posts & travelogues). Spend a little money on modifying it and enjoy it for another 2 years. Then, buy the Porsche variant you really want. By then, your income levels would also have logically gone higher & you saved money by retaining your current car.

On the other hand, if you are returning to India in a few years, then go ahead and get that Porsche right away. The USA is a dream market for car enthusiasts and switching cars every 2 - 3 years is the best way to experience different machines that are out of reach / unavailable in India.

How about something like the 2023 Corvette? Or the Mustang? Not keen? Any chances of buying a used sportscar like the 911? There are just so many options in the USA.

[athray9]

Hi mobike008,

As a fellow X3 M40i owner, I can understand the amount of fun the car offers It is a very tough car to replace. Going by the options you provided, I don't feel good about option 2 and 3 since Macan S does not feel like a huge jump and X3 M would feel like you got the same car with slightly better performance, better exhaust but it would get 10 times more uncomfortable. Option 4 seems to be very tempting since you are not only getting more power but also better handling and the Porsche experience. But since you own a Model 3 performance, I know for a fact that the acceleration of the Macan cannot even come close to what the Model 3 offers. I recently drove a BMW iX 50 and I was blown away by the acceleration.I feel that a hybrid would give best of both worlds where you can get the initial acceleration of an EV and then the drama of a gas engine. So the best option would be to stick to your X3 M40i, get a downpipe a tune for it, wait for the new Macan to be launched which is rumored to be a hybrid/EV and go for that.

[deepjaju]

Hey
I am not so aware of the USA market for cars. I did some research and did u consider the Maserati Grecale GT. This seems like a match for the Macan and it has that brand value as well.
How about the Lexus RX ?

[Hayek]

Am no one to comment on differences in driving dynamics between the X3M and the Macan variants. But from what friends who own Porsches say, you are very unlikely to get the completely trouble free ownership experience that you have had with an X3M.

Also I do find the idea of replacing a car that has done just 30,000 miles in US conditions a tad wasteful (no offence intended). But of course, the economics of car ownership in the USA are very different from those in India. But the one concern I would have is that interest rates today are much higher than those when you bought your X3M40i 3 years ago - and I wonder how much of an impact that would have on lease rentals.

Off topic - and I know you may not want to mention what your payments are on a public forum - but would be good to understand what lease rentals per month on a 3 year zero down payment lease are for a car that costs say USD 50000. And does this vary by model (in India, Avis from whom our company leases cars charges less for a Camry than for a Superb even though the Superb costs much less - since depreciation on the Camry is less).

Do let us know what you decide.

[samik_jonak]

I have driven all the cars mentioned in the post so I can tell you from my personal experience. The X3 M40i will not fetch much resale when you decide to sell it after 5 years or so.

X3M is too stiff for road trips and the base model Macan is a joke for the price.

Get either the Macan S or the Cayenne S. Both cars feel like a Sedan to drive but forget about leasing in this market.

[XDriver]

Hi if you consider Macan it has to be the Macan S. Base Macan will be a downgrade from the X3 M40i. I would recommend the Macan S or hold on the the X3 M40i.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

If you can hold on to your purchase and get something that will make you fulfil your long wish, I will certainly keep that X3M40i. Any newer cars you buy today will depreciate faster and more than if bought three years ago. This madness of crazy deliveries and multiple yearly increases is behind us. The kind of interest one has to pay today is already reflected in the market.

Very sane advice. Since I bought my X3M40i with an MSRP of $65K ++ Taxes in 2021, the prices have jumped significantly and my spec X3M40i would be north of $70K now.

Auto interests are at a crazy situation in US and they are hovering around 7%-8% and that really jacks up the monthly outflow.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Your Model 3 can do everything your X3 does and some more. If you need a SAV vehicle, Maccan or even the new Cayenne makes a good case. I won't recommend another BMW, irrespective of the trim or the model.

Absolutely right. My M3P is a Lamborghini killer so Macan and any other vehicle will not even come close with respect to acceleration.

It’s also a fantastic handler and can also carve the crayons equally well.

But, why no other BMW? I thought you were a fan of BMW’s.

My observation- BMW’s have created a hot-potch of their line ups. There are so many variants and options now it’s like a maze to navigate through their product lineup.

