[cataclysm]

Good folks of TBHP, please help me out.

I want to replace my 6 year old Himalayan. The purpose of this motorcycle has only been mountain touring. So I take it to the high-Himalayas 2-3 times a year. And since the hills start less than 70 kms from my place, I've been okay with the low cruising speed that the Himalayan offers. The speed/thrill duties are taken care by my 2021 Interceptor 650.

The only viable contenders I could find are 1. Hero XPulse 4V Pro 2. KTM 390 Adventure-X

I don't want to wait for the Himalayan 450 because I don't want to end up being a guinea pig. Himalayan 450 can be considered only after mid-2024, which is too long a wait. Same for the bigger Xpulse.

I've taken a test ride of both, Xpulse 4V (Standard not Pro) and 390 ADV Standard (Not the X). Here's what I think:

Hero Xpulse 4V Pro

The motorcycle is huge but I could manage to flat foot. But Hero being h(z)ero, offered a test ride of the standard variant with a pillion.

Pros

1. Light weight and nimble
2. Power seems more or less similar to my Himalayan
3. Informative dash
4. Brakes were better than the Himalayan
5. Suspension (Standard) felt comparable to the Himalayan
6. Adjustable suspension in the Pro variant will make the ride quality even better
7. On-road price of 1.78 lakh

Cons

1. Tubed tyres always cause anxiety, especially when riding in the middle of nowhere
2. Hero's sales felt rather poor because of which the service also makes me anxious

My only concern is that the lack of power might make me want to replace the motorcycle in the next year or 3, which is fine because there will be way better ADVs by mid-2024 or 2025.

KTM 390 Adventure-X

The reason behind going for the X over the Standard is that I would like to swap out the front suspension with the SW variant and replace the rear one with the one from Xpulse. So the 60k saved will go into this. I also didn't feel the need for traction control or the quick shifter.

I test rode the Standard variant.

Pros

1. Power! Didn't feel as powerful as my Interceptor but way faster than my Himalayan
2. Light weight and nimble
3. Informative dash
4. Brakes were crisp
5. Tubeless setup gives peace of mind

Cons

1. Vibes everywhere. My Himalayan vibes lesser than the 390 ADV. Didn't feel refined.
2. No low-end grunt
3. On-road price of 3.4 lakh. Not sure worth it for a motorcycle which will be used majorly 2-3 times a year, rest will be just short city rides and occasional weekend rides
4. Suspension is nowhere as plush as the Himalayan or the Xpulse

So, folks what should I do? If I didn't have an Interceptor, I would've just bought the 390 ADV. But having an Interceptor changes things as it satisfies my need for power and speed. In fact, I never really liked my Himalayan till I bought the Interceptor. I could then really appreciate the positives of the Himalayan and not just focus on the lack of power.

I am not considering selling the Interceptor along with the Himalayan to get a bigger ADV as I am very happy with the Interceptor.

And, holding on to the Himalayan is out of question now as I've found a buyer and the sale process has already begun.

I have an upcoming ride in September, so I would like to buy an ADV in the first week of August.

Please help a brother out. What would you guys do if you were in a similar situation?

Thanks!

[five46]

Suggest you to consider a long test drive of the Suzuki V Strom SX.

Sits mid-way between the capabilities of the Xpulse and the 390.

Xpulse is a little hard core - suited for trails, 390 - like you mentioned really a weak low end and would rob the fun in the mountains.

[Red Liner]

My suggestion is to actually wait until mid next year. Your himalayan is heavily depreciated already. You won’t lose much more by waiting.

The 450 is too close to launch to discount away. Ditto for ye triumph scrambler.

Both your existing choices of motorcycles can also easily be bought used. They have been around for a number of years and are quickly depreciating in light of newer launches.

If buying now: buy used
If buying new: wait until mid next year

[aviator1101]

Originally Posted by cataclysm

I want to replace my 6 year old Himalayan. The purpose of this motorcycle has only been mountain touring. So I take it to the high-Himalayas 2-3 times a year. And since the hills start less than 70 kms from my place, I've been okay with the low cruising speed that the Himalayan offers. The speed/thrill duties are taken care by my 2021 Interceptor 650.

