[straight6]

Originally Posted by Turbojc

I noticed this on their global website:

Attachment 2118470

Could it mean that Suzuki's already homologated the new Busa for India ?

The Indian version will also not get the integrated switchback turn signals at the front.

[Rocketscience]

Wow! We are way past peak superbike era now, if Kawasaki hadn't introduced the brilliant H2 in the recent past, i would have said there has been no significant development in motorcycles since the 90s, but here we are.
Bikes and cars aren't as subjective as art, music and movies and Suzuki has clearly not done enough, no questions about it, does that mean this is a bad bike? Hell no! By no definition it is not, but so weren't the gen 2 and gen 1.

This is clearly a facelift of a facelift that was generation 2.
I don't know if they don't have the R&D budget or the economics doesn't justify spending on it, but there is no way in hell that the same company that made the Hayabusa in 1999 comes up with this after 22 years, i mean they haven't even worked on the looks that much and they have hardly evolved in all these years.



Vs



I'am all for following the signature look and stuff but that is not the same as being lazy and keep using the same design, no BMW, Honda or even Lamborghini looks 95% the same as what they did 22 years ago.

I understand Hayabusa is known for its sheer high speed, great power at almost all the rpm ranges thanks to the oversized engine, that doesn't mean there should be hardly any improvements to it.

I can understand why they chose against the forced induction route because unlike cars, bikes don't have all wheel drive (unless someone has the motivation to engineer something, i have no idea how it would work though) and they just can't handle all that power at all, even the h2 barely manages to keep its front wheel down even till 3rd gear with all the electronics in the world, had they supercharged the hayabusa, it would have taken off for sure.
Had they reduced the engine capacity to deliver roughly the same performance, there would have been a different kind of outcry, and they might have lost even more fans, i understand why they decided to play safe.
But then again, VVT? Direct injection? There are so many improvements that could have been done to make more power across the revv range, more efficiency maybe, isn't that the point of new generation products? but then again i feel the demand for such bikes is not enough to justify spending on R&D, they did a far better job and pathbreaking stuff decades ago, we are just down to usual minor refinements and adding more electronics (which i have no problems with btw), they should have made this atleast look new, because if you ask me, it looks rather outdated in 2021.

[amvj]

It still looks very distinct and easily recognizable as Hayabusa. I think if it has a rear seat, it will look less bulbous.



In the year 2009, I just finished college, that time I was very active in xbhp forum. I thought the Hayabusa would look great with slightly sharper styling and a sharp rear end. I used to post lots of these editing non-sense there.

I had so much spare time and I edited this on Photoshop. My crude attempt with a Pulsar rear end (read year 2009).

Taken from my archives.

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by bigron

What utter disappointment!
Suzuki, you just had 13 years to get this right.

Which manufacturer actually updates a motorcycle after a decade and gives less bhp. And all this nonsense of increasing the lower rpm power curve. I would just swap out the rear sprocket and add some teeth if I wanted to do that, Suzuki!.

Exactly what I thought. When they didn’t disclose any power output but were talking how they tested a turbo six cylinder but in the ended decided to retain the same inline four engine and blah blah.

Retaining the same engine architecture is ok, but when you say you changed the pistons, connecting rods among the 550 parts that you changed to increase the engine life and durability of an engine which will be producing less power and torque compared to an engine which is already considered to be a 2JZ of the biking world it just doesn’t add up.

The only people to buy it will be who missed having the electronics on the Gen 2 and the ones who always wanted to buy/own a Hayabusa.

For remaining Gen 2 owners like us we should be thankful to own a piece of history with no electric gizmos and just RAW power something the world will never see again.

P.s - Gen 3 has ride by wire so needs to be seen if the throttle response is snappy with on and off inputs. Also, the less powerful Gen 3 delivers less fuel economy over Gen 2 thanks to the tuning to meet Euro 5 norms

[windrider]

I honestly don't understand the hate suzuki is getting. Yes it looks similar in shape to the one they launched twenty years ago but then so do Porsches. Yes there are a lot of people who consider its design ugly compared to say the R1 or H2 which look like fighter jets compared to the busa but the Hayabusa has created its own identity and looks are subjective. The Hayabusa's performance is so good that we forget this is a sports tourer and not a super sports bike. It is made for munching miles on the highway. Coming to power and torque figures, it is marginally less than the outgoing version, but really, who is even going to notice that in the real world? You are going to be riding it in the low to midrange for the most part and there, suzuki has improved the bike a lot. There are very few roads in the world where you can even dream about taking any 1000+cc bike to its absolute limit and very few people with the ability to do so safely. Slapping on a turbo may have given it a huge Boost in power but would have reduced reliability and also increased the price a lot more. At present, the busa offers 95% of the performance of a supersport at 80% of the price. Finally the busa has the most amazing mod potential of anything out there. People have been been turbocharging it and modifying the heck out of it for over 20 years We should be thanking suzuki for giving us hypercar performance for the price of a kia seltos

[vikramvicky1984]

I am very happy that it remains largely unchanged- my dreams won't get distorted. I have been lusting over it since the first generation came out and am still nowhere close to owning one. But now I can hope to own one some day for another decade.

