[pjbiju]

Originally Posted by SLK

no.. why not just lay down tracks... .. the cars can then only be driven in line.. like trains!!

Thats such a sorry idea!

If I remember correctly what you have suggested was the solution for all Indian Metros by some Traffic Expert from one of the IITs - to make single lane roads without allowing anyone to overtake.

[theMAG]

The assumption that only commercial vehicles are largely responsible for all road accidents is, at best, debatable. While they do at the outset have a theoretical motive for driving fast, one musnt overlook the other major accident contributors:


1. Personal vehicles: Driven mainly by city folk in the city, primarily to work. They wouldnt have had any experience at highway driving and overlook this oft-overlooked fact - highway driving is a completely different ballgame to city driving and one that involves more specialized skill sets that are technically correct

2. Pedestrians/non-motorized traffic: What business do they have on a highway ?? This by far is the joint contributor to highway accidents - alongwith with the 1st type.

3. Poor infrastructure that borders on suicidal: The vehicle is absolved of all responsibility for any of its actions if a large ditch appears at the end of a blind fast corner


On the contrary, I've found long-distance trucks and govt. buses to be the safer vehicles to be around on a highway.

Private buses, non-goods trucks like sand trucks, call center transports etc need a speed limiter compulsorily however.

[SLK]

Originally Posted by pjbiju

If I remember correctly what you have suggested was the solution for all Indian Metros by some Traffic Expert from one of the IITs - to make single lane roads without allowing anyone to overtake.

IIT stock just crashed on my stock exchange!

automobiles are the most convenient mode of transport... and not just that ... its the most flexible too.

Here in India what we don't understand is ... that a problem has to be solved... by addressing the core issue... that is the root cause of the problem.

Shortcuts, workarounds, and way-outs is all we ever think of!....
think step by step...

Issue: Accidents... taking lives

is speed the problem?
is speed limit implementation the problem?
is safety norm the problem?
is no seat belt the problem?
is driver not being 12th pass a problem?

What is the problem after all?

its simply driver education... in terms of road sense and how to drive.
the drivers should be educated
.. in road safety...
.. road sense...
.. common sense...
.. how to drive at high speeds... (not just how to depress the accelerator)
.. etc.....

Thats the root cause... .. unaware/uneducated (not illiterate) public at large!

Thats the place where the work should start...

I can't say any more... you should think yourself!


But just as an example of Indian policy makers shortsightedness... remember the reservation issue!...

now there is a population explosion!... you ban people from having se*?

I don't know when will we learn that shortcut is not the way to longterm deep rooted success/ growth!

[pjbiju]

SLK you are absolutely right about the root cause of the problem of accidents - the driver and his lack of motoring sense, lack of skills, lack of respect for other occupants of the road (pedestrians, cycles, bikes, cars etc.). A badly maintained vehicle also reflects the driver's concern for self and others. Unfortunately this is also the toughest one to change.

Look at the way driving licenses are issued in our country. At most of the places, the driving tests are just an eye wash and it is better not to speak about the medical fitness certificates.

The solution that I have in my mind is to have a compounding fine system. But this would require that all traffic policemen have access to a central database system in real time. And like in the west, the insurance cost of the vehicle should depend on the record of the driver(s) of the vehicle. The more the number of violations, the greater the insurance amount should be.

All people, rich and poor alike, hate losing money. So the above solution will be a big deterrent.

I have also seen that drivers of trucks on highways are often very well behaved than most of the state or private bus drivers or for that matter even private car drivers. It may be because they spend a large amount of time on the highways. The only fault I have seen often among them is that they tend to drive on the rightmost lane (especially on 4-lane highways) – may be that is safer since you have pedestrians, cyclists etc. coming on to even highways at places that you least expect.

[harishsegar]

Speed limits doesnt make Indian roads safer...
Put all the strictest rules and along comes a moron driving a bullock cart on the wrong side of the highway.

Hey.. technically the guy is still within speed limits

I think what needs to improve is the common sense and discipline.

[caliper]

The problem w/ speed limiters set to the exact speed limit is that they can be dangerous since you don't have any leeway for overtaking and maneuvering out of unexpected situations.

You could probably set a limiter at the speed limit plus 20. But I think it should be for commercial vehicles only.

[CliffHanger]

Off late, every day I open the news paper in the morning I see details of gory accidents, with lives being lost in huge numbers.

Every day, while I walk on the road, I see young guys on bikes that are way too powerful than what I used to ride when I was younger. I used to be a decently good rider, but a lot of times I used to drive recklessly just for the heck of it and had a couple of close shaves too, what with no proper laws, license for money, and poor overall education system. I come to the present moment and imagine what will happen to these bikers when their age induced adrenaline instigates them to behave crazy in our chaotic roads.

Adrenaline rush + way too powerful bikes and cars for poor Indian roads + increasing traffic on Indian roads = is not disaster waiting to happen, but disasters happening in never been seen before numbers at the moment.

India is still a developing country, and having a speed zone in different areas in a city, where a youth can go and expend his adrenaline rush, is impossible at the moment.

Most Indians are still naive, and naivety can lead to stupidity a lot of times. I have spoken to people regarding how they deal with handling Tyres in their vehicles, almost everyone gave me an impression that they look at it just like the slippers they wear, for them it will just be there and take care of itself.

Driver 1:
Age: 30+

I have a friend who used to drive a BMW, just keeps filling air in his punctured tyre and keeps doing triple digit speeds, and he also likes to take pics of what top speeds his car can do. Believe me, he is an engineering graduate, comes from a family wealthy for several decades and is an expert in bushiness.

Now imagine, the number of such drivers on road, the condition of their tyres, and the car that can do 200 kmph. I have spoken to my friends about Handling and a lot of them look at me oddly when I utter the word handling. For them, a car is good if it is fast, and there is no question of discussing Handling with them, because for them the car will handle itself.

Driver 2:
Age: 40+

Now let's come to the sedate drivers, I know a neighbor who has been driving cars for very many years, his cars are usually pristine in condition. But I will be surprised if I don't see a dent on his car every ten days. The point is there are plenty of Indian drivers who no matter how many years they drive, they never get to develop road sense.

Driver 3:
Age: 30+

One of my other friends, who is in the US at the moment, a top ranked student in studies and a brilliant student overall. But, over the years having driven with him, I get scared to go on long drives with him, because all my friends agree his driving sense is at rock bottom. When on drives, if he starts discussing something with fellow passengers, he entirely loses focus on the road. He was involved in couple of nasty accidents as well.

Now imagine, Driver 1 + Driver 2 + Driver 3 + Uneducated senseless drivers + Educated senseless drives + Innumerable other naive drivers + Poor Indian roads + Ever increasing traffic, we can only be spectators to all the disasters that are happening every second.

Now, why speed limiter for every vehicle?

I think by now many would be nodding your heads on why it is necessary for every vehicle. Some may argue that fatal accidents can happen at low speeds too. But all the drivers I mentioned above have driven in highways at good speeds a lot of times and Statistics have continuously shown that the more the speed the more are the chances of fatality.

Also a speed limiter will act as a deterrent to speed, when you drive a vehicle knowing that you will never be able to speed, over the time you lose interest to speed and just stick to normal speeds.

When there are so many regulations for food products, I don't know why there isn't any for vehicles. Because as how a food product can kill people, a vehicle too can kill people, and right now it is killing people at an alarming rate.

Though I personally love to do a good triple speed on our highways in a safe way, for the better of my country and people, I would happily like to buy a vehicle fitted with a speed limiter. Because, my heart just bleeds to see so many happy lives ending abruptly every day.

I care two hoots for democracy in this regard, when people's lives are at risk at such magnitude, I believe rules have to be bent and strong enforcements have to be put in place.

Yes, many might say that this cannot be a solution for various reasons, and improving infrastructure, enforcing speed limits everywhere across the country, etc is how we should move ahead. But considering the current situation, our people, our roads, our infrastructure and lastly our government, I believe the only option to save plenty of lives from dying everyday is to have speed limiter for every vehicle in India, 80 kmph for every moving thing on roads.

