[INJAXN]

Originally Posted by Hayek

1) Should bus operators be allowed to operate overnight routes with drowsy drivers? What was the cleaner doing - was he also asleep?
2) Why don’t our buses have emergency exits that can open easily and let people escape?
3) Has anyone tested these sleeper buses to examine the impact of weight distribution on centre of gravity and ability to control the vehicle?

Add these also:

4) All these buses have very few factory fitted parts. rest all is fitted later on. All the electrical wire they are laying till each berth in order to provide socket, and a multi media screen is a fire hazard, IMO.

5) They even increase the height of the bus in order to add upper berths, such change should directly come from the factory following all the norms and thorough testing.

[Fx14]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

The driver and cleaner however escaped most likely through thd driver's side door.

Plus it looks like the driver was dozing off. When a vehicle's driver's side is hit, it usually indicates that some unfit and/or incapable person is behind the wheels.

Perhaps if inquired into in details one out of every few accidents will reveal some surprises that had been ignored.

Some interesting observations there. Points out that the driver and cleaner were well alert and promptly escaped from the available escape route. Rules out the driver dozing off, no.

Brings us to the second part, could it have been the cleaner driving under the supervision of the driver to gain experience?since it was a deserted road and all were asleep.

[old_cayuse]

https://*******.com/yrv5sksc
This is another claim being made!

In my estimation it is the extremely poor knowledge of driving that leads to these horrors on our roads. All and sundry cannot become good and safe drivers. It needs a combination of intense training and penal enforcement to reduce the unnecessary death and injury toll on Indian roads.

[lina]

I have recently observed that all the rooftop emergency exits of BMTC buses in Bengaluru have been sealed shut.

Probably to keep out the rain but in the event of flooding and/or toppling, these could be life savers. Sad to see that we repeatedly do this type of nonsense.

If a state owned transport corporation does this, imagine the situation of the private folk who just want to drive profit. There will be 0 safety mechanisms

[Sommos]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

A gory accident and amongst the worst so far on this expressway. Cannot attribute to any incongruencies on the super expressway at all. But the RTO and traffic police personnel had since more than a month back started checking tyres of all vehicles at major entry points. How did this bus' tyre escape notice of these law enforcers? Their mode of working needs to be investigated thoroughly. The errant ones cannot be absolved for their criminal act be it the bus owner or law enforcers and need to be punished under the law. Losing 25 lives in a burning bus is very gruesome. Its merely shoddy, slip shod, callous, criminal and condemnable approach by the concerned that has caused the loss of 25 innocent victims.

The above is a myth, Sir. I have travelled on this road on 25th and 28th of May, 2023 from Nagpur to Shirdi and back and I have not seen any such checking. On the contrary I have seen two-wheelers plying on the access controlled E-way and also one four-wheeler driving in the opposite direction.

As per the instructions displayed on this route, the bus / HMV should use the left lane where the speed limit is 80KMPH. The middle lane is for LMV @ 120 KMPH and the right lane is the overtaking lane. Do not understand the reasons for the bus travelling @ 70 KMPH to come to the right lane.

[ike]

Originally Posted by Hayek

1) Should bus operators be allowed to operate overnight routes with drowsy drivers? What was the cleaner doing - was he also asleep?
2) Why don’t our buses have emergency exits that can open easily and let people escape?

1. Very routine for drivers to have heavy workloads even with multiple drivers, one drives most of onward leg & the other does most of the return leg. For eg. A hyderabad - Kochi trip which is in excess of a 1000 KMS, Driver one drives till Erode(~15 hours of the total of 20 Hrs). Driver 2 drives Erode - Kochi. Again Driver 1 drives Kochi - Erode and then he is done. Driver 2 is left to drive the remaining 15 Hrs back to Hyderabad.
   No equal sharing within a trip. Cleaner is usually tasked with handing out blankets, water etc. Mostly driver is by himself at night and everyone else sleeps.
   
2. They have emergency exits these days but not accessible as you pointed out. Most buses have the body built by regional workshops and the exits are for namesake. Probably the regulations are lax around this and they only need to have a door and a label saying it is the emergency exit.

[GeeTee TSI]

To add further on the point of emergency doors, all sealed window AC buses should have emergency windows which pop/burst open lest the mechanism get jammed due to twisted chassis. It is criminal that it was not the crash impact which resulted in casualties but the burning in a sealed chamber

Do any of the long distance buses (besides Volvo and Scania) even have ABS, ESP and passive safety features? I wonder if such features could have helped the driver recover if a twitch and a slide caused it

As pointed out in earlier posts, strict records and monitoring of the hours of duty and the hours of rest. No rest implies no duty, sorry customers

When it comes to inspection of vehicles at the expressway, rather than the RTO's prerogative to inspect each vehicle for road worthiness; it is upto the driver and fleet operator to do that before each trip

I am curious how does Diesel burst into flames as is being said in some reports, doesn't it have a high flash point?

[NomadSK]

Originally Posted by GeeTee TSI

I am curious how does Diesel burst into flames as is being said in some reports, doesn't it have a high flash point?

True, flash point occurs only when the source of ignition is presesnt for the vapours to catch fire at minimum tempearure. Diesel have higher flash point than petrol. However, in this case the temperature would be auto ignition temperature (where no direct source of ignition is required, only heat is enough to start the fire), if Diesel tank would have ruptured/leaked and got in contact with any hot surface like Engine, exhaust tail pipe, catalytic convertor or even the heat produced by the friction during the accident the diesel would spontaneously ignite, subjected that the temperature is above the auto-ignition.