Many others dreams like Pajero, Evos, E46, LC100 left before many like me could come any close. R1 was the first superbike I saw in flesh (2002); now post so many iterations- I don't even know how the current generation looks like.

Hayabusa doesn't need repeat purchases; for each existing owner, there are 100's who want only a Hayabusa.
In the end its " Mera sapna meri maruti Suzuki" - mileage hai, reliability hai, VFM hai, ubiquitous hai, status hai, resale value hai and hero log bhi yehi chalate hain;
and I have seen with my own eyes it carrying the full family ( hubby, wifey,2 kiddos one on tank) at Carter Road.

Hope it's nicely priced in India like the previous version. Will go and see one and keep dreaming.

[bigron]

Originally Posted by windrider

I honestly don't understand the hate suzuki is getting.

Are you an owner of a Gen1 or Gen2 or a fan of the model in general?
Since this was launched half a day ago, I have yet to come across one owner ( both in india and overseas, I am a part of most all prominent Hayabusa forums world over) who has not felt disappointed in the way Suzuki has presented the bike.

Let's take this one by one. No one is offended by the looks. In-fact we love that it carries on the family shape and looks like a hash of Gen 1 and Gen 2. With some New elements thrown in, it looks good. Now the bad. Suzuki hardly did anything on the weight aspect. It's still a big fat girl.

Secondly, the performance of the Busa' WAS legendary. Now every Tom dick 1000 cc pocket rocket is faster in accelaration and matches the top speed. Hence the reason so many of us have flashed our ECUs, running full exhausts, race AF etc. After 13 years you would expect Suzuki to bring in the 1440 or atleast force induction. Even if we just talk about sports tourers, the last zx14r , the only other player in the category won the displacement , bhp and acceleration game before bowing out.

It is not about having a few bhps less. It is about the fact that Suzuki was upgrading the Hayabusa. The original gold standard of everything fast on two wheels. No body has updated a sports bike after so long and given you less bhp and tourqe and keeping the weight almost same.
How do you know Suzuki has improved alot in the low to midrange? Product literature! A 70$ rear sprocket will make my busa a wheelie maniac.

A supersport is a 600 cc bike. The Hayabusa does not give 95% performance of a SS. The Hayabusa completely obilerates a super sport. What the super sport will do at 10000 rpm, the busa will do at 6500. It's the 1000cc's that can thrash it's ass.

I have a highly modified busa which is unrestricted and tuned but I would have still liked Suzuki to give us a proper upgrade after 13 years which would have been a fitting tribute to the most iconic motorcycle in the world.
(PS- I have been a long term user of this motorcycle (since 05) and had/still have the Gen 1 and Gen2).

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by bigron

How do you know Suzuki has improved alot in the low to midrange? Product literature! A 70$ rear sprocket will make my busa a wheelie maniac.

In fact Suzuki engineers themselves mentioned Gen 3 and Gen 2 would feel the same till the second gear acceleration. They said that they have been listening to customer feedback globally and have made improvements accordingly?? I don’t think customers worldwide wanted more stronger internal’s if the engine had to produce leas power. Maybe they have made the engine future ready to boost up the power maybe in a few years in form of a midterm upgrade.

Lets wait and watch till then. For now waiting to see the first riding impressions to see how the ride by wire and the upgraded braking unit perform with the ABS intervention.

The Busa became a legend with Gen 1 and Gen 2 because of the BOLD moves Suzuki made in 1999 and 2008 which sadly is lacking in Gen 3

[neil.jericho]

I love it that Suzuki has brought out an updated Hayabusa while retaining its familiar silhouette and dials. The fact that there it doesnt have gigantour twin exhausts akin to the GSXR1000 makes me like it even more. The colour schemes look fabulous as well.

I agree with the points that Bigron has highlighted but I dont mind it because I think Suzuki is targetting an aggressive price with this new Busa as compared to the Kawasakis. As they mentioned in their promotional video, Suzuki had experimented with different engine configurations including a turbo six cylinder (Good Lord!) but with new internals and R&D comes much higher costs which have to get passed on to the customer. So it appears as though Suzuki has chosen the more sensible, cost effective path while developing the bike, which I believe is the right strategy for them given how iconic the product already is.

