[SDP]

Originally Posted by msdivy

...
The banks are prioritizing over the counter transactions, hold their quota of cash for this purpose. They are not filling their ATMs, hence most ATMs are running dry. This is affecting those who want petty cash but don't have old notes to exchange. They must too spend 4 hours in the queue even to get a sum of Rs 100.

Since you are pretty convinced about this, may I request you to please share the source of this information?

2000Rs notes can NOT be loaded into the ATM machines currently. Would need change in software as well cash-holding cassettes. If the exchange currency is predominantly in the new 2000 denomination, isn't it obvious that currently more transactions would happen at the counter and not at the ATM. So its not "The banks are prioritizing over the counter transactions, hold their quota of cash for this purpose". If it seems that way currently, its because they don't have a choice.

The new 500Rs notes are just around the corner (might even be out since today morning) and would ease the situation quite a bit.

That is precisely the question, if they are prepared for 10 months, why there is cash crunch now? ...
...

As I mentioned, there is most likely enough for everybody's need, but not for everybody's greed.

Some numbers for you to mull over -
As per a TV report, there are 2 lakh ATMs in India. More than 40% were put in operation Friday and even more on subsequent days (Don't remember if this was specific to SBI ATMs or across all banks). The cash holding capacity of each ATM has reduced as 500 and 1000 notes are no longer being loaded in ATMs. At the same time, ATMs which used to get reloaded once in 3 days are now getting reloaded every 3-4 hours.

I can still understand the situation in smaller places. But in a place like Mumbai - where somebody like me can survive without spending even 100Rs of cash in last 5 days - I don't understand the queues at each ATM to withdraw cash everyday.

[ijeet]

Originally Posted by pratyush6

My biggest concern is for Rural India - where transactions are typically in cash - of someone can tell me what's happening there, it would be better.
Also, because of the smaller population of rural India - it might actually not be such a problem in exchanging notes.

!

Just a titbit for you, 70% of Indian population lives in villages (Not small towns) rest 30% in small towns and metros.

-Ijeet

[Santoshbhat]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

Contradictory opinions among economists on the usefulness of this measure:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-37970965

The article is basically reading out the opinion of the Chief Economic Advisor to the previous Govt.

[msdivy]

Originally Posted by SDP

Since you are pretty convinced about this, may I request you to please share the source of this information?

This was my observations by visiting at least 10 bank branches yesterday. Except for Axis & ICICI (which again had huge queues), none of the other bank ATMs were working.

As I mentioned, there is most likely enough for everybody's need, but not for everybody's greed.

The words look great to hear, but has anybody's need been measured?

I am all for demonetization and with Govt on this. But the execution had to be quick. I am a bit concerned on the execution part. Looks like it is going to get worse.

[pratyush6]

Originally Posted by ijeet

Just a titbit for you, 70% of Indian population lives in villages (Not small towns) rest 30% in small towns and metros.

-Ijeet

I knew someone would correct me on this , what I meant and not particularly well worded was, most of Rural India people would visit once from a family to deposit and withdraw notes, while the Urban India has this more and more people visiting banks. I know for a fact that same people queue up to same banks in the same day! For what to exchange 4k.

Also, why would anyone visit more than once to deposit in his bank account? Until and Unless he is trying to hide something.

[daretodream]

In midst of this, and given that this is team-bhp, let's hope that the printing machines withstand the load.

It would be like a seldom used moped - used for few hours per week.. and now expected to run ~24 hours per day :-D

Coming from a manufacturing background, I can relate to this issue when one key equipment failure brings down the whole line!
God forbid if that happens, then expect more hassles!

[Sankar]

Wife went to convert 4500/- at her HDFC branch in the city but bank said "no cash" so had to deposit it in her account and come back. Couple of ATMs she checked enroute are also dry including the ATM at this branch.

Originally Posted by wrongturn

Did anyone else notice the different shades of ₹2000 note?

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...1401.46.32.jpg

Not just the shade. See how the pink crosses over the embedded security thread in one note and not the other? The note below matches with the sample/specimen pictures of the Rs.2000 notes available on the Internet.

[vibbs]

Originally Posted by wrongturn

Did anyone else notice the different shades of ₹2000 note?

Did anyone try rubbing the new note with a piece of cotton? The pink colour comes off in the cotton.

I tried this with my colleague today in the office after two of my friends reported this.

[Sawyer]

Originally Posted by Santoshbhat

The article is basically reading out the opinion of the Chief Economic Advisor to the previous Govt.

Well, he is a noted economist, isn't he?
And as I pointed out in my post that has the link, there are different views among economists, because a contrary view by another is also part of the latter half of the same news item, so I thought it is a balanced news item that, to me at least, was useful for the insights presented.

[goswami.j]

Originally Posted by msdivy

This was my observations by visiting at least 10 bank branches yesterday. Except for Axis & ICICI (which again had huge queues), none of the other bank ATMs were working.

