[GTO]

Leaving the technicalities & statistics aside, this is indeed a "growing" problem (pun intended ). All around me, I see friends & family members simply eating too much...way more than is needed. I too walked down that path for a decade, but luckily was able to correct the course.

There is too much junk food available and thanks to the apps, access is too easy to them. One needs mind-boggling will power to stay fit, remain healthy & eat well day after day. It's a lifestyle change as much as it is a mindset change. Not easy, but very possible. Do it for your own wellness - being overweight / obese comes with many physical limitations & diseases.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Being in Poverty and obese is a USA phenomenon was my point, I don't think you disagree to that.

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Would you consider 65% obesity in a population of 50,000 a bigger problem than ~ 40% Obesity in a population of 300 Million? Therefore United states.

Originally Posted by srini1785

Could someone please define " Obese " in technical terms before getting into discussions on the click bait topic?.

You need to consider the term obese in relation to the measurement of BMI.

Body Mass Index (BMI) is a person’s weight in kilograms divided by the square of height in meters. A high BMI can be an indicator of high body fatness.

To calculate BMI, see the Adult BMI Calculator or determine BMI by finding your height and weight in this BMI Index Chartexternal icon.

If your BMI is less than 18.5, it falls within the underweight range.
If your BMI is 18.5 to <25, it falls within the normal.
If your BMI is 25.0 to <30, it falls within the overweight range.
If your BMI is 30.0 or higher, it falls within the obese range.

Obesity is frequently subdivided into categories:

Class 1: BMI of 30 to < 35
Class 2: BMI of 35 to < 40
Class 3: BMI of 40 or higher. Class 3 obesity is sometimes categorized as “extreme” or “severe” obesity.

BMI does not measure body fat directly, but research has shown that BMI is moderately correlated with more direct measures of body fat obtained from skinfold thickness measurements, bioelectrical impedance, underwater weighing, dual energy x-ray absorptiometry (DXA) and other methods. Furthermore, BMI appears to be strongly correlated with various adverse health outcomes consistent with these more direct measures of body fatness.

So BMI is generally considered to be a good indicator. It also a parameter that is relatively easy to calculate for big groups of people. Note that being obese comes over and above the range of overweight.

Originally Posted by Samurai

BMI is a very loose metrics that doesn't consider fat vs muscle weight. It puts lots of very fit people into overweight or even obese category. It is ok for people who don't workout.

You would have to be seriously fit before that becomes a problem. For most people it is a pretty good indicator. In order to qualify as Obese you need to have a BMI over 30. Look at the above scale and calculation! So unless you are a serious sporting person it is likely that you have an issue. But as I mentioned before, BMI is an indicator and a doctor would check a few other things first.

For the last 8-9 years I am under constant and strict supervision regarding my diet/metabolism. I am on a constant (restrictive) diet more or less all the timeMy doctor/dietist will always measure the following with every visit. They do calculate BMI as well, but the below is what determines I can eat!

- weight
- % fat % muscle
- waist circumference
- Upper leg circumference
- blood pressure and heart rate

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

The difference is % of population Vs actual numbers. If you have 80% obesity in a population on 100,000 - thats significant but 10% of 1.3 Billion is surely a whopping number. Therefore India. Here is a screen shot and link.

Numbers are staggering, out of the 650 Million obese globally, we have 135 Million, something to think about.

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Would you consider 65% obesity in a population of 50,000 a bigger problem than ~ 40% Obesity in a population of 300 Million? Therefore United states.

I don’t think comparing absolute numbers is very useful. Percentage in a country (as shown in the table) is probably more relevant. The effects (economic and social) tend to be very local.

So lets take as an example my wife’s home country Barbados. A small island in the West Indies. Population about 275.000. 41% of women and 22% of adult men are obese. Which means that the number of diabetes 2 patients on the island is going ballistic. One way or the other, it tends to be society at large that takes the burden of of this. (similar to people living longer). This one is a real problem, people become ill, need to be looked after, people can do less work, tend to loose limbs etc.

