Save The Tiger

pramodkumar · 9th February 2010, 14:53

The census featured here is incorrect, there are not even 1000 tigers in the wild as of today. The technique we indians use to count the number of tigers in the wild is dated and not fool proof. While the entire bandhavgarh was wiped out off tigers the forest department was still reporting healthy tiger population.

This campaign will die out as soon after the sponcers get the required millage out of it.

The Indian Tigers main enemy is not china, it is Tibet. With porous broders the trafficing of tiger parts is even more easier. Take a look at their hedious costumes, those are thousands of tigers killed.

The biggest kingpin 'sansar chand' who has been caught several times with tiger and lepord skins, still lives a healthy life in tihar jail after numerous times of getting caught and let out free on bail.

The biggest problem in conservation is relocating the villagers from these parks, for every cattle/ human killed by the tigers these villagers used to get compensation and by the speed with which help arrives, the villagers have understood poaching is a more profitable bussiness which ensures security and timly payments, not to mention the various cuts the amount used to suffer from govt to the benificiary. With ageing and demotivated guards with medival artifacts they call wepons, protecting themselves from poachers is a daunting task how can they ven think of protecting the elusive animal.

This is a huge cause and trust me i do not think aircell will do anything more than what project tiger did, which inspite of being completely govt sponcered still failed. I feel this is another desperate brand building initiative after sevral failed attempts, and since its been proved these days that every add speaks about a cause so why not jump into the bandwagon?

The only way i fell this cause can be taken forward is by strong governance and strict laws. This is what the govt should do:

Each tiger should be radio tagged atleast till their numbers stabilize, and their movements tracked using hitec equipments, any tiger not seen moving for a particular amount to time should trigger an alarm.
The villagers should be relocated out of the reserve forests and not allowed to enter even for performing anual pujas
Guards should be equiped with most modern equipmets including arms and night vision gears.
Strict and zero tolerance laws to be brought against poaching of any kind, with consecutive life terms as punishments and should be non bailable.
The borders needs to be more strictly monitered and no cross border trafficing of animal products allowed
Put international pressure first on tibet to change their outrageous outfit and then on china to invent better medicine, if they cant invent ask them to copy some medicines in which they are extreamly good.
Improve captive breading programs with qualified practitioners, we need real doctors not mad scienteists who create circus freaks like the liger and tigon and find their way into the record books.
Finally make study about tigers par of our school education so that our children know their real value and they ensure their children get to see the tiger as well.

I hope Aircell is successful in atleast waking up some people high above so that they seriously start doing something, especially after a grant was rejected from world bank for tiger conservation.

Pramod

Atul-C · 9th February 2010, 15:13

Why would you think this campaign would die when the sponcers has backed out? Why cant a normal man keep it running? The normal man is awake now and required to carry it on.

At least I will not sit back. I will make sure that I regulary visit the Tiger reserves and meet their higher officer every time I am there and ask for the report under the law. I am sure if every one follow this kind of activity, these people will also do their work.

How many time have we asked the official when we failed to sight the tiger during the safaris in tiger reserves that why we did not sight the tiger? I am sure most of have said to ourselve, yaar, our bad luck. We could not spot the tiger. Have you thought of asking the official if really there is any tiger alive. I am sure if everyone starts asking these question and inform them that this issue will be brought to press and higher official, it will make change.

Start asking question and make sure to get the answer. That is how we can change the way this country is being run.

You dont see the people following the traffic rule. Instead of breaking the rule yourself, just go to the constable at the junction and ask him the question. Most probably he will not reply or shoo you away. But how many times? to how many people. If everyone starts asking question, they will be forced to do their work.

Wolfheart · 9th February 2010, 15:49

If Aircel really cared then they would have sponsored these billboards in China. The demand for tiger skin, tiger bones, tiger penis and almost every body part stems from China. We should be asking our Ministry of external Affairs to put pressure on China. Someone earlier mentioned that a Kingpin poacher is out on bail after several convictions. Why don't we invoke the RTI, file a PIL or whatever legal avenues we have as Indian citizens to keep people like these in jail. Why don't we lobby for strict punishment for poaching, encroachment and deforestation. Why don't we ask the government to stop mining and other activities if they are damaging the forests? Why don't we as educated people actually figure out things that will help rather than play into the hands of opportunistic companies and waste efforts on pointless endeavors.