ATMs are having serpentine ques, had gone to my HDFC bank, luckily together with my cheque book. The line was much much shorter for cheque withdrawal and I was out of the bank in less than an hour with 20K in 100s denomination.
It seems there are more people with ATM cards that those with cheque facilities.

You could probably try that in one of your branches in the city to see if it works.

[sukhoi30]

Originally Posted by vibbs

Did anyone try rubbing the new note with a piece of cotton? The pink colour comes off in the cotton.

I tried this with my colleague today in the office after two of my friends reported this.

I am yet to get my hands on the new notes. But if what you are saying is true, then there is a serious issue. All that hoopla about the security of the notes will go down the drain.

[tharian]

Originally Posted by vibbs

Did anyone try rubbing the new note with a piece of cotton? The pink colour comes off in the cotton.

I tried this with my colleague today in the office after two of my friends reported this.

Sounds like result of hasty production to meet the major demand.
Wonder if now that will become an issue from people accepting them thinking it's fake.

There was already a case reported of fake 2k notes from being photocopied and a farmer accepting them since he couldn't know how the new note looks like.

[SilentEngine]

Originally Posted by msdivy

I am all for demonetization and with Govt on this. But the execution had to be quick. I am a bit concerned on the execution part. Looks like it is going to get worse.

Where the government goofed up is in underestimating ATM recalibration, and its impact. In Saturday's press con, Jaitley mentioned it as 3 weeks to have all ATMs functional.

Sooner they get all ATMs to handle 2000s and new 500s, better the chance of containing this.

Originally Posted by pratyush6

Urban India has this more and more people visiting banks. I know for a fact that same people queue up to same banks in the same day! For what to exchange 4k.

1. Not everybody is visiting the bank where they have an account. Lot of people are simply walking into any bank where they think the crowd is less, at least this is what i observed on Saturday.
2. Another possibility is some people are simply ignorant on withdrawing amount from the bank directly, or they don't know how simple it is, so they end up going to the exchange counter. This was the case where one person was suggesting to another to visit the exact branch of the bank where they hold their account and that you can't withdraw amount from another branch of same bank.

Originally Posted by pratyush6

Also, why would anyone visit more than once to deposit in his bank account? Until and Unless he is trying to hide something.

Nobody will come twice to deposit on same day, that would be foolish. Even if it's someone who generates lot of cash daily via business, they will do well to reduce number of visits to the bank.

Originally Posted by goswami.j

It seems there are more people with ATM cards that those with cheque facilities.

Very true!

[hemanth.anand]

Originally Posted by wrongturn

Did anyone else notice the different shades of ₹2000 note?

Not all notes have the same shade. Not just the new 2000 notes all the previous notes are/were like this. It was more evident in 1000s earlier. It is physically impossible too. There will be a colour range between which the shade should lie

Originally Posted by Sankar

Not just the shade. See how the pink crosses over the embedded security thread in one note and not the other? The note below matches with the sample/specimen pictures of the Rs.2000 notes available on the Internet.

The thread was never in the same region. open any old notes 100/500/1000, the security thread was never in the same exact location in two notes. There will be a fair amount of tolerance for this.

Originally Posted by vibbs

Did anyone try rubbing the new note with a piece of cotton? The pink colour comes off in the cotton.

I tried this with my colleague today in the office after two of my friends reported this.

Yes it does, and it is not new and special to 2000 rupees notes. Ask any bank cashier who deals with lot of cash counting. At the end of the day, their finger tips are coloured. I used to see this on my father's fingers when he used to be in service in a bank

Too many people are reading too much into these notes IMO. Yesterday many people (including a couple of newspaper houses) told that there are typos in Hindi language saying that they had written "don hazaar rupaye" instead of "do hazaar rupaye". Later they were embarassed to hear that it was konkani and marathi language and it was inline with all the notes that we had all these years.

[pratyush6]

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

Where the government goofed up is in underestimating ATM recalibration, and its impact. In Saturday's press con, Jaitley mentioned it as 3 weeks to have all ATMs functional.

He also mentioned the reason why ATMs were not re-calibrated. If it was then the cat would have been out of the bag.

Originally Posted by SilentEngine

1. Not everybody is visiting the bank where they have an account. Lot of people are simply walking into any bank where they think the crowd is less, at least this is what i observed on Saturday.
2. Another possibility is some people are simply ignorant on withdrawing amount from the bank directly, or they don't know how simple it is, so they end up going to the exchange counter.

A lot of people are visiting the same bank trying to exchange 4k (now 4.5k) and yes, it does not depend if you have an account with them or not.

Hence I believe there are separate lines for deposit and withdrawal/exchange. For deposit you would need to visit your own Bank (not branch) For exchange you can walk in to any bank of your choice - people most likely choose the one which they feel are the closet and queues are lesser.
I for had a couple of 500s, just spent them on fuel - No Problems.

I think there might be better co-ordination if people are simply given time slots/tokens based upon capacity of the bank, no use for anyone waiting in line only to be returned. So if 1 counter can handle 15 people in an hour for exchange then just multiply 15 by x hours and distribute those tokens - People would appreciate that.