Originally Posted by aargee

Jeroen bhai any specific reason that you see why almost all the smaller Oceanic countries are topping the obesity list?

Not sure, see also my reference to Barbados mentioned above. In many of these (former colonised) countries you also see a massive shift in diet over the last couple of decades.

See https://www.healthcareglobal.com/hos...-nations-world

Jeroen

[Thermodynamics]

45% is going to be humongous. If I combine the following projection of world population growth by 2050 with obesity factor, clearly the message is ...

Invest in FMCG

[srini1785]

Two overlooked factors :

1. Genetics
2. Physical ailments - Like thyroid imbalance.

Factor 1 plays an important role in endemic populations. Some population are genetically more prone to being larger than others, like say American Samoa. The dialog that Joules says in Pulp Fiction " I wouldn't go so far as to call him FAT. What's a brother got to do when he is half Samoan ?" summarizes it all. .

Factor 2 can be corrected through medicine.

No excuses for any other reasons.

I am aware of BMI index but it has to be defined on nationality basis. Our ( Indian) height is smaller than say the European or American average, so's our weight. So it all boils down to nutrition.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by srini1785

Two overlooked factors :

1. Genetics
2. Physical ailments - Like thyroid imbalance.

I am aware of BMI index but it has to be defined on nationality basis. Our ( Indian) height is smaller than say the European or American average, so's our weight. So it all boils down to nutrition.

Like so many medical conditions, genetics can play a contributing role, but it is very rare for genetics to be the primary role, I am led to believe

Both length and weight are part of the BMI equation. What is true that the outcome e.g. BMI 24 could have different meaning depending on race/ethnicity.

It has been suggested that the BMI scale has a bias towards white people (Caucasian). Now for the bad news; that means for say Asian/Indian folks the BMI scale needs to be lowered! So you would be considered obese at a lower BMI number than a caucasian.

Whereas I would be considered overweight at a BMI of 23, for an Indian that could well be well within obesity range!

As mentioned before BMI isn’t so much an absolute scale or reference as more a simple indicator. It is, by no means, fool proof and a doctor will always look for other indicators as well, before coming to a conclusion.

But those of us who travel internationally can confirm; obesity is something that you can just observe out in the public. Being Obese is just being grossly overweight and that almost always shows very clearly in people of all ages, races, ethnicity.

What is perhaps more relevant to all of us, is that it is not just being obese that is the problem. Even being overweight comes with penalties, medically speaking. So a healthy lifestyle is really relevant for everybody and does everybody good.

Enjoy, stay healthy!

Jeroen

[lazy]

I quite well understand the pros-cons of BMI calculation; and still I'll say this - BMI is a fairly good and simple measure to know where on the scale a person is, in terms of being overweight or not.

Originally Posted by Jeroen

It is the well educated that have the financial means to go and buy a nice sports bike, the gear to go with it etc.
Staying healthy in general, is a far more important topic for well educated people, than people with less education.

Agree with Jeoren here, in the 1st world countries, the affluent do seem to be visually healthier due to the reasons stated.

Originally Posted by Jeroen

There are a few countries/cultures in the world where obesity is considered to be a show of wealth and status!

This is where India is.
We've been a poor country and only in recent decades education/employment/incomes have started reaching a higher %age of our population. (look up nutrition and longevity stats)

For many, being able to eat well is a sign of affluence and it is matter of pride to show. So, this eating well basically translates to eating more and eating expensive stuff more frequently, such as meats, cheese/butter, sweets and restaurant food.

I have experienced this myself, when I've pointed out such food isnt great for your health if eaten too frequently, I've been told - kamaate to khaane ke liye hi hain na, khaao aur aish karo - translates to - we earn to eat well, so eat and be merry.