Atul-C · 9th February 2010, 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfheart

If Aircel really cared then they would have sponsored these billboards in China. The demand for tiger skin, tiger bones, tiger penis and almost every body part stems from China. We should be asking our Ministry of external Affairs to put pressure on China. Someone earlier mentioned that a Kingpin poacher is out on bail after several convictions. Why don't we invoke the RTI, file a PIL or whatever legal avenues we have as Indian citizens to keep people like these in jail. Why don't we lobby for strict punishment for poaching, encroachment and deforestation. Why don't we ask the government to stop mining and other activities if they are damaging the forests? Why don't we as educated people actually figure out things that will help rather than play into the hands of opportunistic companies and waste efforts on pointless endeavors.

Do you think anyone can go to China and sport a billboard there without their government's permission? Come on. Grow Up a little. I am seeing you every time coming on this thread and speaking negative about it.

You should at least be happy that a company is trying to something though they have monetary benefit. Can you deny that the awareness spread in the last two weeks is awesome. If not then you have not read my comment at the top where people are gathering in Delhi, Mumbai and Pune on 14th Feb in support of this. That too without Aircel being involved. People have come together themselve to support this. You want link to that. Ask me and I will give you that.

Let me ask you this

Why don't YOU invoke the RTI, file a PIL or whatever legal avenues we have as Indian citizens to keep people like these in jail. Why don't YOU lobby for strict punishment for poaching, encroachment and deforestation. Why don't YOU ask the government to stop mining and other activities if they are damaging the forests? Why don't YOU as educated people actually figure out things that will help rather than play into the hands of opportunistic companies and waste efforts on pointless endeavors.

pramodkumar · 9th February 2010, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Why would you think this campaign would die when the sponcers has backed out? Why cant a normal man keep it running? The normal man is awake now and required to carry it on. .

I like your sprit and i hope it stays that way, my best wishes for you endevor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

At least I will not sit back. I will make sure that I regulary visit the Tiger reserves and meet their higher officer every time I am there and ask for the report under the law. I am sure if every one follow this kind of activity, these people will also do their work..

This will not work, there are too many loopholes, once an eminant environmentalist pointed out the flaws in the system and pointed out that there are no tigers left in bandhavgarh, he was asked not to return to the reserve and his equipment was sized. It was after a highlevel interventions from channels like discovery and Nat geo, people startred to listen to him. This whole incedence happened during the last UPA regime and trust me there was a lot of hue and cry in the parliment. The PMO was directly involved in this case and the only thing that they did is they got tigers from ranthambore and reintroduced them in bandhavgarh and panna. Now as per forest officials their numbers are stable, which still is a pile of horse crap as per me. I hope you got the message, however there has to be someone who has to stand and i wish you a very best of luck for being the change you wnat to see.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

How many time have we asked the official when we failed to sight the tiger during the safaris in tiger reserves that why we did not sight the tiger? I am sure most of have said to ourselve, yaar, our bad luck. We could not spot the tiger. Have you thought of asking the official if really there is any tiger alive. I am sure if everyone starts asking these question and inform them that this issue will be brought to press and higher official, it will make change
Start asking question and make sure to get the answer. That is how we can change the way this country is being run..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

You dont see the people following the traffic rule. Instead of breaking the rule yourself, just go to the constable at the junction and ask him the question. Most probably he will not reply or shoo you away. But how many times? to how many people. If everyone starts asking question, they will be forced to do their work.

I am still not joining this campaign becasue this is purly for business interest and has nothing to do with tigers, at least till the time they have something substansial to show. Till then collecting phone numbers and other stuff is purly to take sensus and to do a case study of what phone providers educated people with openion use and what all services do they offer. You have made a point that indians have a habbit of jumping into conclusion before going through something, if you yourself start stereotyping people based on what you feel, tell me how can you change things when you your self are convinced about the fact that the people around you are skeptical/cynical.

You are probably not getting the point, look at the way advertising is done, there is idea add which has a "what an idea sir jee concept", there are others who pledge to eradicate illetracy, This fighiting for cause thing is the latest FAD and trust me once they get their required data these guys will windup and there will be a bunch of volunteers who would be left without a sponcer and soon it will all die, i am not being cynical here, if i can think of and 8 point one size fit all solution then i am sure the govt must have as well, there are priorities and my dear friend we all are still worried about the propossed 4 rupee rise in fuel price and not in the deminishing number of tigers. I am going to keep an eye on this thread to observe and appriciate your succes during each stage of your conservation effort and i wish you all the best.

Pramod

Atul-C · 9th February 2010, 16:19

There are two meets that are going to happen in Delhi and Mumbai. That is without the aircel's participation. They are by people like me and you.

