[vb-saan]

Hi All! Here is my turn to get some 'What car' advice

I recently sold off my Ford Ikon, and now in need to get a new drive when I visit India in Jan / Feb 2012. The association with Ford India started in 2003 December, and the journey so far had been pretty good. All good things need to end eventually, and in this case my BIL had a liking to the aging Ikon (only done close to 50K kms), and offered a decent deal for the car. So now the car is still very much in the family albeit in another city!

Even though I get to drive the car only once in a while (maybe for 2-3 weeks in every 6-8 months), I would like my next car to fulfill some of the key parameters I am looking for:

1. Safety: Should have all possible safety features available in its class – good structural integrity, ABS, airbags, and all those possible acronyms.
2. Drive: Should be good to drive, and a reasonably communicative steering – need something to match (or better) the sweet steering of the Ikon 1.6. 0-100 figures is not so important, but the car should not feel too under-powered.
3. Ride Quaility: Should have a reasonable backseat – prime commuters will be my parents, and hence a comfortable backseat (for 2) with not much of tossing around will really help.
4. Dealership/AS&S: A dealer with good attitude – this is an important parameter, and the Ford guys in my town get a 5-star rating in this aspect. They might have gone wrong a couple of times in past 7 years, but it was really a breeze dealing with them. Always do reminder calls for service, and if there are issues, they pick up the car from our place, and drop it back (even for an eight year old car). Only point I did not like was, they have a tendency to fabricate a bit on insurance claims.
5. Ownership experience: And finally, the most important aspect – should be easy to live with. I prefer my car to run on stock form. Adding up leather seats is ok, but it will be better if I don’t need to look for tyre change, audio setup change and so on, soon after the delivery.

Now the budget and chosen candidates.

Budget:
Rs. 700,000 to Rs. 1,200,000 (can stretch +200K if needed)


The Finalists:
Based on my personal preferences and the knowledge I gained being a part of this wonderful community, presenting the choices below**:

**The choices mentioned are by requirements, and is not confined to a specific segment (though mainly concentrated around premium C segment).
1) Skoda Rapid TDI Elegance
2) Ford Fiesta Titanium+
3) VW Vento TDI Highline
4) Fiat Linea T-Jet+
5) Honda City V MT/AT

An outside option (a segment above the choices listed):
6) Skoda Laura 1.8 TSI*

*Always been a fan of the Laura, and especially the 1.8 TSI. With the discounts running, this is one tempting option!

I did consider a segment higher – like the new Jetta, and the wonderful Yeti, but due to strong resistance from family against spending so much on car (which I don’t drive everyday); it’s currently kept out of the list.

Key Question: Petrol or Diesel?

• Average running of 500 kms/month for 10 months and 1000 kms/month for 2 months
• Will be Chauffer driven for almost 10 months in a year.
• Thrissur is a small town, so instead of classifying by city/highway, I will say 70% on congested/bad roads v/s 30% on open roads

What is important for me is to identify which of the above options can provide relatively stressfree ownership in the stock form.

Some guidance (with pros and cons of the choices above) will be of great help. In the next few days I am looking to narrow down the list, so that I can do selective TDs and make a final choice in my upcoming visit to Kerala.

[mayankk]

heart says fiesta, but i suppose a city MT would be the most painfree....
running doesnt warrant a diesel, but push to shove scenario, then the vento.

[libranof1987]

If you're going with petrol, City VMT seems a good choice. Since it'll be chauffeur driven, VAT wouldn't make much sense.

You're fine with going up to 14 lakhs, right? How about a Civic SMT? Stretch a bit for Toyota Altis?

If you go with diesel, Rapid TDI should win over Vento.

[carfreak77]

Hey VB! I would have suggested the fiesta but since you say it will be chauffer driven, I rule that one out. Also, as you know the fiesta's backseat is one of its low points. Since you are not hell-bent on diesel I would suggest you to go for the Honda City VMT or AT. The city does have a comfortable backseat and you can be sure it will be reliable.

[rangakishen]

Originally Posted by vb-san

• Thrissur is a small town, so instead of classifying by city/highway, I will say 70% on congested/bad roads v/s 30% on open roads

If petrol ANHC is the obvious choice for being chauffeur driven. Else Tsi is a very good petrol car!! But these suggestions are dependent heavily upon the quoted part. Just how bad are the roads? ANHC is pretty poor when it comes to ground clearance.