I don't want to wait for the Himalayan 450 because I don't want to end up being a guinea pig. Himalayan 450 can be considered only after mid-2024, which is too long a wait. Same for the bigger Xpulse.

I've taken a test ride of both, Xpulse 4V (Standard not Pro) and 390 ADV Standard (Not the X).

I am not considering selling the Interceptor along with the Himalayan to get a bigger ADV as I am very happy with the Interceptor.

I have an upcoming ride in September, so I would like to buy an ADV in the first week of August.

Please help a brother out. What would you guys do if you were in a similar situation?

I can empathize with you Sir. Because I am myself in a similar situation.

Why I say so?

I sold my Bonneville T100 last month.

Have a ride to Ladakh planned in September.
But, nothing viable available on the horizon.


Coming to the options that you have considered.
Anybody in the market today to buy an ADV would have done the same.

BUT

I have owned both a Himalayan 411 and Xpulse 200. Xpulse is good off the road, but it is grossly underpowered, more so with a pillion in hills and I would not touch it again. Also, it's utterly uncomfortable on long rides. It doesn't come anywhere close to the Himalayan despite all its flaws.

I have ridden the 390 ADV and feel it is not actually an ADV, it's more like a 390 Duke on stilts, and a bike which has barely any low end, always keeping you busy.

The above are entirely my personal opinion, others may differ.

So, what I am doing and would suggest you to consider is hiring a bike from a rental agency for the September ride. It's just one ride.

Next, I would give the benefit of doubt to Royal Enfield and wait for the Himalayan 450.
Folks at Royal Enfield have probably learnt their lessons the harder way with the initial lot of Himalayan 411s. The 450 has been tested extensively and I'm sure they would deliver a much better product this time around.
In case it doesn't tick all the boxes, I would consider the Triumph Scrambler 400X which also gives you the advantage of alloy wheels.

Advantages are many

• You get a much better true blue adventure tourer/ scrambler without any compromises.
• You save at least a lakh plus on the on road price of a 390 ADV with both these bikes.
• If whatever news is coming out with respect to the 450 in terms of the power and highway cruising capabilities are even 75-80% correct, you may reconsider selling your Interceptor later

Hope that helps you make up your mind.

[cataclysm]

Originally Posted by five46

Suggest you to consider a long test drive of the Suzuki V Strom SX

Thanks for the suggestion! I never really considered the V Strom because of the paltry 120mm front suspension travel. It just seems like a Gixxer on stilts.

Originally Posted by Red Liner

My suggestion is to actually wait until mid next year. Your himalayan is heavily depreciated already. You won’t lose much more by waiting.

The 450 is too close to launch to discount away. Ditto for ye triumph scrambler.

If buying now: buy used
If buying new: wait until mid next year

Unfortunately, keeping the Himalayan is out of question now. I am all for buying a used motorcycle but I couldn't find any decent options in Chandigarh.

Originally Posted by aviator1101

I can empathize with you Sir. Because I am myself in a similar situation.

So, what I am doing and would suggest you to consider is hiring a bike from a rental agency for the September ride. It's just one ride.

Hiring is always an option but I would rather take my Interceptor.

Originally Posted by aviator1101

Next, I would give the benefit of doubt to Royal Enfield and wait for the Himalayan 450.
Folks at Royal Enfield have probably learnt their lessons the harder way with the initial lot of Himalayan 411s. The 450 has been tested extensively and I'm sure they would deliver a much better product this time around.

I am sure they would deliver a great product this time. But I would still want to wait at least an year.

Originally Posted by aviator1101

In case it doesn't tick all the boxes, I would consider the Triumph Scrambler 400X which also gives you the advantage of alloy wheels

I am looking forward to the Scrambler 400X. But I am not sure if it will tick all the boxes. But only a test ride will tell.

So all in all, I am still confused

[VW2010]

For your needs can't you rent what you want just before the trip instead of buying and owning one. You can get either of the bikes for rent considering your proximity to your destination.