Delhi:
Type:
Causes - Rally
Network:
Global
Date:
Sunday, February 14, 2010
Time:
11:00am - 2:00pm
Location:
India Gate, New Delhi

Mumbai:
ype:
Causes - Rally
Network:
Global
Date:
Sunday, February 14, 2010
Time:
11:00am - 2:00pm
Location:
Gateway of India, Mumbai

Chennai:
13th at 11 am Barista Nungambakkam high road

Bangalore:
Feb 13th. Meeting place still being discussed.

I would not blame Aircel for their marketing if so many people come together to voice their concerns for this cause. That is all I can say.

Wolfheart · 9th February 2010, 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Do you think anyone can go to China and sport a billboard there without their government's permission? Come on. Grow Up a little. I am seeing you every time coming on this thread and speaking negative about it.

You should at least be happy that a company is trying to something though they have monetary benefit. Can you deny that the awareness spread in the last two weeks is awesome. If not then you have not read my comment at the top where people are gathering in Delhi, Mumbai and Pune on 14th Feb in support of this. That too without Aircel being involved. People have come together themselve to support this. You want link to that. Ask me and I will give you that.

Let me ask you this

Why don't YOU invoke the RTI, file a PIL or whatever legal avenues we have as Indian citizens to keep people like these in jail. Why don't YOU lobby for strict punishment for poaching, encroachment and deforestation. Why don't YOU ask the government to stop mining and other activities if they are damaging the forests? Why don't YOU as educated people actually figure out things that will help rather than play into the hands of opportunistic companies and waste efforts on pointless endeavors.

hello Atul-C

My posts are not aimed at you, and you have no reason to be offended. It seems that it's not me who needs growing up after all! I believe that I can come to this thread as many times as I want and give my opinion as many times as you can profess your undying love and support for Aircel.

I assumed that you started this thread for finding solutions for the problem at hand and not for petty arguements and bickering. In fact your post is a perfect example of what people actually do on these campaigns and blogs.

Yes I and thousands of people have been aware of this situation before your favorite cell phone company was even formed. All of these people have been working in our own little ways to contribute towards conservation and will continue to do so.

And no you're not going to convince me to enrol nor ask me to be happy about what Aircel is doing.Because I see the campaign for what it really is - a gimmick! And the timing for the campaign is also perfect because from march onwards, people will be able to change providers without changing their mobile numbers. I don't want to enrol and add to my woes, I'm getting enough unsolicited e-mails and telemarketing calls already. If you believe that going to websites, signing petitions and attending meets wearing Aircel T-shirts is going to be more effective then be my guest.

Now that we have things clear, let me tell you I am not going to reply to posts that are unproductive and get into pointless arguements. If it's conservation that you want to discuss, I'm all ears.

Wolfheart · 9th February 2010, 18:53

@ Pramod,

Isn't that photo from Ladakh? I've seen a similar ceremony on TV where the priests bring out and wear tiger skins for their annual festival. It happens at Hemis if I'm not mistaken. It seems that some conservationists have appealed to the Dalai Lama and there were some positive statements made by him as well.

Atul-C · 9th February 2010, 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfheart

hello Atul-C

My posts are not aimed at you, and you have no reason to be offended. It seems that it's not me who needs growing up after all! I believe that I can come to this thread as many times as I want and give my opinion as many times as you can profess your undying love and support for Aircel.

Now that we have things clear, let me tell you I am not going to reply to posts that are unproductive and get into pointless arguements. If it's conservation that you want to discuss, I'm all ears.

@Wolfhart, I am not offended. The other thing I dont care who sponcers this campaign. Even if it wasnt aircel still I would have done the same thing. I have made that clear in my first post itself. You abuse aircel or whatever, I am least bothered. I just hurt to see that your comments only brought that the aircel was the sponcer so it is all hoax. Also your suggession to put billboard in china' looked like a fun made at what I am trying to accomplish here. I am just trying to make people aware of the issue. You failed to see the silver lining in that. Many many people are made aware of this issue even if it is a marketing ploy. Do you think so many people knew it beforehand when this campaign started. Tigers were still being hunted and the next day, we had a two line news in the newspapers. I agree I have undying love and support but not for aircel, but for the tiger. Which is in this situation because of a comman man's apathy. We still care about rising price of rice but not for losing our heritage. Its a shame.

I am not going to ask you that what have you done on this or similar issues. This is the answer we need to give to ourselves.

Jayabusa · 9th February 2010, 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by phamilyman

That how can ANYONE honestly ever tell you my friend?

Their credentials and work impact is however impeccable. Rest is all good faith, no?

You can get that information in their annual reports buddy.

Atul-C · 9th February 2010, 21:01

Leave aside the Tigers for a while.

