Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP Worldwide > The International Automotive Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 15th August 2007, 10:29   #16
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 680
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
Resale value is just a measure of how well has a company been able to market its image. Nothin else. All the companies today have equivalent quality control standards.
So what you are saying is that if the Big Three manage to steal Honda/Toyota marketing heads, their cars would be magically become number one selling cars with very high reliability ratings?

Quote:
The magic is lots of marketing. Whereever you see a bmw/Mercedes poster or media ad, there will be a Lexus ad.
Again, are you saying that if there is a Buick poster right next to an S class poster, Buick can eat into S market?

Interesting theory I must say.
Mayavi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 10:40   #17
Team-BHP Support
 
theMAG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 7,033
Thanked: 1,470 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ananthkamath View Post
This is all bullcrap. CSI doesnt mean a tiny damn thing. Word on the street is, simply, if you want a car that is almost GUARANTEED to run 200,000 miles right out of the box, buy Toyota/Honda. Not Buick or Chevy or Ford.
I agree. I wouldnt be surprised to learn that the US auto majors would have funded that University of Michigan study
theMAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 13:05   #18
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayavi View Post
So what you are saying is that if the Big Three manage to steal Honda/Toyota marketing heads, their cars would be magically become number one selling cars with very high reliability ratings?



Again, are you saying that if there is a Buick poster right next to an S class poster, Buick can eat into S market?

Interesting theory I must say.

yes, that's what I meant. You should read what Renault's Carlos did to Nissan.

And yes Buick can eat into S market but then the cars should be in competition. A m800 cannot be pipped against a Chevy Sr-V and expected to succeed.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 15:12   #19
Senior - BHPian
 
rahul_intlad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pune
Posts: 1,577
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

Just picked this up:
After consultation with JD Power,Toyota attributes most of the customer dissatisfaction to unwanted noise inside the car,now every car that rolls of the production line would have specially trained personnel to rigourously test for rattles and squeaks.

Last edited by rahul_intlad : 15th August 2007 at 15:15.
rahul_intlad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 19:39   #20
Senior - BHPian
 
ananthkamath's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 1,194
Thanked: 46 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
Toyota makes commuter vehicles and not cars. Both are different concepts.
This is where I begin to disagree. Would you classify the Celica, MR2 Spyder, and most of the Lexus as commuter vehicles. If you do, then you are extremely biased.


Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
The magic is lots of marketing. Whereever you see a bmw/Mercedes poster or media ad, there will be a Lexus ad.
Whats wrong in that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
I aint a fan of big three, mind you. But I aint a supporter of the Japanese marketing gimmics also.
Tell me this is a joke. You say all these things about Toyota and then proceed to make this statement? What marketing gimmics are you talking about that no one else in the industry is practising? Obviously you dont know more than skin-deep about the north american automotive industry.
ananthkamath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 19:56   #21
Senior - BHPian
 
1100D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Calcutta
Posts: 4,179
Thanked: 2,358 Times
Default

It was very surprising and coincidental that when Toyota/Lexus/Honda was climbing up (early mid 90's), the previous Quality/Reliability benchmarks were on their way down. What Toyota/Honda did was to learn from the stalwarts in their own domain/geography and apply their own manufacturing practices. However this learning process was also involved in a lot of debatable controversies.

Now there is a consortium of manufacturers, mainly GM Daimler Chrysler BMW that are taking things differently. Probably in a few years from now we will get back to having cars expensive again.
1100D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 21:31   #22
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 680
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
yes, that's what I meant. You should read what Renault's Carlos did to Nissan.

And yes Buick can eat into S market but then the cars should be in competition. A m800 cannot be pipped against a Chevy Sr-V and expected to succeed.
So what is your next car? Buick or Oldsmobile*?


*Are they even making them?
Mayavi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 21:43   #23
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayavi View Post
So what is your next car? Buick or Oldsmobile*?


*Are they even making them?
Have you ever heard of lincoln MKX and Caddy's?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ananthkamath View Post
Tell me this is a joke. You say all these things about Toyota and then proceed to make this statement? What marketing gimmics are you talking about that no one else in the industry is practising? Obviously you dont know more than skin-deep about the north american automotive industry.

Toyota doesnt make up the Japanese car market. Does it? There's Nissan, there's mazda, there's Honda and many more.

And obviously You are walking on water when it comes to information American Automobile industry. Whatever info you hold, dont try to shove it on people. There are toyota jobs available at showrooms.


Not liking toyota is a personal preference of mine which only strengthened with their uninteresting cars (minus the FJ cruiser) and I would love to see you give all this info to my friend who has had 3 accidents in 2 corollas.(I had to mention it again.)


and lets keep the grudges outside the forums.

