[.sushilkumar]

Originally Posted by Hayek

What a low life scum Putin is!! This is definitively the end of the 30 year cycle that started with the fall of the Berlin Wall - despite what Francis Fukuyama said, History does not end - it comes back and bites you.

Rhetoric aside, Putin is doing best when it comes to Russian interests. Nobody asked Ukraine to tango with US & NATO. Still, they did & are paying the price. He gave enough warnings for peaceful co-existence but the puppet in Ukraine choose to look other way. Where is US & NATO now. Only Ukraine suffered in this whole Saga.

Moreover, i believe he just avoided a situation that we have in our west since last 70 Years.

[deetee]

Originally Posted by warrioraks

Earlier only US could do it openly (Iraq, Afghanistan). Now Russia has initiated it. Next could be China

There is big difference between what happened in Iraq/Afghan and Ukraine. US didn't try to change the geographical borders of both those countries. Whereas Russia , here, is trying to annex Ukraine. The later must not be encouraged on any grounds. Tommorrow, imagine China marching into Arunachal Pradesh or Pakistan invading Jammu & Kashmir!

However, the seemingly dumb inaction of US and NATO is also welcome in that, this clash has been bilateral so far. If NATO or US goes hands on, we may be staring at another World War.

Situation of India is like cat on a wall between two clashing sides. Whichever side it jumps in, the other side will surely take a bitter notice of it. If it stays on the wall, still it can get caught in cross fire sooner or later.

[Sebring]

Exactly! US is no longer the force it used to be. Just because they have McDonalds/Pepsi and the Dollars to invest, people favour them. We should have kept China closer. The benefits are enormous

Originally Posted by .sushilkumar

Rhetoric aside, Putin is doing best when it comes to Russian interests. Nobody asked Ukraine to tango with US & NATO. Still, they did & are paying the price. He gave enough warnings for peaceful co-existence but the puppet in Ukraine choose to look other way. Where is US & NATO now. Only Ukraine suffered in this whole Saga. Moreover, i believe he just avoided a situation that we have in our west since last 70 Years.

[AltoLXI]

Originally Posted by .sushilkumar

Where is US & NATO now. Only Ukraine suffered in this whole Saga.

Precisely. Apart from "imposing" some useless sanctions, and holding meeting after meeting, the West will do nothing. It is heads I win, tails you lose for US and EU.

Originally Posted by Sebring

Exactly! US is no longer the force it used to be. Just because they have McDonalds/Pepsi and the Dollars to invest, people favour them. We should have kept China closer. The benefits are enormous

Our Western neighbor is more pragmatic that way.

[PreludeSH]

Gone are the days of World Wars I and II when countries participated in wars and gave their lives fighting in other countries.
Other than helping Ukraine with weapons, I dont think even NATO will participate in a war directly.
That is what is creating this asymmetry. A dictator out of his mind is the only guy prepared to lose lives of his soldiers.

Its for Ukraine to choose whoever they want to be with. Cant understand if anyone outside of Russia will sympathize with a guy wanting to create the previous soviet union.

[TROOPER]

I find it hilarious when people label Putin various names.

As if any other American President is any different. They get away with it because they are elected to power in a "democracy".

People talk about communist propaganda. What about the propaganda you constantly get to see in US movies, tv shows and cartoons against Russia? You feed citizens with shit since a young age and expect people and nations to love and respect each other?

I am not taking sides. But seriously. The west has gotten away with doing way too much destruction in the past hundred years. If you label Putin, also have the courage to call out leaders from the west.

Imagine having Chinese missiles stationed in Bhutan, Nepal, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Sri Lanka. Pointing towards us. Did the US really need to go and try humiliate a country like Russia? They were so arrogant to at least temporarily say that they would not give Ukraine NATO membership. But no, they had to let another country bear the brunt of their arrogance. End result, innocent people suffer. As usual. Now soon we'll have the Chinese joining the party.

As far as India's stance, let's just be neutral, and selfish. No one comes to our aid when we are in trouble.

[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by tazmaan

I hope India will not become Ukraine for China where we will have to choose to either align with China and stay away from the west or face war.
.

I dont think you know India or Ukraine very well. Is there even a comparison ?

[.sushilkumar]

Originally Posted by TROOPER

As far as India's stance, let's just be neutral, and selfish. No one comes to our aid when we are in trouble.

Golden words IMO & thankfully current dispensation have stayed true to this. At the start of war in morning, Hon PM was busy tweeting about schemes for benefit of "farmers".

Same time FM have done the fine job of treading the neutral line. IMO, we are not dependent on anyone for anything at the moment. We are hedged beautifully on all sides with no need to take any sides.