1. How many of us try to not to waste paper. I have seen people using more than one paper towel to wipe their hands in men's restroom in my company whereas one is more than enough for properly washed hands. How many of us try to unfold that paper before start wiping our hands? If unfolded, it is more than enough to use only one paper. If we try no to waste the paper, it is a very good thing, but have we asked others to not to waste the paper too? That's where spreading awareness comes. You are not saving money for the company. You are saving trees from being cut down.

2. How many of us switch off the car engines at the signal where the waiting time is as low as one minute? I bet most of us do not want to hear honking behind us when the signal turns green and we fail to start moving for a few seconds.

3. How many of us try to avoid using plastic bags while shopping? I bet this number will be scaringly low. How many of want to be bothered with the inconvenience of not carrying the stuff in the plastic bags.

Are we waiting for a Mobile company to remind us of these things? Then again we will write them off as a publicity gimmick. But did we do anything from our side before they started talking about it? If yes, then it is great but did we try to spread the awareness? This answer will be a big no and thats where we should give them marks for spreading awareness. Who is forcing you to change your mobile connection. Take the better part of it, scrap of the rest. Get the message, scrap the publicity of the brand. this planet a better place to live, we will have to start from our home.

pramodkumar · 10th February 2010, 10:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfheart

hello Atul-C

My posts are not aimed at you, and you have no reason to be offended. It seems that it's not me who needs growing up after all! I believe that I can come to this thread as many times as I want and give my opinion as many times as you can profess your undying love and support for Aircel.

I assumed that you started this thread for finding solutions for the problem at hand and not for petty arguements and bickering. In fact your post is a perfect example of what people actually do on these campaigns and blogs.

Yes I and thousands of people have been aware of this situation before your favorite cell phone company was even formed. All of these people have been working in our own little ways to contribute towards conservation and will continue to do so.

And no you're not going to convince me to enrol nor ask me to be happy about what Aircel is doing.Because I see the campaign for what it really is - a gimmick! And the timing for the campaign is also perfect because from march onwards, people will be able to change providers without changing their mobile numbers. I don't want to enrol and add to my woes, I'm getting enough unsolicited e-mails and telemarketing calls already. If you believe that going to websites, signing petitions and attending meets wearing Aircel T-shirts is going to be more effective then be my guest.

Now that we have things clear, let me tell you I am not going to reply to posts that are unproductive and get into pointless arguements. If it's conservation that you want to discuss, I'm all ears.

I tend to agree with you here, it wont be long when you will see them offering a % of your bill for tiger conservation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfheart

@ Pramod,

Isn't that photo from Ladakh? I've seen a similar ceremony on TV where the priests bring out and wear tiger skins for their annual festival. It happens at Hemis if I'm not mistaken. It seems that some conservationists have appealed to the Dalai Lama and there were some positive statements made by him as well.

Thats Tibet and its their annual festivel where they wear such outrageous costumes, shame on them its such stupid cultures which risk things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Leave aside the Tigers for a while.

1. How many of us try to not to waste paper. I have seen people using more than one paper towel to wipe their hands in men's restroom in my company whereas one is more than enough for properly washed hands. How many of us try to unfold that paper before start wiping our hands? If unfolded, it is more than enough to use only one paper. If we try no to waste the paper, it is a very good thing, but have we asked others to not to waste the paper too? That's where spreading awareness comes. You are not saving money for the company. You are saving trees from being cut down..

What about wasting water? do you consider using a wet tissue to wipe your face than washing it?

There are many thing for which we donot have a substitute, say for example water, it cannot be replaced with anything, same goes for plastic bags. The replacements are very expensive and the kerala govt has taken necessary precautions now. All the plastic bags are of recomended thickness and each of them have a seal on them to provide the address of the vendor who sold them,
most of the paper we all use is in offices are recycled and in india atleast there is no deforestation for making paper, these paper making treas are grown and then cut to make paper, they are grown again and this cycle continues. Forrests are no longer distroyed to make paper but to build our appartments and offices to have a nice view.Its just to get the required millage these issues are presented in an extreamly dramatic manner, Have you heard of the himalayan glacier screwup? This is your and my hard earned money paid as tax which got wasted and now became an international joke.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

2. How many of us switch off the car engines at the signal where the waiting time is as low as one minute? I bet most of us do not want to hear honking behind us when the signal turns green and we fail to start moving for a few seconds..

Do you know every time you switch off your car and switch it back on it runs rich initially? so if its equal to a <=1 min then its better to keep the engine running, this way you would save more fuel. But if you go by that add where in the kid says he will become a cycle mechanic(i hope you have seen it) because his dad is idling his car at a signal you should rather walk for short distances.
I can walk to office its just 2kms but i still drive down. there are two bhpians who take the same road as i do and still we all come in our individual cars does that mean we are all bad people?

