[poloman]

First of all the actual value of one dollar is around 10Rs on purchase parity.Also please find out what is the inflation rate in US.Don't worry with such inflation rates we will catch up with US soon, if not yet.
The uncontrollable inflation in India started with the arrival of corporate culture in retailing. Large scale hoarding and price manipulation by these people is one reason for the unexplained escalation in prices. Unless Govt show the will power to rein in them,the story will go on.
The lady in the video will be knowing about why and what she is doing more than us who watched the drama from the cosiness of our drawing rooms.

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by poloman

First of all the actual value of one dollar is around 10Rs on purchase parity.

This does not hold good in the direct commercial buy/sell market. I thought we were keeping the nitty gritties aside.

Also please find out what is the inflation rate in US.Don't worry with such inflation rates we will catch up with US soon, if not yet.

I am not aware about the actual figures but I know the picture is not good.

The uncontrollable inflation in India started with the arrival of corporate culture in retailing. Large scale hoarding and price manipulation by these people is one reason for the unexplained escalation in prices. Unless Govt show the will power to rein in them,the story will go on.

The ultimate problem and that at the outset was caused by the currency or medium of goods exchange losing its intrinsic value. Paper currency and electronic currency ,stock trading are all like a man walking on a rope with the stick kind. You and I know that very very well. I seriously think the corporate retail culture has brought sanity and why would a chain like Subhiksha fail man ?

The lady in the video will be knowing about why and what she is doing more than us who watched the drama from the cosiness of our drawing rooms.

Sorry I lost you on the video thingy.
Hey listen, I am sorry to walk out on you on such a wonderful debate but I need to get going or else my boss will inflate my rear before kicking it tomorrow if I am late. Good night! I'll check this tomorrow.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by anku94

IMO, deregulation was the need of the hour. People forget that it's just like loans we're taking, we have to pay them in the future.

If they have to protest, why don't do it against the exorbitant taxes ?

And how come they are being allowed to get away with it ? Sure, they can protest, but how can they force someone else to join them ?

1) Is reducing tax on fuel need of the hour ? When will it be need of the hour ?
What is the amount going into corruption ? Forget loans, we are lead by weak people who are just mic tigers.

2) What is the other way to protest ?

Originally Posted by poloman

We have to put people welfare above everything. Millions are suffering due to price rise.Bandh for such reasons is absolutely justified. This is the only means to put across point to a deaf government. Opposition unity will dare the govt think twice to make such moves in the future.People who cry so much for the losses to the economy, Please work on a Sunday and compensate for the losses.

Originally Posted by mjothi

I feel, bandh is to SHOW govt that we are against some of their decision. And a successful bandh shows that govt failed to fulfill the citizens need.

So, I don't see anything wrong in a compensating the work on a different day.

The reason for the bandh was price rise in common i guess. Not just the fuel price. A good govt, is suppose to handle all these situation.

And look at this.

If lorry drivers need to protest something, they can strike.
If auto drivers need to protest something, they can strike.
same applies to Airport, industry, transport and so on.
But the public who want to protest, can never do it at mass, except for these type of bandh.

+1000.

Originally Posted by EssYouWe

I hope Aggoswami and other supporters are happy now. Huge amount of money wasted, people acted like uncultured hooligans... guess the way forward for our nation has been clearly defined.

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

Good clean debate.
I feel, parliament is the place where opposition can contest propositions by the current governement.
Bandhs are constitutional, but, cost to country must also be considered.

I feel, a change of decision for which the bandh was held for, decides the success.
If there is a bandh + considerable economic damage and no results then it is an overall loss.
I hope they drop the prices of some essential commodities to say the least.

Price rise has a chain behind it. If some link goes bad somewhere there is fluctuation in price of comodities. It is not like someone is getting bored and doing something for the heck of it.

I am a not that happy, but it was nice to see a successful Bandh. What are other means of protest ? What else can the citizens do ? And will it make significant difference ?

IMO, there has been severe critisizm and opposition against this price rise in the parliament, but the present Government failed to take any action.

That said, yesterday when I was out for my work ( actually I am not working as an employee of any company, but after leaving job for MBA studies, I worked like a person solving computer problems, helping make decision, etc. ) I noticed that chemists were allowed to keep their shops open, hospitals were open. This was good as compared to earlier bandhs where everyone was forced to close.

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

1) Band against price rise? What is Govt going to do? Inflation is a part of life and this is what keeps the economy going. rising prices are just what merchants need to stock up and increase their market reach.

2) Taxes? first we steal taxes, then govt has to put higher taxes where we can not steal them. Once it's collected, politicians, officials and contractors steal their own pie out of it. The result is no development compared to what we pay in taxes. We have created our own parasites at every single transaction. Band is a solution?