[arbardhan]

Originally Posted by arbardhan

China will push aggressively Yuan and Russia may accept some payments in Yuan / Digital Yuan etc.

Chinese financial institutions in action. https://www.ft.com/content/55d86391-...c-83a7878b8942

[deetee]

Imran Khan landed in Russia to a warm welcome and he says: "What a time I have come, so much excitement".

https://twitter.com/i/status/1496549375518343169

I am guessing China is brokering this visit. Russia getting cozy with Pakistan and China is warning bell to India to reconsider its foreign relations.

[srini1785]

For those who thought that Russia would agree to a diplomatic solution:

"You can't make omelette without breaking a few eggs" - Joseph Stalin

[ValarMorghulis]

The lessons from this aggression is only: You are only responsible for your own security.

Other developed economies might consider having a nuclear backup option now (viz. Japan, China, South Korea, etc.)

Also, compared to the US, Russia has been a much lesser of the two evils. US bombing of Libya helped establish the ISIS menace, so they are no one to give sermons on aggression (not to count their invasion of numerous other countries).

[sierrabravo98]

Originally Posted by TROOPER

Imagine having Chinese missiles stationed in Bhutan, Nepal, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Sri Lanka. Pointing towards us.

This is exactly what every Indian needs to remember in order to understand and rationalise Putin's response. This asinine argument of "muh democracy", "peace", "Putin-most evil dictator ever born", "rules based world order" should not even cross the mind of any self-respecting Indian when we ourselves could be facing the same situation in the coming decade(having to invade a neighbour for the purpose of pre-emptive defense). As it is, sightings of Chinese submarines in the IOR gets the undergarments of the whole Indian strategic community in a twist. Now think about the scale of threat which Russia has been facing for the last 15 years at the least.

I only wish any of our Indian leaders could dare to do then what Putin is doing right now. By some accounts (I would not like to list them out as it will turn my post more political than it already is), Putin has been preparing for this from a long long time (think 10+ years). He has his house in order for what he has planned. Do you guys really think that the Kremlin has not war-gamed (and I mean using mathematical models on super-computers) every possible move that the US/NATO might take? Putin is prepared.

USA has over-played its hand very badly. Now all of us will have to bear the consequences of their arrogance while 2 vast oceans keep the American mainland safe and secure.

Originally Posted by deetee

Imran Khan landed in Russia to a warm welcome and he says: "What a time I have come, so much excitement".

https://twitter.com/i/status/1496549375518343169

I am guessing China is brokering this visit. Russia getting cozy with Pakistan and China is warning bell to India to reconsider its foreign relations.

Putin is nobody's fool. He is just sending a signal to South Block as to what may happen if India acts in direct violation of Russian interests. Fellow Bhpians, do keep in mind that our entire "second-strike" capability, almost entire armour capability and more is basically Russian. They have a very deep knowledge of what and how we may respond with strategic weapons. On the other hand, most of our heavy- lift capabilities (C-17/CH-47 etc.), the engine for the LCA, our maritime eyes (P8I) are American. Very precarious position to be in indeed.

[vinu_h]

US fired the 1st bullet in 2014. Russia waited patiently for the problem to go away and is only reacting now. We all know the details, it's in the public domain. If this in fact was Russia's doing, then, military response(proxy one at the least) instead of sanctions would have happened and the resistance would have come from US & EU instead of just the US.

This article makes for a good read.

[thanixravindran]

Originally Posted by TROOPER

I find it hilarious when people label Putin various names.

I am not taking sides. But seriously. The west has gotten away with doing way too much destruction in the past hundred years. If you label Putin, also have the courage to call out leaders from the west.

Imagine having Chinese missiles stationed in Bhutan, Nepal, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Sri Lanka. Pointing towards us. Did the US really need to go and try humiliate a country like Russia? They were so arrogant to at least temporarily say that they would not give Ukraine NATO membership. But no, they had to let another country bear the brunt of their arrogance. End result, innocent people suffer. As usual. Now soon we'll have the Chinese joining the party.

True. US will not stop with Ukraine. Already they engineered 'protests' in Belarus during the Pandemic contesting election results. Keen watchers of international events won't forget the sudden 'Fuel' protests happened in Kazakhstan recently which needed Russia to send troops to calm down. Remember both of them are staunch Russia allies and have their top leader in power since the fall of USSR like Putin.

So you can connect the dots who is next. This will complete the encirclement of Russia in the next decade. So I believe this would have played on their minds and took decisive action. In fact, Americans are the proponent of 'Domino theory' during the peak of Cold war that once an Asian nation falls to communism others will follow suit unless a counter balance is provided. They did with Afghanistan in 80's and now the same is repeated for them.