Suzuki has packed this bike with electronics though I didnt notice any mention of electronically adjustable suspension. I suspect it is to do with undercutting the competition.

The top of the line super charged Kawasaki H2 SX SE+ gets electronically adjustable suspension and a couple of other features (smartphone connectivity and cornering lights etc) that I did not see on the Suzuki promotional video. The Kawasaki H2 SX SE+ costs GBP 21,999. The lower specced versions of the same platform are the base H2 SX (GBP 15,899) and the H2 SX SE (GBP 19,099). The Hayabusa has a lot more features than these two bikes. So feature for feature, it slots in just under the top Kawasaki H2 SX SE+.

Its old arch nemesis the ZX14R / ZZR1400 is still on sale in the UK for GBP 15,849 but I dont believe it has been updated in ages. So it really isnt much competition.

MCN mentioned that the Hayabusa should be in the price range of the litre class bikes. The prices of the litre class offerings in UK are below
- Suzuki GSX R 1000 : GBP 16,999
- Kawasaki ZX10R : GBP 15,799
- Honda CBR1000RR-R : GBP 19,999
- Yamaha R1 : GBP 17,399

If we assume a ballpark figure of say GBP 16,999 for the new Hayabusa and compare it to the competition, essentially, you end up saving GBP 5,000 as compared to the Kawasaki H2 SX SE+ but only miss out on electronically adjustable suspension. I think product positioning wise, Suzuki has nailed it. Electronically adjustable suspension is not likely to be a deal breaker for too many riders who are into sports touring. It is a great feature to have but would you spend GBP 5,000 more just for that and a supercharger?

If Suzuki can bring the new Hayabusa to India at affordable prices, their dealers will be very happy indeed.

[Rocketscience]

Originally Posted by windrider

I honestly don't understand the hate suzuki is getting. Yes it looks similar in shape to the one they launched twenty years ago but rthen so do Porsches.

Well, it is not really coming from hate but the love we have for the Hayabusa brand in general.

I mean obviously the gen 3 is a great bike and perhaps an overkill for almost everyone but then so were gen 2 and gen 1 decades ago, does that mean it should not be improved?
I mean sure people in the 70s would have thought their Ambassadors are great and the Mustangs are great and they were, but that doesn't mean constant improvements should stop, we wouldn't be here if it wasn't for constant quest for reinventing and improving, hell i was more than happy with my Nokia 5800 just a decade ago but here we are, the current phones are way better in each and every aspect.
Mediocrity and lack of effort should never be promoted, or defended, atleast that is what i feel.
I understand why Suzuki did what it did and the clear answer is to save R&D money, doesn't mean that should be cherished or defended.

I won't argue about looks as those are subjective but please get in mind that Porsches look similar and not same, there is a difference between those, there is clear evolution and engineering going on there, in the engine side as well. Just because something is good enough or great doesn't mean it shouldn't be even better.

[TrackDay]

Originally Posted by Rocketscience

This is clearly a facelift of a facelift that was generation 2.
I don't know if they don't have the R&D budget or the economics doesn't justify spending on it, but there is no way in hell that the same company that made the Hayabusa in 1999 comes up with this after 22 years, i mean they haven't even worked on the looks that much and they have hardly evolved in all these years.
Attachment 2118509
Vs
Attachment 2118510
I'am all for following the signature look and stuff but that is not the same as being lazy and keep using the same design, no BMW, Honda or even Lamborghini looks 95% the same as what they did 22 years ago.
they should have made this atleast look new, because if you ask me, it looks rather outdated in 2021.

Seems like the Hayabusa is the Indian 'VW Polo' of superbikes Various iterations but the same exterior shell and design over the years !

[Samarth 619]

Its ok to completely accept the new Busa, if you're an undemanding consumer. Its not the worst disappointment in the industry. Leave Busa, many cruisers of Harley Davidson are making dismayal power figures, so much that Suzuki Intruder's 127 bhp sounds huge in comparison! Base range of HD is dangerously close to KTM Adventure/Duke 390!
No one tells HD anything..


But honestly, I can understand anyone who says it was a wasted opportunity. Specially with the new norms staying longer than BS4 could.
I'll tell you my honest thoughts when I was reading the spec sheet right here, my thoughts were, "Oh, this guy posted the old spec sheet by mistake".
I was expecting anything but the exact same bore and stroke, cc and kerb weight. Even tyre sizes are same. Was hard pressed to see the changes!