And then they keep wondering why are aren't able to lose weight despite going to fancy gyms and trying out fancy diets. And blame their genes. It is futile convincing such people that genes have nothing to do with being overweight.

cheers
lazy

[AZT]

Originally Posted by lazy

For many, being able to eat well is a sign of affluence and it is matter of pride to show.

One of my friends from Delhi who is from a wealthy business family told me his family is like "Peth nahi toh Seth nahi" (You're not a boss unless you have a tummy). There is also our habit of calling fat children 'Healthy', ironically those kids are actually unhealthy

Unlike western countries where poor people tend to be more obese as they rely more on junk food, over here it's the exact opposite and sometimes being fat is taken as a sign of prosperity. Nothing about genetics here, just a diet high on desserts, Oil / Ghee / Butter, and probably alcohol.

[alpha1]

In essence, wherever refined food (RF), fast food (FF), soft drinks (SD) have made inroads into becoming a major percentage of calories of population - it has resulted in obesity. Whatever be your underlying genetics.

Now why this is happening?
- FF and SD don't take time and effort to procure and consume, and are designed to assault human senses addictively, so one does easily over consume the quantity
- RF, FF and SD cause really low satiety levels (sometimes engineered to be low) hence one consumes more frequently
- RF, FF and SD typically cause spikes in sugar levels, which disturbs the insulin and body cell interactions leading to accelerated fat accumulation
- In some place it is fashion statement or even matter of affluence to consume RF, FF and SF in place of traditional food
- Of course, industrialization, especially the 3rd kind (Industrie 3.0) has made us mostly sedentary. No physical activity require only BMR level of calorific requirement for survival, which is far below average appetite.

Keep in mind, for a greater part of human beings history: food was never really in excess for majority of population. It is only after the industrial revolution (rising incomes) and green revolution (reduction in food prices) that we could have our tummies full permanently (with good calories or bad - your individual choice).

Refined flour, Sugar were always a luxury historically and hence reserved mostly for special occasions, and except for kings and aristocrats people never encountered the ill effects. Its only today that poor people can indulge in these daily.


Sorry there is no solution, unless we turn back to our earlier lifestyles (physical activities rewarded by unrefined food available infrequently), or continue with the "progress" and ultimately connect ourselves to matrix of virtual reality where we are virtually healthy in spite of virtual vices and physically kept on subsistence diet by the machine.

The wheels of economic progress, crony capitalism and consumerism will NEVER make refined foods, fast foods and soft drinks inaccessible, in fact the whole profit making idea is actually the opposite situation - making it accessible and whole population addicted to it.

[VRJ]

I concur to the theory of the number of educated being less obese. We are very much aware of the consequences of having a bad lifestyle. If someone is still doing it, it's there choice. Their priorities in life are very different. Lot of research has been done towards the effects of sugar, processed food and obesity.

Personally, i can't remember the last time i had a can of Coca-Cola (I was once a Maaza addict, lol). All the credit goes to my doctor friends. My inner circle is still only my school friends and a lot of them have become doctors. I know many of their classmates as well. 80% of the people i know are doctors . So right after my 12th, when we all used to head out for a movie or to grab some food, my friends used to lecture me about what they learned in medschool and they used to intentioanlly make it extra scary to mess with me. Their explanations still run in my mind. I've switched from ordering Coke and popcorn at the movies to just a water bottle now. I reduced eating packaged food, especially biscuits and eliminated frozen food. Fast forward 8 years and my doctor friends are in to all kinds of shit while i think twice to drink a can of Cola, lol. Damn hypocrites.

On the other side, my staff (who studied till 12th or less) drink Thums up almost everyday. They've literally replaced Tea with Thums up. I tried to reason with them, but they just won't listen. What pisses me off is when they offer it to their 6-7 year old children. I see a lot of children, especially in the rural regions, drink a lot of soft drinks. I lecture every parent who give their child soft-drinks, but they continue to do so. Way too much sugar in it and it spoils the enamel on your teeth as well. Soft drinks should be made 18+.

