[mdsaab]

would have been nice to have airbags, but i guess keeping in mind the slower city speeds we travel at we can live without the airbags. any idea if we can do a special order with airbags? anyways looking at the bright side could fit the child seat in the front when needed since there are no airbags. Its good that abs is offered so not compromising there.

[supremeBaleno]

Special order with airbags ???

Even getting a normal AT is a special order (ordeal actually), given the couple of months they quote as waiting period - I guess they concentrate more on exports to EU where this sells well.

Given that the exported A-Stars would be having airbags, if you can pull some strings at MSIL, I guess it should be possible - who knows.

If airbags were available, I would have been glad to pay for it.

[automaticfan]

Now for the best part. FE till CBE was an astonishing 17 km/l, which was way above my expectation,

I too get an FE of 17+ with 5 adults and 100% AC in that route in my i10 AT. Silk board to Hosur to Krishnagiri to Salem. I have checked this at least 4 times in that route. So, not much difference ( or i10 may be better) in FE on good highways. But I get 8-9 kmpl in city B2B traffic in blr with 100% AC :(

[Harbir]

thinking this would be an ideal car for the wife. but lack of power adjustable outside mirrors and airbags are a huge obstacle. I consider both a safety issue. you may not think so about the outside mirrors, but when the day turns to night and cars with bright lights behind you blind you, you want to be able to tilt the mirrors so that the lights are not glaring in your eyes, but you can still see whats in them but moving your head a bit. such a situation is no time to be leaning across the car to fiddle with the mirror adjustment lever on the passenger side. I refuse to buy any car that does not have power adjustable outside mirrors. but if my wife doesn't feel too strongly about it, the a-star automatic would still be in contention

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by Harbir

I refuse to buy any car that does not have power adjustable outside mirrors.

Well said! Looks like you and I are the only two Teambhp members who can't live without electric ORVMs. I have never seen anyone on any other forum/post complain about it. I too shudder to think of a car without this feature. I give it more importance than power-windows ( which I hardly use since my car always has its aircon on, 365 days ). Think of the hassle while adjusting the passenger side ORVM. leaning across, adjusting, sitting back and then realising it's a little way off mark. Try again and again till you get it right. How those millions of Swift, Dzire and Ritz owners live with their cars, I will never know. May be these are the guys who never use their ORVMs.

Tachometer is next thing on my list. A-Star AT doesn't have this one either. Why do these manufacturers skimp on a feature that even 50 thousand rupee bikes have. In the absence of one, you have to train your ears to pick up the variation in pitch and correspond it to different revs. Jeese, what era are we from?

But for these two shortcoming, A-Star is the best and sportiest and cutest looking hatch in india right now.

[Mpower]

If you are the only one driving the car, then there is no need to adjust the mirror every now that then, is it? Its unlikely that an A-star would have a chauffeur.

[blackasta]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Well said! Looks like you and I are the only two Teambhp members who can't live without electric ORVMs. I have never seen anyone on any other forum/post complain about it. I too shudder to think of a car without this feature. I give it more importance than power-windows ( which I hardly use since my car always has its aircon on, 365 days ). Think of the hassle while adjusting the passenger side ORVM. leaning across, adjusting, sitting back and then realising it's a little way off mark. Try again and again till you get it right.

This is part of the driving skill as a whole, is something that good trainers still teach, and still exists as an item in driving tests.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

How those millions of Swift, Dzire and Ritz owners live with their cars, I will never know. May be these are the guys who never use their ORVMs.

Thats a very loose comment IMO.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Tachometer is next thing on my list. A-Star AT doesn't have this one either. Why do these manufacturers skimp on a feature that even 50 thousand rupee bikes have. In the absence of one, you have to train your ears to pick up the variation in pitch and correspond it to different revs. Jeese, what era are we from?

But for these two shortcoming, A-Star is the best and sportiest and cutest looking hatch in india right now.

Do you shift gears looking at the tacho?

[ampere]

Nice comparison list. I had not seen this before. This will help many folks.
What was surprising to me is that you say : Front Space is more in A* as compared to i10.
Seems counter intuitive by looking at their sizes.

Any comments on that?

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by Mpower

If you are the only one driving the car, then there is no need to adjust the mirror every now that then, is it?

True. Infact I have electrically operated ORVMs in the Baleno, but I have never felt the need to change the settings based on day / night or for glare - they are just set for the best view in normal circumstances and stay that way.

Our Swift does not have Electric-ORVMS, but I am able to set it to a good position manually easily. But the ORVMS in the A-Star are a real pain - adjusting them never seems to work the way you want it. And I am not even talking of the basic ORVM in our M800 - useless - I don't even bother setting it and instead use only the IRVM.

While I can manage with manually adjustable ORVMs, it would be tough to live without day/night IRVM and it is pathetic that the A-Star does not have it - in the Indian context, this is where you get hit most with glare from the hi-beam of the idiot behind you.

While it is indeed good to have mirrors all around, skill also matters along with peripheral vision.

[Harbir]

Originally Posted by Mpower

If you are the only one driving the car, then there is no need to adjust the mirror every now that then, is it?

yes there is, for me, like I said, I like to tilt the mirrors away at night to not be blinded by high beam users on the road behind me. I absolute DETEST the little adjustment stick for the mirrors. If the mirrors are manual, I would prefer to grab the mirrors and physically move it.

I absolutely hate wiggling that stick from the driver's seat to move the mirror. I might add that my Lotus ELise did not have power mirrors. It thankfully also did not have those nasty mirror adjustment joysticks. And my peeve with it was that I could not safely adjust the outside mirrors while driving when some moron with his high beams on came and sat 10 feet off my rear.