And these claims of low end to mid range torque, I suspect is just an excuse for power loss for BS6/ Euro compliance, but can't be too sure.
Disagreeing with a tbhpian above, no, we can't quite get low end torque by just undergearing using a bigger rear sprocket, it will not bring the same result.

But yes, agree with the overall disappointment.

[irajput]

https://youtu.be/z2qNq8lPlos

This is a perspective offered by Shumi from Powerdrift and I found it to be quite interesting. I would love to hear thoughts of more experienced Bhpians after watching this video and understand the bike a bit more!

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by irajput

This is a perspective offered by Shumi from Powerdrift and I found it to be quite interesting. I would love to hear thoughts of more experienced Bhpians after watching this video and understand the bike a bit more!

Shumi says that as per Suzuki if your bike already does 299 kph then you don’t need more power, which is fair enough and acceptable if you think logically. But the bikes like Hayabusa were never meant to be logical and that is why it became an icon because of the illogical stuff Suzuki did to it to make it the fastest and most powerful bike in production way back in 1999.

So if you go by Suzuki’s logic than every other motorcycle manufacturer offering more power than the Busa with a smaller engine is a fool to do so as the end result is 299 kph. But its this mind boggling power figures that make these bikes more desirable other than the looks and technical gizmos.

Trying to maintain an affordable price point are stuff that should not have come in the way of developing the Gen 3 Busa and if that was the case Suzuki should not have changed/redesigned close to 550 engine parts to make the engine more reliable and achieve 500,000 kms of operational life or more with a less power output figure over the outgoing model. Suzuki engines are known to be bulletproof and the Hayabusa engine in the previous generations were no exceptions either.

What Suzuki did will be a first in the world is by dropping the power on a similar displacement engine in the next generation model. Something the Busa name did not deserve when the engine is what helped it in achieving the legendary status it commands in the biking world and especially when you have taken almost a decade or more to develop the Gen 3.

Could you imagine Bugatti introducing the Chiron with 990 HP over the Veyron’s 1,000 HP, when you very well know that 1,000 HP was still an overkill in the first place and something you would never actually be able to use in the real world.

[neil.jericho]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

Trying to maintain an affordable price point are stuff that should not have come in the way of developing the Gen 3 Busa and if that was the case Suzuki should not have changed/redesigned close to 550 engine parts to make the engine more reliable and achieve 500,000 kms of operational life or more with a less power output figure over the outgoing model. Suzuki engines are known to be bulletproof and the Hayabusa engine in the previous generations were no exceptions either.

There are two more factors to keep in mind when we talk about the new Hayabusa. One, Suzuki has not really been on a major roll in recent years. If we look back at their major launches and exciting unveilings, besides the current gen GSXR1000 and maybe the Katana, have they really had anything exciting? I suppose the VStrom 1000 could be in consideration, but is it really a game changer in todays market? Compared to what Honda, Kawasaki and to a lesser extent Yamaha, have been churning out, Suzuki has been a distant fourth in the Japanese quartet. If we go back and watch coverage from international bike shows (I miss when that was a thing!), most people mentioned that there wasnt really too much exciting fare from Suzuki.

Also, with the global two wheeler market not expanding like it was a few years ago and with Covid hammering sales in 2020, I am amazed that Suzuki even continued with the development of the new Hayabusa. So an affordable price was important keeping in mind the current market conditions.

Originally Posted by SnS_12

What Suzuki did will be a first in the world is by dropping the power on a similar displacement engine in the next generation model. Something the Busa name did not deserve when the engine is what helped it in achieving the legendary status it commands in the biking world and especially when you have taken almost a decade or more to develop the Gen 3.

Very valid point. One thing that I noticed with the shift to Euro 5 / BS6, is that every manufacturer had to deal with more weight (bigger cats etc), less mileage, reduced performance etc. One way out of this was to bump up displacement to give higher horsepower etc. But this in turn results in more R&D costs and a higher price tag. Case in point KTM Duke 790 became the Duke 890.

Im sure that maybe a new 1,450 cc (hypothetically) engine would have given the Hayabusa bragging rights at the pubs and breakfast joints, but with a higher price tag, how well would it sell when it has to deal with supercharged competition?

I too would have liked the Hayabusa to have better specs and faster 0 - 100 kmph times. But if it meant a bigger engine which meant higher prices with lower sales which dont justify a new Hayabusa at all, Im happy that at least we get the next best option. Something is better than nothing.

Ive always had a soft corner for the Hayabusa, Im just glad it continues to live on for another generation of motorcyclists to enjoy.