If another BMW, my interests are only the M or M Performance vehicles but, their prices are ridiculously expensive post covid.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

You are in the best place to get a Porsche cheap (relatively). Macan may feel similar to X3 once you are past the initial days, and since you travel long distances, consider a Cayenne seriously. I will pay little attention to 0-100 or some YT videos. Drive back to back on familiar roads for a distance; the best will be to take your family along as they should feel more comfortable in the Cayenne.

Cayenne is a great advice and actually a no-brainer as a proper upgrade but, I ‘m not there yet (They cost $130K upwards). I cannot afford it and this will be reserved as a dream SUV for many years later.

Originally Posted by GTO

Are you going to be in the USA long-term? If yes, then I suggest holding onto your X3M340i that you are clearly so happy with, and enjoying to the bits (going by your posts & travelogues). Spend a little money on modifying it and enjoy it for another 2 years. Then, buy the Porsche variant you really want. By then, your income levels would also have logically gone higher & you saved money by retaining your current car.

Thanks Rush. That was the original plan till this lady threw this curve ball at me.

Only thing that is going to sway my decision to a Macan S or GTS will be the final deal and car options (features) that she will give me.

There are many times some great deal comes along so I told her to reach out when there is a mouth watering deal as I am not in a hurry as I have 4-months to go for my decision.

My dream Porsche as a regular Joe in US that I can probably afford (after making some sacrifices, obviously) is Porsche Cayman GTS 4.0 which costs about $100K pre-owned and I know I will get this at some point in my life- I just don’t know when.

Originally Posted by GTO

On the other hand, if you are returning to India in a few years, then go ahead and get that Porsche right away. The USA is a dream market for car enthusiasts and switching cars every 2 - 3 years is the best way to experience different machines that are out of reach / unavailable in India.

Great points. I’m kind of settled here now (bought a home here in Seattle, last year ) and there are no plans to come back to India in the foreseeable future.

But, that does not help at all as I get this 3-year itch despite my location. Not sure if there is a doctor who can cure this disease. Lol!!

Originally Posted by GTO

How about something like the 2023 Corvette? Or the Mustang? Not keen? Any chances of buying a used sportscar like the 911? There are just so many options in the USA.

You know I was a motorcyclist in my past life.

If I can give you an analogy, American muscle cars are like Harley Davidson. They look great and fantastic to drive them on and off. But, living with them is worrisome.

It’s just not the same level of performance, luxury, reliability or fun as their German counterparts.

I have driven the Challenger Scatpack, Camaro SS and the Mustang. Test drives were exhilarating but, they feel heavy, clumsy and make a lot of noise without going too far.

Never drove the Corvette.

I always dreamed of owning an American muscle and Challenger was on top of my list until I drove one. I dropped the idea super fast.

911 would be a dream car. A 6 year old 911 retails for $150K or more. Instead get a relative new Cayman GTS 4.0 which uses the same 911 engine would be my choice for a Porsche sports car.

Originally Posted by athray9

Hi mobike008,

As a fellow X3 M40i owner, I can understand the amount of fun the car offers It is a very tough car to replace. Going by the options you provided, I don't feel good about option 2 and 3 since Macan S does not feel like a huge jump and X3 M would feel like you got the same car with slightly better performance, better exhaust but it would get 10 times more uncomfortable. Option 4 seems to be very tempting since you are not only getting more power but also better handling and the Porsche experience. But since you own a Model 3 performance, I know for a fact that the acceleration of the Macan cannot even come close to what the Model 3 offers. I recently drove a BMW iX 50 and I was blown away by the acceleration.I feel that a hybrid would give best of both worlds where you can get the initial acceleration of an EV and then the drama of a gas engine. So the best option would be to stick to your X3 M40i, get a downpipe a tune for it, wait for the new Macan to be launched which is rumored to be a hybrid/EV and go for that.

Wow. I didn’t know you own a X3M40i. Rare to find someone with this car on the forum. Do you have a thread running here? Pls point me to it.

Yes, GTS is the most desirable but, they are super expensive. A well optioned Porsche Macan GTS can touch almost $100K.

You are also right about the M3P, it’s so fast that it cannot be compared with anything we are discussing here. It’s in different league. But, to be fair it’s an electric.