I feel the number of obese will actually reduce in India. I can't comment on the other countries. The number of people, in general, have become more health conscious and they're exercising more. Working out, for a few, maybe a style statement to flex on Instagram, but to a lot of millennial's, it has become a lifestyle. I see a lot of my friends heading to the gym or playing some kind of sport and that's a good sign.

Here's an interesting video of how the number one capitalist in the world is taking advantage of it's superpower status and exporting obesity to other countries. I watched this video when it released on Netflix and it sickened me. The lengths companies go to sell their product and satisfy their shareholders and not giving a hoot about whats happening to its consumers.

https://youtu.be/kmo6lZcdkO0

Cheers!

[RadixLecti]

I agree with many of the points made by various members about the connection between the rise of obesity in India with the increase in availability of cheap, industrially processed foods.
We also take the silver-medal in the world diabetes championships.

However, as might be expected in a country as unequal as ours, I can also see a generational shift in health-consciousness among the more cosmopolitan and affluent/upwardly-mobile members of society.

While this is just anecdata, I find it holds true in the areas of Bombay and Poona (the two cities with which I'm familiar) where such people live, work and play. In the fancier cafes and restaurants, you see plenty of people under 40 as fit and toned as anywhere else in the world. Eavesdropping on their conversations (which I'm quite prone to do when I'm waiting for someone!) yields snippets like "the office 10K" or "I have to get to spin class" or "Crossfit has ruined my rotator-cuff".

When these people are at large family gatherings in such places, you can see a clear difference between their 'prosperous' (i.e. overweight) parents and the younger generation.

The problem for the nation is that such people represent a tiny, tiny, highly privileged slice of the population, who:
a) Are aware of the health risks of overindulgence, particularly when it comes to sugar and other simple carbs
b) Face peer pressure to be fit and healthy, rather than eat or drink to excess
c) Have an 'abundance' rather than a 'scarcity' mindset when it comes to food - i.e. the opposite of the Peth nahi toh Seth nahi mindset quoted by another member a few posts prior to mine
d) Have the time to prepare healthy food for themselves or (more often) the disposable income to pay someone else to make it for them

I see it as inevitable that just like in the West, obesity in India will eventually become highly correlated with the low-income/time-poor sections of society.
As the economy grows our poor will become less poor in absolute monetary terms but inequality looks set to continue to grow, creating the ideal market for purveyors of cheap, calorie-dense but nutritionally-poor foods.

[fhdowntheline]

The other day I was hosting a webinar for my company on Child Health. Amongst the other things, the Dr said something very interesting to a question posed by an employee about his 4 year old not eating well enough at the dining table and taking forever to eat.

The Dr said: Parents can and should determine only the Quality of food . Leave the Quantity to the child. He said, children and people in general (other than extremely poor) have forgotten the importance of "Hunger" symptoms. People are not able to discern when they are hungry, as they continue to eat to a cycle, often ending up eating more than necessary. He said, let the child stay without eating for a meal or two. He/she will automatically discover the importance of hunger, and then rationalise the food intake accordingly.
That was quite a revealing thought for me, as it applies to us adults as well.

[COMMUTER]

The main cause of this obesity pandemic is the crooked Ancel Key's food pyramid which is defended to death by the processed food and pharma mafia by fuelling false studies from crooked and infamous institutions. This had cleared the supply of sugar drug to all. The effects of insulin resistance on the cholesterol, blood pressure, diabetes and cancer are also being stifled to keep the customer base intact.

The myth that sugar is a calorie and fats are bad are all a wicked conspiracy.

We must stop eating sugar, hydrogenated fluids, poisonous refined flour, refined grains, too much carbohydrates and frequent antibiotics to stay clear of the mafia and avoid obesity.

Staying clear of obesity does not incur perpetual hunger. That hunger is the result of insulin resistance. We need to take carbs only if we do enormous work like ploughing or construction or walking from city to city.