3) govt vs opposition. This is the saddest part. I am saddened to see that India doesn't seem to be changing. People still go out on the road not knowing what they are doing, as long as they get one time meal and a free holiday. those who do not have work just like the thrill of being out pelting stones I guess. I saw a zombie like video of a village women cutting the pipes of a locomotive to stop it. It was quite obvious she had no idea what the bandh was for, who had organized it, what effect her being there will do, and what she was actually doing (destroying public property), guess where it comes from. taxes (or rail fares in this case). Saw some more women from bihar wielding swords, not sure what they were told before standing there.

1) They can reduced the tax on fuel, that is the first thing. Why is it not done ? And the tax is a significant amount. Read this in one Gujarati daily also. Read about high taxes on net also. Read about high tax on fuel in The Economic Times also.
When will this happen ?

2) Its OK to take this much amount of tax ( not tax on fuel, but other direct and indirect taxes ) if we are assured about quality of life and services.
A person buying a car will end up paying Excise ( on ex-factory price ), road tax, etc. When the car goes for service, again he will pay tax. Lets say that this is justified, but then is quality assured of service, good defect free product, good fuel, good roads ?

3) Agree with you here. Destructive means of such extent are not going to help anyone and eventually it would be tax money ( and a huge amount will be gone as corruption ) that will be used to repair any damage.

[akbaree]

Okay, let me jump in as well. These are just my thoughts...

I will support bandh as far as there's no violence, and it is for a just cause. Price rise is a serious problem. And we are facing this problem in India for quite some time now. Without any concrete measures being taken by th e present government - at least not that I am aware of. And so I would have supported this bandh. How the bandh was executed by opposition parties is entirely different thing. And if someone doesn't like their way, they should join politics and help their countrymen.

I remember reading it - although the current inflation doesn't look that bad statistically but it is far worse than what it appears to be. The inflation rate, that mostly people refer to is based on WPI. The retail inflation is upward of 20% - this is what impacts the middle class. And the inflation in food prices is also causing a great heart burn. Now have we heard any schemes on what Government is doing yo increase the food production or to improve efficiency of the storage and distribution systems?

Okay, I believe that food prices should go up so that farmers can be paid more and earn good profit - then only they will be able to invest in better techniques. But to enable that to happen, Government should actively work on reducing prices of other essential commodities - including Petrol/Diesel. If prices of other goods (non food) come down - means there will be more money left to buy food. How - by reducing taxes, import duties, excise duties, and a plethora of other proxy taxes.

People have tendency to make lot of assumptions. Making an opinion about something by watching a news item is as good as (or as bad as) someone participating in a bandh because someone told them to.

People in the world have similar tendencies - everyone want to save on taxes. IMO, if the Govt. wants people to be a little more honest, first thing they will have to do is to be more honest/transparent themselves. People may be more honest when they know that their tax money is being well spent. Increasing tax rate to penalize honest tax payers is no solution - again IMO.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

1)

2) Its OK to take this much amount of tax ( not tax on fuel, but other direct and indirect taxes ) if we are assured about quality of life and services.
A person buying a car will end up paying Excise ( on ex-factory price ), road tax, etc. When the car goes for service, again he will pay tax. Lets say that this is justified, but then is quality assured of service, good defect free product, good fuel, good roads ?

you didn't get my point. we know the tax that gets collected leaks thru many holes in govt. My question was is a band going to solve it? it's opposition just trying to make sure they are the ones consuming thru those holes. I am not siding with the govt, when in oppostion, they will do the same.

Originally Posted by poloman

The lady in the video will be knowing about why and what she is doing more than us who watched the drama from the cosiness of our drawing rooms.

that's why I said I am saddened to see such images. This is our failure.

Originally Posted by akbaree

Okay, I believe that food prices should go up so that farmers can be paid more and earn good profit - then only they will be able to invest in better techniques. But to enable that to happen, Government should actively work on reducing prices of other essential commodities - including Petrol/Diesel. If prices of other goods (non food) come down - means there will be more money left to buy food. How - by reducing taxes, import duties, excise duties, and a plethora of other proxy taxes.

you can't generally expect that, one commodity to increase in price while other to reduce. unless you start subsidizing, which has it's own curses.

imagine a carpenter not being able to sell his artifacts for a higher price when food price has tripled.

In my view the current price rises are directly fueled by the inflow of dollars from exports, mostly BPOs and IT. when the overall economy has an inflow of cash, somebody will be ready to pay higher price to get a better service/commodity. causing higher prices in general. The best all of us can do is take advantage of this situation rather than organize band and lose revenue. but AFAIK, most of us prefer a day off shouting slogans than having to do hard work .