Why do you have cars when there is already a good mode of public transport in your city?

The answer is "convenience"

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

3. How many of us try to avoid using plastic bags while shopping? I bet this number will be scaringly low. How many of want to be bothered with the inconvenience of not carrying the stuff in the plastic bags.

Are we waiting for a Mobile company to remind us of these things? Then again we will write them off as a publicity gimmick. But did we do anything from our side before they started talking about it? If yes, then it is great but did we try to spread the awareness? This answer will be a big no and thats where we should give them marks for spreading awareness. Who is forcing you to change your mobile connection. Take the better part of it, scrap of the rest. Get the message, scrap the publicity of the brand. this planet a better place to live, we will have to start from our home.

Look atul, we all try doing things which makes us feel that we are doing our bit. I never take the lift in my office, its just one floor but i see a lot of people doing it. I also never used to take the lift while going down when my office was 5 floors up.

Trust me you will see more resistance from people when you are out for a noble cause like this one, your aim should not be to attack those like you did to wolfheart insted you should get more people in, One disclaimer in the fist post that you have no association with aircel dosent mean that you are not promoting your favoirite mobile company. Trust me joining a group of people and lighting candles at gate way of india and india gate will mean nothing for the tiger. If you seriously want to be the change, quit your job grab a cam and show the world what are the bottle necks in this conservation project. By joining a marketing campaign you are not doing your bit, just think of the amount of garbage caused by such a public gathering not to mention the carbon emissions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

we should give them marks for spreading awareness.

Were you not aware before 5 years where there was a project tiger campaign and there were adds featuring Amir khan sitting on top of a hill on a canoo waiting for floods? He said if all the tigers are killed the forests will die and there will be no way of stopping a flood.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Are we waiting for a Mobile company to remind us of these things? .

It took the same for you as well. Lets get real and trust me Darvin has always ment it when he said "survival of the fittest", that means nature has a way of eliminating all the unfit models. I will stand against poaching but if the tigers go extinct because of natural issues i would say its nature plaing the elimination game.

Pramod

Atul-C · 10th February 2010, 13:29

@pramodkumar

No offence to you. There are two kind of people in this world. Half empty glass type and Half full glass type. I consider myself the later.

When I am supporting this campaign, I am looking at the silverlining of people becoming aware. I am not looking at which company is getting rich or who is getting benefitted. I cannot change the view someone looks at the half glass full of water.

I know there were very few people with the information that tiger population was drastically decreasing. Now there are more people who know that. I did not start this thread to convince people to go and join that website. It is there own call. I started this thread to spread the awareness. It does not mean that everyone has to agree with me. Again you can wake only those people who are really sleeping. Not the ones who are pretending to sleep. Now if someone really wakes up, I consider that what I wanted to do here is accomplished. If someone still choose to sleep, it is not my loss. This earth is as much theirs as it is mine. I am doing my part to spread the awareness.

The answers you made to my points. I am not going to answer them as it is upto you to analyze that how many people even do what you do to save this earth. We all have cars does not mean that we dont care about the environment, but how many people try to do something good about this planet when they have a chance.

Anyways it looks like that this is a wrong place where I am putting energy and my time. I should be doing this at a place where people are ready to accept the fact that as humans we have screwed this planet and still not ready to learn from our mistake.

My experience with this community had been very good till I was talking about cars. But talking about a good cause like climate and conservation, see what happens. Now it is upto this community members to decide that this projects this community into what kind of picture.

Peace.

pramodkumar · 10th February 2010, 14:15

Atul you are actually taking this whole thing too much personally. If you feel that the tiger will be saved by joining a website you are wrong. personally its much more difficult that you actually think it is. You will always have to face people like me who will be skeptical about the whole idea, Your approach should not be to offend them by saying things like

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Do you think anyone can go to China and sport a billboard there without their government's permission? Come on. Grow Up a little. I am seeing you every time coming on this thread and speaking negative about it..

I might be sounding like the devils advocate here, but trust me there are many comments which you need to ignore. The biggest success in your campaign would happen when all these people speaking negetive would convert in to speaking possitive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

There are two kind of people in this world. Half empty glass type and Half full glass type. I consider myself the later.

Why do you always get deffensive when people talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

I cannot change the view someone looks at the half glass full of water..

and why do you attack people without even knowing them?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Again you can wake only those people who are really sleeping. Not the ones who are pretending to sleep..