If you want to go for diesel, the I'd strongly suggest you have a look at Sunny. I know its not even in your shortlist but it is a good car (caaar) to be chauffeur driven in.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by mayankk

heart says fiesta, but i suppose a city MT would be the most painfree....

Originally Posted by libranof1987

If you're going with petrol, City VMT seems a good choice. Since it'll be chauffeur driven, VAT wouldn't make much sense.

Originally Posted by carfreak77

Since you are not hell-bent on diesel I would suggest you to go for the Honda City VMT or AT. The city does have a comfortable backseat and you can be sure it will be reliable.

Thanks guys! The initial responses are much in favor of the City. Which is not a bad thing – I actually liked some of the changes Honda did with the mid-life refresh. And yes, since it will be chauffer-driven, I guess the AT does not make much sense.

Originally Posted by libranof1987

You're fine with going up to 14 lakhs, right? How about a Civic SMT? Stretch a bit for Toyota Altis?

Civic is a good option but I think the new model is still a few months away. It should have been in the list if the launch is anytime soon. And the Altis – great car, and a proven number from Toyota, but I don’t see myself getting one.

The stretched budget was mainly keeping the Laura TSI in mind

Originally Posted by carfreak77

Also, as you know the fiesta's backseat is one of its low points.

I need some more input from you (being a Fiesta owner)
You mentioned the backseat is the Fiesta’s low point. And I remember reading somewhere that the rear headrests are quite a pain. Is that really the case?

Now here is one more question. I know that the running does not warrant a diesel, but is there any specific advantage/disadvantage on going for a diesel (other than the obvious difference in fuel cost)?

[nfsfreak]

Originally Posted by vb-san

Now here is one more question. I know that the running does not warrant a diesel, but is there any specific advantage/disadvantage on going for a diesel (other than the obvious difference in fuel cost)?

The price difference in petrol & diesel variants is huge (say Rs 1-2 lakhs-depends on the brand). You could easily get a fully loaded top-end petrol variant for the price which could get only mid-variant diesel in same brand.

Diesel cars need regular running for better engine life. **(not sure about modern day diesels. I own a 2004 Accent CRDi)

Petrols are relatively problem free compared to diesels & easy on pocket on maintenance front.

[lloydofcochin]

vb-san,

My recommendation would be the T-Jet. It ticks all the boxes except the 4th criteria which is dependent on the dealership in the City.

Going from an Ikon 1.6 the T-Jet steering is even better. I can safely say that since I too owned an Ikon 1.6. And FIATs are renowned for their ride quality & high speed stability. FIATs have that tank like build quality and with ABS, Airbags & all round disk brakes the safety aspect is also taken care of. Ah and that bring us to the engine & handling which is probably unmatched in the same class

I would not touch Skoda since I hate companies who goes legal against unsuspecting customers.

If you are looking at an all round car without the fear of A.S.S maybe you should opt for a Honda

Cheers
Lloyd

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by vb-san

----snipped----

Now here is one more question. I know that the running does not warrant a diesel, but is there any specific advantage/disadvantage on going for a diesel (other than the obvious difference in fuel cost)?

That, sir, is THE hornet's nest.

Best left to the hundreds of, ahem, "discussions", that have happened over the years.

[mayankjha1806]

Originally Posted by vb-san

Budget:
Rs. 700,000 to Rs. 1,200,000 (can stretch +200K if needed)

My suggestion, if you are looking at City, then you could look at Civic as well. For 14L OTR you could get Civic (Discounted current one, if you don't have a problem with that). Mine costed 14.4 OTR BLR and i believe Bangalore OTR prices are on much higher side as compared to the rest of India.

Alternatively if you are going to buy Petrol, the City makes most sense. Do test drives the cars and push for discounts. This is the best time to buy petrol cars.

[suhaas307]

VB-San

Why don't you try and stretch your budget a bit, for the Renault Fluence? I'd highly recommend it. A friend had bought it recently and I'd driven it, and honestly, it feels brilliant! I love the way it looks, and it drives really well too.

If you can't stretch the budget though, I'd say, get the Vento.

Even the Civic isn't a bad option. If you don't mind living with a car that will soon be outdated.

Well, about the petrol/diesel dilemma, it's entirely upto you. I'd always recommend a petrol, especially if your driving doesn't warrant a diesel car. But if you don't like the idea of petrol prices shooting northward every month (who does, actually? ) and don't want it to affect your pocket, then get a diesel car.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by rangakishen

If petrol City is the obvious choice for being chauffeur driven. Else Tsi is a very good petrol car!! But these suggestions are dependent heavily upon the quoted part. Just how bad are the roads? ANHC is pretty poor when it comes to ground clearance.