Its a personal thing. obviously it doesn't matter to a lot of people and I am not saying that it should. I am just saying that it does matter to me and it matters enough that if my wife agrees, that strikes the A-star off the list.

Originally Posted by blackasta

This is part of the driving skill as a whole, is something that good trainers still teach, and still exists as an item in driving tests.

Sorry, I don't count this as part of a driving skill. It is downright dangerous to do this while driving and if it needs to be done, you should pull over to adjust your mirrors. wiggling passenger side mirrors while driving is NOT a driving skill. its as stupid as texting while driving. which basically involves using one hand and your eyes to be doing something other than driving.

[pgsagar]

Blacksta, I don't understand what you are trying to say. My comment about guys not using their ORVM is not "loose". I don't know about other places but in my town I see 6 out of 10 cars driving around with both their ORVMs folded and almost 10 out of 10 with their left ORVM folded. Do you consider it a safe practice?

Do you advocate the antics of leaning across to adjust the far-side ORVM? Can't the car maker provide the electric ORVM? Is it a rocket science?

Do you think tachometer is a redundant equipment? Do you think it has no use at all? When 50 thou rupee bikes can have it then why not a 5-lakh rupee car? No, I do not change gears looking at tacho but it is widely used to monitor what speed a car should do at what RPM.

As for the need to adjust ORVM, I always adjust both ORVMs to focus on rear wheels while reversing; to see if the wheels are mounting kerb or rock/stone.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

and almost 10 out of 10 with their left ORVM folded. Do you consider it a safe practice?

While driving in Chennai, I am one of these 10 guys. On the highway or at Kerala, I use both ORVMs. Given the kind of unruly bikers at Chennai who try to squeeze in where no space exists, I am sure that the left ORVM would be gone in a matter of days. Even ignoring the cost (which is substantial for my car - the part being SGP), how many times can we keep replacing the mirror ?

Regarding safety, I use the right ORVM to cover the right side, while the inside RVM is adjusted such that it covers the centre and left. Agree that this wont be as effective as using both ORVMs, but given that I started driving on an M800 which did not have a left ORVM at all, I am used to this.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Can't the car maker provide the electric ORVM? Is it a rocket science?

Its about price, not lack of technology. Every feature adds to the price and manufacturers scrimp on those that the general populace won't miss. Heck, the A-Star does not have front-passenger vanity mirror in the sun-visor - now how much do you think they would save from not providing a small 4" by 3" piece of mirror ?

I would not be bothered about the tachometer though. Yes, it is good to have, but I (and most people IMO) don't use either the rpm or speed to change gears - it is instinctive. Most manufacturers mention specific speeds at which we should shift up gears, but I believe we go by our gut feel.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Its about price, not lack of technology. Every feature adds to the price and manufacturers scrimp on those that the general populace won't miss. Heck, the A-Star does not have front-passenger vanity mirror in the sun-visor - now how much do you think they would save from not providing a small 4" by 3" piece of mirror ?
.

You are right. Saving on the cost of a 4"X3" piece of mirror ( may be 5 rupees ) on a 5 lakh car is beyond my comprehension. But in case of mirror, you can get one cut and stuck but a tacho and electric ORVM can not be fitted aftremarket.

[blackasta]

Originally Posted by Harbir

Sorry, I don't count this as part of a driving skill. It is downright dangerous to do this while driving and if it needs to be done, you should pull over to adjust your mirrors. wiggling passenger side mirrors while driving is NOT a driving skill. its as stupid as texting while driving. which basically involves using one hand and your eyes to be doing something other than driving.

You check your mirrors before starting your car, not while driving your car. Thats what I was taught. You misinterpreted me - I never advocate leaning and adjusting mirrors while driving.

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Blacksta, I don't understand what you are trying to say. My comment about guys not using their ORVM is not "loose". I don't know about other places but in my town I see 6 out of 10 cars driving around with both their ORVMs folded and almost 10 out of 10 with their left ORVM folded. Do you consider it a safe practice?

Do you advocate the antics of leaning across to adjust the far-side ORVM? Can't the car maker provide the electric ORVM? Is it a rocket science?

Do you think tachometer is a redundant equipment? Do you think it has no use at all? When 50 thou rupee bikes can have it then why not a 5-lakh rupee car? No, I do not change gears looking at tacho but it is widely used to monitor what speed a car should do at what RPM.

As for the need to adjust ORVM, I always adjust both ORVMs to focus on rear wheels while reversing; to see if the wheels are mounting kerb or rock/stone.

You meant millions of ritz/swift users do not have powered owners and you don't know how they drive. And you meant they drive around with their orvms close.

And you adjust orvms each time you back? I have seen the auto kerb feature in some bimmers, but know of none who adjust their orvms everytime they back up. One gets a feel of the car after driving around for a few days, and 99% of the time people dont ride the kerb.

Don't get me wrong - I am not against technology in cars - but that should not take the skill and fun out of driving.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by blackasta

And you adjust orvms each time you back? I have seen the auto kerb feature in some bimmers, but know of none who adjust their orvms everytime they back up. One gets a feel of the car after driving around for a few days, and 99% of the time people dont ride the kerb.

Yes, I adjust ORVMs every time I back up in a crowded area. Hence, my grouse with unpowered ORVMs. Ok, I may be the only one who does this but then there is nothing wrong in being a little extra cautious. Or, is there? Reversing is a tricky affair. In reverse motion, even a slight tug at steering wheel swings the tail out badly, unlike in forward motion. Therefore, it is easy to overturn a car while reversing by turning steering wheel hard. I always go forward and reverse my way in to park, unlike most who drive staright forward and park. And while reversing, I always lower the kerb-side ORVM to see where the rear wheel is going.