For the records i am too into conservation and i dont go lighiting candles at public places, i rather prefer acting, for your refrence

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ex...ml#post1692609

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

Anyways it looks like that this is a wrong place where I am putting energy and my time. I should be doing this at a place where people are ready to accept the fact that as humans we have screwed this planet and still not ready to learn from our mistake. .

The nature designed the plannet in such a way that weaker beings are eliminated and only stronger ones survive, biggest examples are crocodiles and cocroaches, The planet is not getting screwed the way everyone depicts. Global warming itself is the biggest scam while we all know the planet is getting colder, i aim is not to spark a debate and sound like a jerk by going off topic. my point is why do we need such a campaign when

1. Govt already knows and have put huge amount in place for conservation
2. There is enough awareness already created by discovery and Nat geo
3. As wolfheart mentioned govts new rule about same number different providers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atul-C

My experience with this community had been very good till I was talking about cars. But talking about a good cause like climate and conservation, see what happens. Now it is upto this community members to decide that this projects this community into what kind of picture.

This is a automotive forum

, Jokes apart best of luck with your project.

Pramod

Spitfire · 10th February 2010, 14:40

Atul-C not to take anything away from you and your mission. Keep at it. If nothing else atleast you tried. Thats a massive feeling in itself. But more importantly learn why such things dont go too far. You are going to be disappointed for sure but dont let it make you sit back or give up.

Now coming back to the topic. One colleague came upto me and asked to join when this whole thing started. He is a volunteer in the group that goes tiger spotting in the forests in Karnataka.

I said ok. He pointed me to a facebook group. I said ok, will follow.

They called a meeting. Everyone went. Some missed it. I didnt go. Why? It was to be held in Forum Mall.

First thing: Wrong focus group. Discuss something that I am going to give my substantial time to in a Mall?

Second: What are we presenting and what is the homework each one has to come with?
Answer given: Your own ideas on how to preserve Tigers.

Me: I dont know jack about Tigers. What do I actually prepare? All I could say was catch all of them and put them in a high security jungle and let them make merry.

My friend: Keep quite at the meeting.

Me:ok.

Third: What sort of people are coming for the meet.
Answer: Normal, simple people. IT/ITES folks, doctors, engineers etc.

Me: So they are like me. They will be as clueless as I am.

My friend: You never know. Someone might come up with some great ideas.

Me: ok.

So the usual mail and phone number sharing started. I was not convinced. I didnt go.

From what i read later on the group site. They met, branstormed in the Mall. Then brainstormed in some office. Then went to Aircell but was closed - obviously, it was a Sunday. Then i guess they went to some newspaper folks who made them do the runabout mentioning some obscure jungle reporter who is only found in the jungle and writes some column in a blue moon and to contact him. They had coffee shared numbers and left.

A few action items were listed but those were more of first learnng conservation rather then actually doing something.

I will later tell you how if you need to - work towards wildlife conservation. This is based upon talking to a person who is into wildlife conservation for 50 years. I had interacted with him after his expose on how some villagers in Goa killed a tiger with a trap layed for wild boar and how the following political cover up started. He was instrumental in getting it onto the headlines and now the people who killed the tiger are in jail.