If owning is a requirement my recommendation would be the xpulse. By far the easiest on bad roads and a decent 100kmph cruiser as well. It shines on bad roads or lack or roads. I am a KTM adv owner and that adventure needs a softer suspension set up to feel comfortable for even touring. You can even find used or unused xpulse for sub 1l. You can buy the rally kit for 40k and get the perfect set up for your riding needs. I am assuming high Himalayas means non existent tarmac.

[cataclysm]

Originally Posted by VW2010

For your needs can't you rent what you want just before the trip instead of buying and owning one. You can get either of the bikes for rent considering your proximity to your destination.

Rental is always an option, however I would prefer owing.

Originally Posted by VW2010

If owning is a requirement my recommendation would be the xpulse. By far the easiest on bad roads and a decent 100kmph cruiser as well.

Is it a decent 100kmph cruiser? Most people say it's good till 90kmph. I found the acceleration similar to my Himalayan. Couldn't tell the speed as the speedo was disconnected.

Originally Posted by VW2010

I am a KTM adv owner and that adventure needs a softer suspension set up to feel comfortable for even touring.

How are the vibes in your 390 Adv? The motorcycle I test rode was really vibey. The handlebar and footpegs were buzzing a fair bit.

Originally Posted by VW2010

You can even find used or unused xpulse for sub 1l. You can buy the rally kit for 40k and get the perfect set up for your riding needs.

Most used ones are 2V. I think the 4V is far better in terms of refinement. But I am not sure since I've not ridden the 2V.

Originally Posted by VW2010

I am assuming high Himalayas means non existent tarmac.

Yup

[davelok]

Triumph Scrambler 400X would be too new to take on a Himalayan adventure. It would be difficult for any roadside mechanic to give it a quick fix and impossible to get spares.

Also consider that the machine would not have been run in when you take it for the long and arduous trip.

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by Red Liner

If buying now: buy used
If buying new: wait until mid next year

I’m with Redliner here. I feel there are some incredible launches around the corner. I am hopeful that the Himalayan 450 will be an excellent machine. Ditto for the Hero ~400+ CC. These could be the ideal replacements for your bike.

If going for KTM 390 X better off trying to buy a used regular 390A as a stop gap. I also expect the next gen KTM 390A to be the ideal bike to upgrade to from what you’re describing as your use case. It should (again, fingers crossed) be a much better and purpose built proposition than the current edition but its a fair distance away - 2025 perhaps.

Hold on to that Himalayan a bit longer and if you must replace, perhaps go used as Redliner suggested.

[snappysam]

Originally Posted by cataclysm

Good folks of TBHP, please help me out.

I want to replace my 6 year old Himalayan.

What would you guys do if you were in a similar situation?

Thanks!

I was one of the first in Kochi to do a test ride of the Xpulse 4V Pro hoping to buy it. However fate had other plans. I did not plan any serious off-roading though. Just wanted to take it to our plantation on weekends which needs either a 4x4 or a capable off-road bike.

Went to the dealer and rode the Xpluse for a few Kms, I liked the stable ride however the engine seemed felt like a splendor (similar vibrations and dull response), but bike felt stable which impressed me. I was ready to put down the money. Also had my young son as pillion. We also finalised the color. However I decided to take a test ride of Duke 390. Went directly to the KTM dealership. They didn't have a Duke 390 for TD. Which was disappointing. However they handed me the keys to a 390 ADV (I was not very keen on the ADV as the Duke could easily suffice my moderate off-roading needs and I used to manage with my Activa. Yep it was dangerous and needed sufficient skill and bravado. Sorry I digress). Reluctantly climbed onto the 390 ADV, found it to be tall for my height (I'm 5'7"), and wide too. However once moving the ADV just blew my mind. Lovely responsive motor, compared to the Xpulse, it felt smooth. Sure the low-end was almost non-existent but post 6000 rpm, wowie it was another feel. Nixed the decison to buy the Xpulse and bought a Suke 390. Happy camper ever since. Off-roading requires rowing through the gears but definitely enjoyable. Oh and today it is my daily ride. Gave away Activa too (grocery runs are a pain now but fine otherwise). And my son too loves going on rides as pillion, suitably attired. But for the tallish seat height, I would have gone for the ADV 390.

