Are automated challans at signals unavoidable in some cases?

What is worse, the physical post comes after 10 days and the case has already been forwarded to a virtual court, though no date is visible in the portal.

Thanks to the Team-BHP fan (he prefers to remain anonymous) who sent this in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP share page!

Dear Members,

I have recently come across cases where there is no obvious way to avoid automated fines. One with my cousin in Gurgaon, and the current case mentioned below with my wife in Delhi. I wonder if these are simply money-collection schemes by the respective governments.

It goes like this, you are in the middle of traffic trying to cross a red light. Just when you have crossed the Lakshman Rekha (the stop line), the traffic in front of you slows and the light turns amber.

Now you have two possibilities:

• Follow through and cross the intersection. This runs the risk that you will be fined by a waiting cop on the other side. Plus, this is usually the "unethical" option because you could easily block the incoming traffic for a significant duration of their own green light time.
• The other option is to stop as soon as you find outcrossing is not a good idea. You can try reversing a few metres but usually, cars have queued up behind you already and this is not possible. So, you just wait where you stopped.

My wife chose the second option, and guess what, she gets a Rs 5000 fine for "crossing a red light"! (see attached image). What is worse, the physical post comes after 10 days and the case has already been forwarded to a virtual court, though no date is visible in the portal.

Would love to hear Team-BHP members' thoughts on this and what our next steps should be.

Here's what BHPian mygodbole had to say on the matter:

OK, I will stick my neck out.

As far as I know, traffic rules dictate that (a) look before you enter an intersection; and (b) enter only if you have a path ahead that will allow you to clear the intersection.

Traffic cameras 'assume/presume' you are aware of the above; thus the violation.

The only solution I know of is to stop behind the stop line, ignore all the honkers behind and cross only when the way to the other side is all-clear.

The all-clear depends on many factors, including and not limited to, impatient riders/drivers wanting to cross since their signal is green.

Difference, as mentioned in a Hindi film, between well-trained and educated.

Drive safe.

Here's what BHPian condor had to say on the matter:

While there is no mention of the city/location where this happened:

This car has crossed the pedestrian crossing, and is a violation, even if the category of violation may not be correct.

The fine amount does look high.

About 2 years back, on Kanakapura Road in Bangalore, I wanted to turn right but since there were cars ahead of me waiting to turn right, I stopped. What happened was - I am right on the lines marking the crossing. The lights changed, I had to wait there - along with couple of other cars to my left. Result ? A fine of 1000/-.

What makes things crazy there: The pedestrian crossing lines end right at the pillar - not going through to the other side of the road. Pretty much like the silver car there, but 3 feet further. I did have a thought to go straight, since the straight was a green. Instead to chose to wait and ended up with a fine.

Here's what BHPian SS-Traveller had to say on the matter:

Every intersection controlled by traffic lights is actually deemed to be a 'yellow box junction', and violation of the same will result in fines. Once drivers understand the concept of such box junctions, they would be less likely to get penalized. OTOH, you can see at the link above that British drivers too are cribbing about the unfairness of fines related to box junction violations.

Here's what BHPian pepega had to say on the matter:

At such intersections where I am stopped at the red light or passing on green but the light turns, I usually press the emergency recording button on my dash cam.

I have heard that there is a way to dispute the fines by emailing them dash cam footage of you being stopped whereas their record might say that you've crossed based on a still image, or where you passed on green but their record says you passed on red.

If we don't actively dispute these fines, we'll all get needlessly fined out of thousands of rupees every year. Especially since a lot of these cameras are at "trap" junctions. A lot of the speedcams are also in similar spots, where the speed suddenly goes down from 80 to 50 right where a camera is, with little warning or even a bush covering the official speed limit sign. Well, that's a discussion for the "Are indian roads poorly designed?" thread.

I think they're designed quite well, if the intent is to create revenue for traffic departments. The more ambiguity in road design and rules, the higher chances of someone getting fined arbitrarily, and that's where the system profits from road drivers. Traffic police tax is an additional tax that we pay along with GST, Cess, Road Tax and Tolls. Unspoken cost of driving a car in India.

Here's what BHPian HTC had to say on the matter:

I feel that the exorbitant amount for traffic fines is only serving two purposes. Firstly filling government coffers. They have to give freebies to their vote bank people which they promised during election (a.k.a 'bhagyas' in Kannada). Secondly, it increased the minimum bribe amount. before people used to give 50rs or 100rs bribe and escape. But now, stakes are high. minimum files are around 1000rs and cops will not accept anything below 500rs. All this applicable to well dressed, office going common man. Same cops will turn a blind eye towards traffic violations by lower income group citizens (eg mechs,labourers etc) as they are sure they will not be able to extract money from them and waste their valuable time to serve the country ahem .

Ideally, high fines should serve as deterrants. But what can you do when the infrastructure, technology and the people are not prepared to implement the laws. I have seen traffic cops violating rules blatently. not wearing proper helmet, not wearing helmet properly, using one way to avoid round abouts ( example - at audugodi police quarters gate just before forum signal) and many more. Now where doesn't the law apply to them. Even more, I have seen cars parked at no parking zone even blocking and choking the junction near Jayangar 4th block police station. Looks like some kind of understanding between the cops and hotels around that traffic cops can't notice the violations right outside their station gates. The list goes on.

The free left turn rule is so pathetic. As per them, at only those signals having board saying free-left-turn, one is allowed to take free left turn. But they have not put such boards where all its applicable. also, to add to the confusion, they have boards like 'no-free-left-turn' at select few signals. its all left to their interpretation to put fine or collect bribe. Even the traffic signals do not work as intended. from green, they turn to red directly. It is difficult to take split second decision as to stop or continue as there will be vehicle tailing you.

To add to this, they are installing high quality cameras which will put fine 24/7. there are two such signals on double road between lalbag gate and jayanagr metro station. Even though I had stopped little close but well behing the stop line at that signal, a cop on a two wheeler asked me to move a little back as the camera would still consider me as stading on the stop line due to the angle of camera which is positioned from behind.

In a nut shell, I am all for strict rules provided they are implemented uniformly and after thinking through the realistic scenarios. till then - its clearly a money making tool for men in power. I rest my case

Read BHPian comments for more insights and information.