9th February 2010, 14:53	#61
pramodkumar Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Gods own country Posts: 2,302 Thanked: 2,208 Times View My Garage	The census featured here is incorrect, there are not even 1000 tigers in the wild as of today. The technique we indians use to count the number of tigers in the wild is dated and not fool proof. While the entire bandhavgarh was wiped out off tigers the forest department was still reporting healthy tiger population. This campaign will die out as soon after the sponcers get the required millage out of it. The Indian Tigers main enemy is not china, it is Tibet. With porous broders the trafficing of tiger parts is even more easier. Take a look at their hedious costumes, those are thousands of tigers killed. The biggest kingpin 'sansar chand' who has been caught several times with tiger and lepord skins, still lives a healthy life in tihar jail after numerous times of getting caught and let out free on bail. The biggest problem in conservation is relocating the villagers from these parks, for every cattle/ human killed by the tigers these villagers used to get compensation and by the speed with which help arrives, the villagers have understood poaching is a more profitable bussiness which ensures security and timly payments, not to mention the various cuts the amount used to suffer from govt to the benificiary. With ageing and demotivated guards with medival artifacts they call wepons, protecting themselves from poachers is a daunting task how can they ven think of protecting the elusive animal. This is a huge cause and trust me i do not think aircell will do anything more than what project tiger did, which inspite of being completely govt sponcered still failed. I feel this is another desperate brand building initiative after sevral failed attempts, and since its been proved these days that every add speaks about a cause so why not jump into the bandwagon? The only way i fell this cause can be taken forward is by strong governance and strict laws. This is what the govt should do: Each tiger should be radio tagged atleast till their numbers stabilize, and their movements tracked using hitec equipments, any tiger not seen moving for a particular amount to time should trigger an alarm. The villagers should be relocated out of the reserve forests and not allowed to enter even for performing anual pujas Guards should be equiped with most modern equipmets including arms and night vision gears. Strict and zero tolerance laws to be brought against poaching of any kind, with consecutive life terms as punishments and should be non bailable. The borders needs to be more strictly monitered and no cross border trafficing of animal products allowed Put international pressure first on tibet to change their outrageous outfit and then on china to invent better medicine, if they cant invent ask them to copy some medicines in which they are extreamly good. Improve captive breading programs with qualified practitioners, we need real doctors not mad scienteists who create circus freaks like the liger and tigon and find their way into the record books. Finally make study about tigers par of our school education so that our children know their real value and they ensure their children get to see the tiger as well. I hope Aircell is successful in atleast waking up some people high above so that they seriously start doing something, especially after a grant was rejected from world bank for tiger conservation. Pramod
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9th February 2010, 15:13	#62
Atul-C BHPian Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 107 Thanked: 2 Times View My Garage	Why would you think this campaign would die when the sponcers has backed out? Why cant a normal man keep it running? The normal man is awake now and required to carry it on. At least I will not sit back. I will make sure that I regulary visit the Tiger reserves and meet their higher officer every time I am there and ask for the report under the law. I am sure if every one follow this kind of activity, these people will also do their work. How many time have we asked the official when we failed to sight the tiger during the safaris in tiger reserves that why we did not sight the tiger? I am sure most of have said to ourselve, yaar, our bad luck. We could not spot the tiger. Have you thought of asking the official if really there is any tiger alive. I am sure if everyone starts asking these question and inform them that this issue will be brought to press and higher official, it will make change. Start asking question and make sure to get the answer. That is how we can change the way this country is being run. You dont see the people following the traffic rule. Instead of breaking the rule yourself, just go to the constable at the junction and ask him the question. Most probably he will not reply or shoo you away. But how many times? to how many people. If everyone starts asking question, they will be forced to do their work.
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9th February 2010, 15:49	#63
Wolfheart BHPian Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bombay Posts: 160 Thanked: 28 Times	If Aircel really cared then they would have sponsored these billboards in China. The demand for tiger skin, tiger bones, tiger penis and almost every body part stems from China. We should be asking our Ministry of external Affairs to put pressure on China. Someone earlier mentioned that a Kingpin poacher is out on bail after several convictions. Why don't we invoke the RTI, file a PIL or whatever legal avenues we have as Indian citizens to keep people like these in jail. Why don't we lobby for strict punishment for poaching, encroachment and deforestation. Why don't we ask the government to stop mining and other activities if they are damaging the forests? Why don't we as educated people actually figure out things that will help rather than play into the hands of opportunistic companies and waste efforts on pointless endeavors.
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9th February 2010, 16:19	#66
Atul-C BHPian Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 107 Thanked: 2 Times View My Garage	There are two meets that are going to happen in Delhi and Mumbai. That is without the aircel's participation. They are by people like me and you. Delhi: Type: Causes - Rally Network: Global Date: Sunday, February 14, 2010 Time: 11:00am - 2:00pm Location: India Gate, New Delhi Mumbai: ype: Causes - Rally Network: Global Date: Sunday, February 14, 2010 Time: 11:00am - 2:00pm Location: Gateway of India, Mumbai Chennai: 13th at 11 am Barista Nungambakkam high road Bangalore: Feb 13th. Meeting place still being discussed. I would not blame Aircel for their marketing if so many people come together to voice their concerns for this cause. That is all I can say. Last edited by Atul-C : 9th February 2010 at 16:32.
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9th February 2010, 18:53	#68