As someone who mentioned, try to get these bikes on rent and do some longish rides. HAPPY SAFE RIDING ...

[slowyogaman]

Hello Catclysm

I love the problem you mention. Your garage sounds like the ideal garage to me, one powerful bike for the highways and a small off-roader for the mountains.

With the interceptor already in your stable, I don't think you need a 390 ADV, the Xplulse will be your perfect off roader.

The Xpulse being cheaper, will also give you room to play around with the right accessories and trims.

What I would suggest is to test ride an Xpulse with and without the rally kit and find the best trim for your comfort.

Happy riding!

[cataclysm]

Originally Posted by Axe77

I am hopeful that the Himalayan 450 will be an excellent machine. Ditto for the Hero ~400+ CC. These could be the ideal replacements for your bike.

Absolutely! I am certain that the Himalayan 450 is going to be a great motorcycle, leagues ahead of the current one. However, that would mean waiting till at least mid-2024 so that all the gremlins are sorted. And since I've already struck a deal for my current Himalayan, I would not want to be ADV-less till mid next year.

I do also think that there's no such thing as a good time to buy a motorcycle, because great launches will keep on taking place.

Originally Posted by Axe77

If going for KTM 390 X better off trying to buy a used regular 390A as a stop gap.

That was my initial plan. But I could find only 2 used 390 ADVs in my city, and both are priced too high with no scope of negotiation.

Originally Posted by Axe77

I also expect the next gen KTM 390A to be the ideal bike to upgrade to from what you’re describing as your use case. It should (again, fingers crossed) be a much better and purpose built proposition than the current edition but its a fair distance away - 2025 perhaps.

Oh yes, I have been reading about how the 2025 390A is going to be a completely new and purpose built motorcycle.

Originally Posted by snappysam

However once moving the ADV just blew my mind. Lovely responsive motor, compared to the Xpulse, it felt smooth. Sure the low-end was almost non-existent but post 6000 rpm, wowie it was another feel.

My test ride experience was the complete opposite. The Xpulse felt smooth and the 390A was very vibey, most probably because it was much abused. But I do like power delivery of the 390A, even with the non-existent low-end. And also that it comes with tubeless tyres, because fixing a puncture in the middle of nowhere is a task and plans definitely have to be altered.

Originally Posted by slowyogaman

With the interceptor already in your stable, I don't think you need a 390 ADV, the Xplulse will be your perfect off roader.

That's what I think too. But Hero's sales and service do not instill any confidence. And tubed tyres as well. During my last Spiti ride, my friend's Himalayan got a flat tyre and while we both have practical experience removing Himalayan's tyre and fixing a puncture, that still meant a delay of almost 1.5 hours. However, nothing that one can't live without if the motorcycle is great in every other aspect.

[PatienceWins]

I am in the same boat as you for ADV and my plan is to wait till mid next year to see what Himalayan 450 and Xpulse 400 has to offer.

I am sure Himalayan will be a much better product at attractive pricing to beat the competition. But as with any RE, better to wait for sometime for them to sort out the initial niggles.

Triumph Scrambler 400 also seems to be a good option for touring with the attractive pricing. But would want to wait to see how the service network and sales network of Bajaj - Triumph pans out.

KTM 390 is an attractive proposition for long distance touring, but lack of low end torque, not a proper ADV with limited suspension travel, and unavailability of alloys in SW version is putting me off. I do not want to spend that much unless it is a very attractive product. The next version, 2025 model, is supposed to be a proper ADV with new engine, but that is a long time away.

Xpulse seems to be the best option for you if you are in need for an offroader soon as you have the Interceptor for the other use case.

[cataclysm]

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

I am sure Himalayan will be a much better product at attractive pricing to beat the competition. But as with any RE, better to wait for sometime for them to sort out the initial niggles.

Absolutely! So that means waiting for at least 1 year.

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

Triumph Scrambler 400 also seems to be a good option for touring with the attractive pricing.

I am sure it'll be priced very competitively but that 150mm suspension travel won't be great when the roads disappear. Compare that with 390A's 170mm front and 177mm rear or Xpulse Pro's 250mm front and 220mm rear.