[akbaree]

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

you can't generally expect that, one commodity to increase in price while other to reduce. unless you start subsidizing, which has it's own curses.

imagine a carpenter not being able to sell his artifacts for a higher price when food price has tripled.

The point is - the prizes of the food grains is low because farmers are given a lot of subsidies. And the carpenter like example you gave is precisely how Govt. is hiding their own failures. The economy was opened up in 1991 - before that Govt. arguement was for closed economy and we know how much we progressed in those 45 odd years. Didn't they had the right reasons to have a License Raj. I believe the time is to take some bold decisions, we have almost spent 20 years after our last big decision.

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

In my view the current price rises are directly fueled by the inflow of dollars from exports, mostly BPOs and IT. when the overall economy has an inflow of cash, somebody will be ready to pay higher price to get a better service/commodity. causing higher prices in general. The best all of us can do is take advantage of this situation rather than organize band and lose revenue. but AFAIK, most of us prefer a day off shouting slogans than having to do hard work .

IMO, bandh is also an expression of disagreement. I don't believe that anyone here is supporting frivolous bandhs but then ridiculing someone supporting it when they think there's a reason for them to support it, only shows that they are left with no choice.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by akbaree

The point is - the prizes of the food grains is low because farmers are given a lot of subsidies.

in other words, we have already achieved what you wanted. subsidized prices means farmers already get a a cut from govt (an incentive) to produce more food. But it has it's own curses as you will point out in later posts

or, you wanted food prices to rise and other things to be subsidized? that will promote growth in other sectors.

the point I am making is govt can not affect markets, it can only regulate them. Markets will take their own course based on demand, supply, or influx of money (in this case). If a particular section is troubled by price inequalities, there has to be an economic and business/entrepreneurial solution. I would be much happier if politicians stayed out of that.

I don't believe that anyone here is supporting frivolous bandhs

you serieously think that majority of janta out there (> 70%) on streets pelting stones and burning tires really understands the concept and consequences of band?

[akbaree]

No further comments from me after this post...

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

in other words, we have already achieved what you wanted. subsidized prices means farmers already get a a cut from govt (an incentive) to produce more food. But it has it's own curses as you will point out in later posts

How are subsidies (on one thing) financed? Thru taxes on other things. What I had suggested in my earlier post was to start rationalizing that gap.

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

you serieously think that majority of janta out there (> 70%) on streets pelting stones and burning tires really understands the concept and consequences of band?

Because you are asking a terse question, I will give a terse reply - I believe, they do.

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by akbaree

What I had suggested in my earlier post was to start rationalizing that gap.

One possiblity to covering that gap is by dividing profits created by a govenment subsidised business after it is stable, and returning that portion of the tax consumed back to the government. Do we in India have such journal voucher or a correction entry ?

I believe, they do.

I believe a quarter whiskey can get as many tires burnt as I want to and as many shops pelted as I want to.
General public does not understand market trends and monopolies and holding up of stocks to generate a more profitable market. They have to taught otherwise by government opposition that it is a government screw up which actually is just only partially true (just because they could not see this coming earlier or didnt have a backup plan for such an order).

Hon'able Shri Sharad Pawar should have a better explaination on what happened to the reserves if they were any.

[akbaree]

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

One possiblity to covering that gap is by dividing profits created by a govenment subsidised business after it is stable, and returning that portion of the tax consumed back to the government. Do we in India have such journal voucher or a correction entry ?

This is a good idea. IMO, we should adopt it for certain absolute requirements. But if subsidy is the root of the problem, we should get rid of it from the root - at least in majority of the cases.

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

I believe a quarter whiskey can get as many tires burnt as I want to and as many shops pelted as I want to.
General public does not understand market trends and monopolies and holding up of stocks to generate a more profitable market. They have to taught otherwise by government opposition that it is a government screw up which actually is just only partially true (just because they could not see this coming earlier or didnt have a backup plan for such an order).

I believe in democracy. I believe in my people - you, me, and others. If we don't believe in our people, we should take away the right to vote as well. Everyone in this world has only limited understanding of things and they act based on that.

Thinking that 70% of the crowd (general public as you like to call) come out for quarter of whiskey is a pessimistic view - at best. Or may be we think we are too intelligent and have the right to ridicule and assume and like.

P.S.: Ok, the last one was supposed to be my last post on this. I will make this one last and will stick to it

[Samurai]

The thread is going too OT now. Since the purpose of the thread has been served, it is time to close - Support Team