I want to continue with a Gasoline Performance SUV + EV Sedan garage till whatever time I can afford it.

I am also tilting towards Option 1. But, I will most definitely take a test drive of the Macan S and GTS and take my final decision.

Originally Posted by Hayek

Am no one to comment on differences in driving dynamics between the X3M and the Macan variants. But from what friends who own Porsches say, you are very unlikely to get the completely trouble free ownership experience that you have had with an X3M.

Thanks for bringing this point. As you may have noted from my BMW ownership. It’s been a dream run with zero issues and zero money spent on maintenance till date. I am also worried that it may not be same case with a Porsche.

Originally Posted by Hayek

Also I do find the idea of replacing a car that has done just 30,000 miles in US conditions a tad wasteful (no offence intended). But of course, the economics of car ownership in the USA are very different from those in India. But the one concern I would have is that interest rates today are much higher than those when you bought your X3M40i 3 years ago - and I wonder how much of an impact that would have on lease rentals.

If I get a BMW X3M40i on lease today, I will pay about 35% higher monthly EMI.

That is a significant jump in payments so I am in a happy place from the monthly outflow concerned.

Originally Posted by Hayek

Off topic - and I know you may not want to mention what your payments are on a public forum - but would be good to understand what lease rentals per month on a 3 year zero down payment lease are for a car that costs say USD 50000. And does this vary by model (in India, Avis from whom our company leases cars charges less for a Camry than for a Superb even though the Superb costs much less - since depreciation on the Camry is less).

Do let us know what you decide.

Leases work very differently in US. For cars that don’t sell like some Hyundai variants, Genesis Variants, Lexus Variants, Trucks like Ram they offer an APR of as low as 3.99% and that means you pay as low as $650/month for a $50K car.

Downpayments are usually mandatory and ranges from $2000-$7500. Getting a zero downpayment deals are rare.

I don't like to pay downpayment as that is money lost. So I find deals that have this criteria and Porsche deals that I am exploring are all "Zero Downpayment".

But, cars that are in high demand the same $50K car can cost way higher monthly EMI as the APR is pretty high.

Insurance, Yearly Plate taxes, Fuel means you pay nearly $1100-$1200 a month for owning and driving that vehicle. (All Ball Park numbers and depend on many factors)

Many people don’t know you can negotiate the residual value (value at end of lease) when signing the contract.

Dealers want to put a lower residual. We as buyers need to negotiate a higher residual so it works out cheaper when/and, if you intend to buy the car at end of the lease. That’s what I did with my BMW and that's why have an equity in my car now.

Originally Posted by samik_jonak

I have driven all the cars mentioned in the post so I can tell you from my personal experience. The X3 M40i will not fetch much resale when you decide to sell it after 5 years or so.

You are wrong my friend. X3M40i has fantastic resale value. I track the prices regularly and a 4-year old X3M40i with 50,000 miles will fetch 55% or higher of the original MSRP which isn’t bad for the age & miles done.

Originally Posted by samik_jonak

IX3M is too stiff for road trips and the base model Macan is a joke for the price.

Agree on both counts.

Originally Posted by samik_jonak

IGet either the Macan S or the Cayenne S. Both cars feel like a Sedan to drive but forget about leasing in this market.

Macan S (Yes). Cayenne S (No, I cannot afford it)

Originally Posted by XDriver

Hi if you consider Macan it has to be the Macan S. Base Macan will be a downgrade from the X3 M40i. I would recommend the Macan S or hold on the the X3 M40i.

Yes sir. I think everyone (including me) thinks it would be a downgrade.

Hence, I kept repeating myself that if I do decide to get a Macan, it will be Macan S (GTS- if my agent gives me some dream deal).

[Amey Kulkarni]

My two cents as an owner of The Porsche Cayenne Exclusive GTS and Supra MK 5, do not test drive the Macan S / GTS if the specs on the car and your finances aren’t convincing enough.

If you taste the Porsche blood, you’re not going back to the BMW. Period!

Don’t get a barebone Macan (Standard) nor any Standard variant Porsche for that matter. Not worth it nor retains a good resale value compared to an S or a GTS.

All the best!
Cheers
Amey