If someone can prove that he is going to use the car only on speed zone(read: tracks), give him a waiver. Again, this can be a grey area and can be misused. But, have a tight policy as in giving a gun license.

When lives are being lost in droves, pleasure of even a considerable population, is the last think I will care for.

Unfortunately, the irony is how this law will be enforced if it indeed is implemented!

Now, to the Government.

[H_Dogg72]

Japan has the speed limiter policy.
India, with the commercial governors being cut will get backlash and won't be implemented.
Who do you expect to buy a turbo petrol car only to drive it at 80?
With the Germans you just don't feel the speed and you can't just go ahead redlining in the first two gears.

[DicKy]

Sorry, but 80km/h is too less. It should be somewhere around the 120km/h mark and preferably an audible warning by law instead of a speed limiter.

Still people who want to speed will find a way to remove the limiter, but I do think that a considerable number of drivers won't bother to speed if there is a limiter and would not bother to remove them too, even if they could. So it would be a good idea.

(Above reply was diplomatic, as a sub 30years petrolhead, I don't care if others are limited or not but want my car to have a high top speed, not that I speed a lot, but nevertheless 'good to know I have' feature. :P )

[alpha1]

A lawless place like India may require speed limiters built in the vehicle.
But a place where the police and courts work the way they are intended to be, we would not require any vehicular speed limiter.

Perhaps you are admitting subtly that the police and the courts can never improve in India. If so, then I can agree with your conclusion.

[roy_libran]

An excellent idea, ideally.

However-
1. I would, in rare circumstances, need the ability to outrun a nefarious pursuer. India, still is, largely a lawless country.
2. You might make a judgement error on highways, and may need that extra burst of speed to finish the overtake. Else, you might, either be in someone's farm, or inside someone's windshield.

Now, if you were to set a speed limit on the Limiter, that could, theoretically compensate in both the above situations, it would need to be set somewhere between the 120 - 140 kmph mark, and that itself would completely defeat the purpose of such a Limiter. Wouldn't it?

[VeluM]

Not a good idea. In all three cases it is the driver and not the vehicle that is at fault. The solution (long term and sustainable) is to build systems that ensure only good, qualified drivers get licenses. Then we need the police to enforce the laws a little better, but the first part will bring down the number of offenders considerably.

A qualification about educating drivers: They should know why they do something, and not just that "vehicles leaving the main road have right of way". The first will ensure that they know not allowing the vehicle to leave will cause jams in all different directions, while the second will just be mugged for the exam and forgotten later on.

[jkdas]

Let them give us good infra first for the amount of tax we pay. Do you think a biker doing 40-50kmph in safe these days; great if he has pillion.

Also, linking age to being 'wise' and hence safe is an old thing.

[Rahul Bhalgat]

Originally Posted by CliffHanger

Off late, every day I open the news paper in the morning I see details of gory accidents, with lives being lost in huge numbers.

After limiting the speed, there can still be accidents, for example, due to driving at 60-80 kmph on roads with heavy traffic, in a wrong direction. But yes, I endorse this suggestion, it will surely reduce the total number of lives lost due to over-speeding.

I think that a limit of 120 kmph will be more practical compared to that of 80 kmph.

Few more suggestions, if the car manufacturers do not agree to limit the speed:

1. To tell the car manufacturers to design the cars to result into expensive maintenance / breakdown, if driven at high speeds.

2. To maintain a record of speed in the car's ECU and to tell the car manufacturers to charge extra for maintenance depending upon the number of over-speeding incidents and extent of over-speed. Or, authorize the Police to access this data and charge penalty depending upon the number of over-speeding incidents and extent of over-speed. The police shall be given devices to access this easily.

[batterylow]

So the question arises, what is a reasonable speed to set as the limit.

80 kmph sounds like a fair number.

So does an accident at 80 kmph not cause any loss of life?
Control has to be intrinsic, that's the only way it will work.
Education of society regarding road safety is the way to go.
Let us not become a society like 1984 ( The novel).