Wolfheart BHPian Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bombay Posts: 160 Thanked: 28 Times	@ Pramod, Isn't that photo from Ladakh? I've seen a similar ceremony on TV where the priests bring out and wear tiger skins for their annual festival. It happens at Hemis if I'm not mistaken. It seems that some conservationists have appealed to the Dalai Lama and there were some positive statements made by him as well.
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9th February 2010, 21:01	#71
Atul-C BHPian Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 107 Thanked: 2 Times View My Garage	Leave aside the Tigers for a while. 1. How many of us try to not to waste paper. I have seen people using more than one paper towel to wipe their hands in men's restroom in my company whereas one is more than enough for properly washed hands. How many of us try to unfold that paper before start wiping our hands? If unfolded, it is more than enough to use only one paper. If we try no to waste the paper, it is a very good thing, but have we asked others to not to waste the paper too? That's where spreading awareness comes. You are not saving money for the company. You are saving trees from being cut down. 2. How many of us switch off the car engines at the signal where the waiting time is as low as one minute? I bet most of us do not want to hear honking behind us when the signal turns green and we fail to start moving for a few seconds. 3. How many of us try to avoid using plastic bags while shopping? I bet this number will be scaringly low. How many of want to be bothered with the inconvenience of not carrying the stuff in the plastic bags. Are we waiting for a Mobile company to remind us of these things? Then again we will write them off as a publicity gimmick. But did we do anything from our side before they started talking about it? If yes, then it is great but did we try to spread the awareness? This answer will be a big no and thats where we should give them marks for spreading awareness. Who is forcing you to change your mobile connection. Take the better part of it, scrap of the rest. Get the message, scrap the publicity of the brand. this planet a better place to live, we will have to start from our home. Last edited by Atul-C : 9th February 2010 at 21:07.
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10th February 2010, 13:29	#73
Atul-C BHPian Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 107 Thanked: 2 Times View My Garage	@pramodkumar No offence to you. There are two kind of people in this world. Half empty glass type and Half full glass type. I consider myself the later. When I am supporting this campaign, I am looking at the silverlining of people becoming aware. I am not looking at which company is getting rich or who is getting benefitted. I cannot change the view someone looks at the half glass full of water. I know there were very few people with the information that tiger population was drastically decreasing. Now there are more people who know that. I did not start this thread to convince people to go and join that website. It is there own call. I started this thread to spread the awareness. It does not mean that everyone has to agree with me. Again you can wake only those people who are really sleeping. Not the ones who are pretending to sleep. Now if someone really wakes up, I consider that what I wanted to do here is accomplished. If someone still choose to sleep, it is not my loss. This earth is as much theirs as it is mine. I am doing my part to spread the awareness. The answers you made to my points. I am not going to answer them as it is upto you to analyze that how many people even do what you do to save this earth. We all have cars does not mean that we dont care about the environment, but how many people try to do something good about this planet when they have a chance. Anyways it looks like that this is a wrong place where I am putting energy and my time. I should be doing this at a place where people are ready to accept the fact that as humans we have screwed this planet and still not ready to learn from our mistake. My experience with this community had been very good till I was talking about cars. But talking about a good cause like climate and conservation, see what happens. Now it is upto this community members to decide that this projects this community into what kind of picture. Peace. Last edited by Atul-C : 10th February 2010 at 13:36.
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10th February 2010, 14:40	#75
Spitfire BANNED Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Panaji - Goa/Bangalore - Karnataka Posts: 3,312 Thanked: 774 Times	Atul-C not to take anything away from you and your mission. Keep at it. If nothing else atleast you tried. Thats a massive feeling in itself. But more importantly learn why such things dont go too far. You are going to be disappointed for sure but dont let it make you sit back or give up. Now coming back to the topic. One colleague came upto me and asked to join when this whole thing started. He is a volunteer in the group that goes tiger spotting in the forests in Karnataka. I said ok. He pointed me to a facebook group. I said ok, will follow. They called a meeting. Everyone went. Some missed it. I didnt go. Why? It was to be held in Forum Mall. First thing: Wrong focus group. Discuss something that I am going to give my substantial time to in a Mall? Second: What are we presenting and what is the homework each one has to come with? Answer given: Your own ideas on how to preserve Tigers. Me: I dont know jack about Tigers. What do I actually prepare? All I could say was catch all of them and put them in a high security jungle and let them make merry. My friend: Keep quite at the meeting. Me:ok. Third: What sort of people are coming for the meet. Answer: Normal, simple people. IT/ITES folks, doctors, engineers etc. Me: So they are like me. They will be as clueless as I am. My friend: You never know. Someone might come up with some great ideas. Me: ok. So the usual mail and phone number sharing started. I was not convinced. I didnt go. From what i read later on the group site. They met, branstormed in the Mall. Then brainstormed in some office. Then went to Aircell but was closed - obviously, it was a Sunday. Then i guess they went to some newspaper folks who made them do the runabout mentioning some obscure jungle reporter who is only found in the jungle and writes some column in a blue moon and to contact him. They had coffee shared numbers and left. A few action items were listed but those were more of first learnng conservation rather then actually doing something. I will later tell you how if you need to - work towards wildlife conservation. This is based upon talking to a person who is into wildlife conservation for 50 years. I had interacted with him after his expose on how some villagers in Goa killed a tiger with a trap layed for wild boar and how the following political cover up started. He was instrumental in getting it onto the headlines and now the people who killed the tiger are in jail.
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