I do hear that bit about the GC issue of the City. But I guess any car will have that threat in my area. I am sure that can be managed with a bit of careful driving (unless if someone say that the GC is really bad, and can cause underbody damage).

If you want to go for diesel, the I'd strongly suggest you have a look at Sunny. I know its not even in your shortlist but it is a good car (caaar) to be chauffeur driven in.

Sunny – an inoffensive number, but somehow I cannot see myself getting one . And then, we don’t have a local dealership for Nissan in our place.

Originally Posted by nfsfreak

The price difference in petrol & diesel variants is huge (say Rs 1-2 lakhs-depends on the brand). You could easily get a fully loaded top-end petrol variant for the price which could get only mid-variant diesel in same brand.
Petrols are relatively problem free compared to diesels & easy on pocket on maintenance front.

Originally Posted by mayankk

That, sir, is THE hornet's nest.
Best left to the hundreds of, ahem, "discussions", that have happened over the years.

This is one big dilemma I am having. One advantage I can see with diesel is that my parents may use the car more. And I was told that even though there is a huge difference in the initial investment, the same difference will show up if you sell the car in, say 3 years.

Are modern diesels high on maintenance compared to Petrol motors, or it is a thing of the past?

Note: My knowledge on diesels is only from online resources, and information from this forum. Never owned a diesel car before, and I am living in a almost petrol only country

Originally Posted by lloydofcochin

vb-san,
My recommendation would be the T-Jet. It ticks all the boxes except the 4th criteria which is dependent on the dealership in the City.

Going from an Ikon 1.6 the T-Jet steering is even better. I can safely say that since I too owned an Ikon 1.6. And FIATs are renowned for their ride quality & high speed stability. FIATs have that tank like build quality and with ABS, Airbags & all round disk brakes the safety aspect is also taken care of. Ah and that bring us to the engine & handling which is probably unmatched in the same class

I would not touch Skoda since I hate companies who goes legal against unsuspecting customers.

If you are looking at an all round car without the fear of A.S.S maybe you should opt for a Honda

Cheers
Lloyd

Thanks Lloyd! T-Jet+ is always there on the wishlist. And I hear all good things about the steering, build quality, handling etc. When it was launched, I did feel that the T-Jet will be an ideal replacement for the Ikon. But the main issue is what you mentioned – the dealership. From the interactions I had with them, it’s not much of a pleasant feeling. The way Tata dealership responded to my emails was quite disappointing. (on the contrary, VW & Skoda folks were so professional in the way they answered to my queries).
That said, it is still in my list, and will definitely gauge my options after making a visit to the dealership. Infact, they along with Ford are just 2kms away from my residence in Thrissur.

[oxyzen]

The T-Jet is by far the best car as per your requirements.
It is safe, Has Airbags, ABS, all disc, strong body.
Steering definitely has the best feedback, but on a personal front, I like slighter lighter steering with more agility.
As for the ride is concerned, the T-Jet+ is a bit on the stiffer side, better go for the T-Jet.
And when it comes to A$$ they are simply [pathetic. Atleast in my place. But thats not all. T-Jet comes with its own share of problems. Like poor fit & finish, rubbery gearshift, poor ergonomics & so on.

The other car I think clicks all the boxes is the Honda Civic.

All the cars selected do lack in some or other.
1) Skoda Rapid TDI Elegance - Steering
2) Ford Fiesta Titanium+ Performance
3) VW Vento TDI Highline - Steering
4) Fiat Linea T-Jet+ - A$$
5) Honda City V MT/AT - Steering

So if you are bent upon on a petrol T-Jet is the way to go, unless you want to spend ridiculously for an aging Civic.
Or if you want a diesel & can get over the driving interface (Steering feedback) the Rapid/Vento will be a great choice.

[90BHP]

Looking at your overall requirements, you would need a car with a relatively plush back seat & good suspensions. The new City does fit the bill perfectly in terms of costs as well as the fuel economy. The after sales is also relatively easy on the pocket.

The Skoda rapid is also a good choice but, then it does require a very strong service center presence in your town.

A petrol car is defenitely the car of choice here however, might I interest you to try out the Toyota Innova Diesel as well ? It may be a slight stretch in the budget but, will certainly much better in terms of suspensions.

[rameshnanda]

vb-san, you should seriously consider the T-Jet+ with the current discounts offered. I got a quote of Rs. 8.7L OTR for T-Jet+ in Chennai.