Auto ignition temperature of diesel is lower than petrol.

[narayans80]

The key question that needs to be answered is how the bus caught fire. It is definitely not diesel. If that were the case, lot more dramatic crashes in the Accidents thread would have resulted in fire.

The 2 events I am aware were triggered by bus hitting trucks carrying flammable cargo. There is no second vehicle here, so external factor is ruled out.

[mercedised]

Very sad to know that cars and other means of transport are being upgraded with host of safety features but public means of transport especially buses are still in era of 90's in terms of safety of passengers.

I would like to tell my experience :

I had to travel by bus from Indore to Shahdol which is approx 850 kms and takes 15 hours. There was only one bus service at that time that ran between the two cities. I boarded the bus at 6:00 PM and the bus had some problem 50 kms before Shahdol at around 8:00 AM the next day morning, we all were shifted to another local bus and reached our destination. I had the return booking in same bus the same day at 4:00 PM. I finished the work and boarded the bus and to my surprise came to know that the driver did not sleep, as the repair works took 4-5 hours. There was no other crew member with the driver. The driver drove the bus another 850 kms without any sleep to Indore. So, in total he was deprived of sleep for a total of 36 hours approx. Fortunately, we reached the destination without any problems. This is a general affair he told me and he was used to it now. I never travelled by bus after that incident.

[silverado]

We have had many similar accidents where fuel tank has burst easily. Can our manufacturers change the location of fuel tank to somewhere safe? maybe between the ladder frame if its technically possible?

Fuel tank in our all buses/trucks are always dangling at a side and they stand no chance in case of impact, causing spillage in almost all cases fire.

The buses that run between Pune and other parts of MH are popular with people since they run overnight and are cost effective way to travel.

I have been in one to Yavatmal and i can say maintenance is not the topmost thing for these guys. Driver fatigue is not something we consider as a problem in india, its accepted since long time and nothing has been done about it.

[Voodooblaster]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

The newsreports say the passengers who exited also shouted for help from passing vehicles but no one stopped

This is the saddest part of the whole tragedy

Additional Sleeper Bus problems:

The chassis of these busses are often extended by aftermarket body builders to add a couple of additional berths. This can be visually confirmed if you check the rear overhang of single axle sleeper buses.

[RGK]

@Silverado - Absolutely.

The Volvo and Scania have engines fitted at the back. In case of a crash, the spilled fuel gets showered (due to the wind) across the motor, which is very hot and causes fire. This is one of the reason for them to catch fire easily. This isn't true with our Indian made ones.

[Zippy_wheels]

Originally Posted by Sommos

The above is a myth, Sir. I have travelled on this road on 25th and 28th of May, 2023 from Nagpur to Shirdi and back and I have not seen any such checking.

Agree with this. Before travelling I was apprehensive that there would be checking, but I hit the Aurangabad toll at 12:00AM on 30th April - no checking. I thought maybe due to night, although it should not matter, since the highway is open 24/7, you cant do checking only during "office hours".

Then again, I reached the toll on Nagpur side at 3:00 PM on 10th June - no checking, and no option to fill nitrogen, for last 50 kms. There was a Ceat shop just before the toll, but they were going to start operations from next day (I saw a few cops standing nearby but they were not checking). After I crossed the toll, there was a pump on the left, but they could not fill nitrogen since there was no electricity (apparently they cant run the nitrogen machine on generator). Thankfully my tyres were new (less than 8k) and I stopped every 100-150 kms to allow them to cool down. Also it was raining intermittently and that would have helped with heat dissipation.

The biggest problem is lack of stoppage/rest areas. If they had a couple good (and maybe mandatory) stoppages, it would be good for the driver as well as the vehicle.

There is no issue/fault with the road. Anyone who says the design is faulty has not been on this road. There are absolutely no potholes, the road is straight, no diversions and it is broad enough.

The other problem is heavy vehicles occupying the center and right lanes at slow speed and refusing to move. You can keep flashing, but they dont pay attention. You are forced to overtake from left side. It appears this bus was also doing the same, since it crashed on the right side median. There are no poles on the lanes so it is very likely that the driver dozed off and went into the service lane and continued veering right to ultimately crash on to poles/medians on the right.

So sad and tragic. I wish people were more helpful and compassionate. If they had stopped and tried they may have been able to pull a few more people out. Every life saved would have been a god gift for those families. It should be criminal to pass by and not help but that cannot be enforced legally, its just how our society is.

[NiInJa]

Not sure why the bus' deformation led to emergency exit getting jammed. Isn't this taken into consideration when building such buses? shouldn't the frame be reinforced to deal with these forces?

I feel all sleeper buses should have openable sliding windows, these coaches are just not engineered well enough.

Instead of making ethanol mandatory, Mr. Gadkari should have forced coach manufacturers to adhere to some safety standards on public transport by now. Life is so cheap in India :(

I haven't been to Samruddhi expressway yet, but it looks like the road is too comfortable for inexperienced drivers to overestimate their vehicle's capabilities that is leading to such accidents. Authorities should have kept the speed limit lower in the initial years with strict penalties for overspeeding, let drivers get used to such roads first. The Mumbai-Pune expressway saw a lot of accidents back in the day when it was opened, people became wiser as years passed. Our drivers are not yet used to the idea of driving constantly at high speeds for long hours like other developed countries, neither are most of the cars with puny tyres (with questionable quality) and overloaded with occupants.