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

KTM 390 is an attractive proposition for long distance touring, but lack of low end torque, not a proper ADV with limited suspension travel, and unavailability of alloys in SW version is putting me off.

There are fixes available for the low-end torque, and for the suspension, my plan is to swap the front with the adjustable one that comes in the SW variant and rear can be swapped with the one that comes in the Xpulse. But that means spending additional 40-45k.

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

The next version, 2025 model, is supposed to be a proper ADV with new engine, but that is a long time away.

Oh yes, I've heard that too. Perhaps I should get the Xpulse Pro now and then upgrade in 2025 to the new 390A or the new Himalayan

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

Xpulse seems to be the best option for you if you are in need for an offroader soon as you have the Interceptor for the other use case.

Yes, Xpulse Pro seems like the best option as of now and if I get bored or unhappy with it, I can always upgrade to the new 390A or Himalayan whenever they come out. But if I get the 390 ADV-X (and then spend additional money on upgrading the suspension), there'll be no question of upgrading for at least 5 years, no matter how good the Himalayan 450 or the 2025 390A will be.

Here are a few concerns that I have with both motorcycles:

Xpulse 4V Pro

1. Hero's service quality

Perhaps my biggest fear. Even the showroom had such a nonchalant vibe, so I am not sure how the service will be.

2. Lack of power

I fear I might get bored soon. Though the Himalayan always put a smile on my face when the roads disappeared

3. Tubed tyres

I can live with it, but fixing a flat in the middle of nowhere is a nightmare

390 ADV-X

1. Suspension

It's quite rigid but my suspension swap plan might fix it

2. Too much money

3.4 lakh + additional 40-45K for the suspension seems like a lot of money to spend on a motorcycle that's going to see action 2-3 times in a year. Rest of the year it'll be just short rides or city commute. So as you can see, I wake up thinking Xpulse it is and then as the day progresses I end up finalising the 390 ADV-X

[2StrokeJunkie]

Originally Posted by cataclysm

Cons

1. Tubed tires always cause anxiety, especially when riding in the middle of nowhere
2. Hero's sales felt rather poor because of which the service also makes me anxious

My only concern is that the lack of power might make me want to replace the motorcycle in the next year or 3, which is fine because there will be way better ADVs by mid-2024 or 2025.
!

Eyes closed get the Xpulse Pro. I was in a similar predicament as you as an Interceptor owner and a ride on a friend's Xpulse CS Santosh Rally Edition just floored me. You can check out my thread if it interests you to see how I finally picked up the Xpulse Pro.

https://www.team-bhp.com/news/why-i-...-390-adventure

Though our purposes are vastly different, the fact that the Xpulse figured in both of our lists speaks volumes about its versatility.

Wrt your comparison of the Xpulse with the Himalayan in terms of power - no doubt the Himalayan has more torque but it also weighs a lot more and there's a new version that will be out soon but it will also cost a lot more.

The Xpulse is rugged, cost-effective, and a very capable machine. I'm still running in the motor, but from videos I've seen on YouTube, slightly tweaked Xpulse's aren't too far behind the Himaylans on the highway in terms of outright speed - surprisingly close in fact despite the Himalayan having more than double the displacement.

Wrt to your fear of punctures in the middle of nowhere, I would suggest you get the Way2Speed tubeless conversion done with a set of tubeless tires from Ralco or Riese maybe? I did the same tubeless conversion on my Interceptor on the stock Pirellis and they have given me a lot of peace of mind.

Wrt to Heros lackluster service, this is a similar fear I have but the machine is pretty simple so I do not think there should be a problem. If you aren't happy with the levels of service from your dealership, head to one that sells higher volumes of the Xpulse or get the motorcycle serviced at an FNG. The motorcycle comes with a 5-year warranty.

There is no doubt that it is under powered but there are plenty of aftermarket parts available to bump up power- I was just watching a video yesterday of a Race Dynamics tuned Xpulse putting out 36bhp at the crank and if you do not want to go down that route in the next couple of years, like you mentioned, we should have more powerful ADV options to choose from. So its a win-win with the Xpulse!