Personally, I lost 20+kg by following these and avoided lifelong cholesterol medication narrowly

[Ultim8]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

The two sides of Poverty - one there is not enough to eat an another is obesity - the second category is mostly confined to United States. Its an exception indeed among many other quirks of USA.

Originally Posted by am1m

I remember reading that this is because in the US, it is actually cheaper to eat at a McDonalds or a KFC than it would be to cook at home. That, combined with the 'supersize' strategy to serving portions in those sorts of junk food places probably leads to this phenomenon.

At home here in India, I think it's still much cheaper to eat at home than it would be to eat at a fast food restaurant, even for a middle-class family.

An acclaimed documentary film called "Food, Inc." (a must watch for everyone except vegetarians who are sensitive about watching slaughtering of animals and meat-packing & processing) pretty much sums up the history of fast food restaurants and their influence on an average American's eating habits.

Kosfactor & am1m have summarized in their posts about what is happening in USA regarding food & obesity. This fast food phenomenon is spreading throughout the world, though not being as powerful there as compared to in United States.

In "Food, Inc.", the narrator mentions that humans are hardwired to these three taste inducing contents - salt, fat & sugar - latter being available 24/7 only since last few decades.

Also, energy drink brands like Red Bull, Mountain Dew, G-Fuel, etc. heavily promote drinking energy drinks even in eSports (Electronic-sports) tournaments, in which professional players compete against other pro players in teams, playing corresponding multi-player video games like Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, Valorant, Rainbow 6 Siege, etc.

The sad fact is that many of these professional players endorse & promote drinking these energy drinks themselves, in large quantities.

[PrasannaDhana]

Obesity, main reason is over consumption of calories over prolonged duration of time.

You can put the blame on stress, hormonal profile, lifestyle, genetics and so on. But the hard truth is you consume more than what you need.

3 square meals a day was a great way to promote capitalism, multi billion dollar food/beverage industry and then the pharma industry that indirectly gets benefitted from obesity in the long run.

And then we went from 3 square meals a day to 3 square meals a day + 2 snacks a day.

Average calorie consumption of an adult 30 year old male between the 1990s and 2020s will show us an easy 500 excess calories every day.

Easy availability of food/snacks, constant temptation through TV ads, social media ads, hoardings and what not, a sad culture of involving food with any get-together, and forgetting the difference between eating for hunger and eating for pleasure.

That's why we see 200% increase in the number of people who hit the gyms/outdoor walking and jogging spaces when compared to the last decade, yet obesity is on the rise. It is not that we are inactive/lazy (which a good portion of us are) , it's more about what we consume.

For an example, a serving of biriyani or a serving of tiffin at a hotel, is NOT a normal single serving for an individual. But we consume it thnking so, and we have made it an habit to consume the same excessive amounts of food every meal of every day.

I strongly believe schools should start teaching nutrition, atleast on what connection food has with insulin, on functions of insulin, and on what insulin resistance is.

Intermittent fasting should become mainstream. In my experience in losing/gaining fat/muscle over the decade, I haven't experienced a more powerful singular factor than intermittent fasting in losing weight and fighting the fat.

If anyone is fighting obesity, look at what goes into your mouth everyday. It's so simple that people love over-complicating it.

[RaviK]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

There is a big underlying problem here as well. In many societies around the world obesitas in more rampant in those with lower education and come from general lower parts of society...

Interesting observation, however there are many more variables in play if we look at obesity from a global perspective. Allow me to explain - when I moved to UK few years back (from India), the number of obese people was just impossible to ignore. Not that we Indians are super fit (as is evident from type 2 diabetes spread), but the overall ratio of fat folks there was just difficult to miss !!
Have observed the same here in Australia. Look at any female/male , the Thai/Chinese/Malaysian/indian/other Asian origin ones (mostly migrated in last 2 decades) would have a waistline much lesser than a typical Australian.
So while there are way more fitness freaks in caucasian populations compared to Asians, the overall ratio of obese folks is higher (despite more prosperity & education). So seems like there are other factors in play as well if looked from a global level)