Last edited by devarshi84 : 15th August 2007 at 21:44.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 21:54   #24
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 680
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
Have you ever heard of lincoln MKX and Caddy's?
Yes, what about them?
Mayavi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:01   #25
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 680
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
Not liking toyota is a personal preference of mine which only strengthened with their uninteresting cars (minus the FJ cruiser) and I would love to see you give all this info to my friend who has had 3 accidents in 2 corollas.(I had to mention it again.)
Not liking Toyota or any other brand for that matter sure is your personal preference. One can understand if you do not like the designs, powerplant or the driving dynamics as they differ from person to person, but calling Toyota success a marketing gimmick is just bordering on foolishness.

Toyota copied American cars of the 60's, made small cars in the 70's, made them reliable in the 80's and won the American market by the 90's. They know what the market wants and they give it to them at an affordable price. Now it is the worlds largest car maker. This feat is not possible based on marketing strategy alone. Marketing can only do so much, you need to have a good product.

Now you keep mentioning your friends accidents in corollas but you never mentioned what kind of accidents they were. Did the accidents happen because the vehicle is at fault or because your friend doesn't know how to drive?
Mayavi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:18   #26
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 281 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BaCkSeAtDrIVeR View Post
Aaaaarrrrrgggghhhh!!!!!!
Suzuki is at the bottom of the table!!!!
It's very difficult to see a Suzuki car on the road in the USA.

Suzuki is known more as motorcycle company in the US, than
a car company.
carboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:21   #27
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 281 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayavi View Post
they give it to them at an affordable price.
Not in India. Toyota's are highly overpriced in India.
carboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:25   #28
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

mayavi, I aint calling toyota's success a marketing gimmick, I am attributing Toyota's success majorly to Their marketing department.

check out any newspapers until 2006 (I havent read em since then) and all have comparos of the big three among themselves only, while Toyota's were more targeted.

Until 90's toyota played catchup, now Big three are playing catch up. So what's wrong if big three improves their quality. Is that a crime? (Atleast that's the way American newspapers make it sound.)

And my friend wasnt driving, it was a chaffeur who also drives a baleno, Civic, Astra and mercedes benz E-class. None of the other cars have been through similar events.

I am entitled to my opinion and I wouldnt be wanting to strecth this discussion. Lets stick to the topic.

Last edited by devarshi84 : 15th August 2007 at 22:28.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:33   #29
Senior - BHPian
 
ananthkamath's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 1,194
Thanked: 46 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post

And obviously You are walking on water when it comes to information American Automobile industry. Whatever info you hold, dont try to shove it on people. There are toyota jobs available at showrooms.

Not liking toyota is a personal preference of mine which only strengthened with their uninteresting cars (minus the FJ cruiser) and I would love to see you give all this info to my friend who has had 3 accidents in 2 corollas.(I had to mention it again.)
And just as you have your personal preferences I have mine. And I have the right to express my opinion, whatever the hell that might be. I' m not out to please anyone here.

I'm really interested in knowing the reason for your friend's 3 accidents in 2 corollas now that you mentioned . The fact that you repeatedly mention this as a sort of justification of why you think Toyota makes crappy cars, but fail to tell the whole story, makes it all the more interesting.

Last edited by ananthkamath : 15th August 2007 at 22:34.
ananthkamath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th August 2007, 22:44   #30
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 680
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84 View Post
mayavi, I aint calling toyota's success a marketing gimmick, I am attributing Toyota's success majorly to Their marketing department.
My question is, do you have anything to back up your claim.
What is Toyota doing in the marketing space that the big three are not doing? Toyota and Honda's do not give the kind of deals that Ford, GM, Chrysler give. What marketing are you talking about? The consumer satisfaction index, which started this thread also talks about American consumers not being satisfied with their home grown cars.
And why just Toyota, Honda is also a preferred choice over american cars. Now Hyundai is gaining market share. How do you explain.

Quote:
Until 90's toyota played catchup, now Big three are playing catch up. So what's wrong if big three improves their quality. Is that a crime? (Atleast that's the way American newspapers make it sound.)
Nothing wrong if they really improve quality. But car sales and resale values would be the only indicator of that and not market studies that are based on a small sample.


Quote:
And my friend wasnt driving, it was a chaffeur who also drives a baleno, Civic, Astra and mercedes benz E-class. None of the other cars have been through similar events.

I am entitled to my opinion and I wouldnt be wanting to strecth this discussion. Lets stick to the topic.
Then your friend should get a better chauffer and you should stop blaming Corollas. If you think the accidents happened because of some design deficiencies, then I think it is fair game. Otherwise you shouldn't have mentioned the accidents in this thread. Accidents can happen to any car, not just a Toyota.
Mayavi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Redefining the meaning of customer satisfaction: Nanda Automobiles rockporiom Indian Car Dealerships 6 25th July 2014 02:06
Total Customer Satisfaction (TCS) Study - 2010 wildon The Indian Car Scene 12 1st March 2011 14:34
Top Gear - Customer Satisfaction Survey Shan2nu Shifting gears 26 19th February 2007 14:15
Total Customer Satisfaction (TCS) Study - 2006 msdivy The Indian Car Scene 8 8th November 2006 18:13


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 18:26.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks