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Old 11th November 2011, 12:59   #46
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

No offence but I really wouldn't call 80Kms/Hr an insane speed. It wouldn't be called a highway if people did any lesser I guess lol.

And its not about having blind faith in technology, its about knowing what your vehicle is capable of. A MUV is not a Sportscar. And I'm sure if we do have a high bhp vehicle, it is only human to push it hard sometimes right ?

And even though the car was equipped with ABS and airbags, you can't then forget the fact that it is bound to have down sized tyres for the Indian market and it isn't really a car that sparkles on safety standards or test. That makes a big difference.

Also this accident was no fault of the drivers, therefore unavoidable frankly. And it is technology because of which the people in the cabin were unharmed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JediKnight View Post
I am amazed how people have blind faith in safety tech and see technology as a license to drive at insane speed. If you would have noticed the vehicle involved in the accident was a Innova "V" variant which comes with airbags and ABS. In fact in this case the ABS would have helped the lady veer into the opposite lane. Technology helps no doubt bit but is no excuse for over speeding.

Resist the urge to rip your vehicle even if you see an empty road. Even though you may have ABS and great tyres.
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Old 11th November 2011, 13:01   #47
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And yeah if your car does stop quick enough don't forget that the idiot behind you is most likely to crash or fly over you (bikers). So take the Volvo next time or sit at home maybe. Lol.
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Old 11th November 2011, 16:19   #48
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Hi Tazmaan,
The Innova looks very badly damaged. Thank god all occupants were safe.
What is the next step? Would you be scrapping the car or getting it repaired? (needless to say, you would have a comprehensive insurance cover). Even after getting it repaired the performance may not be up to the mark. Have you given it any thought? Regards, Caddy.
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Old 11th November 2011, 16:25   #49
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Indian Higways are amongst the most dangerous in the world because the Drivers and pedestrians do not follow the rules of the road. At least we can request NHAI and local police to punish the offenders. Heavy Trucks and other commercial Vehicles ply at their own speed and sweet will accross all lanes, flouting the very basic rule of driving to give way on your right to faster vehicles. Tractors and other vehicles joining the Highway suddenly out of the blue is common practice.

Mera Bharat Mahan!
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Old 12th November 2011, 00:22   #50
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The most soothing thing was, looking at the intensity of the accident all the lives were saved! Even after all the topple, the interiors of the Innova seem so intact, really says a lot of things about the build quality and Big T safety and reliability. May be this answers why it does 4K + units a month.
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Old 12th November 2011, 11:23   #51
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Good to hear that everyone was safe. And no matter what everyone says, even my first reaction would be to save the kid - that is an immediate casualty. Everything else, whether you will end up in the other lane, hit another car etc etc is only a probability at that very moment. I think your aunt did the right thing.
One minor comment though, I dont like the 205/65 Goodyear GT3s that the car seems to be wearing. I would recommend an upgrade to 225/60 tyres - maybe in the yokohama or michelin variety. It would reduce the stopping distance and also swerve control, thereby reducing the need for emergency lane changes.
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Old 12th November 2011, 12:25   #52
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Quote:
Originally Posted by NST440 View Post

1. Seat belts are arms of God in a car,wear them always what so ever.

2. When a female is involved in an accident, people and authorities are less aggressive.

3. We can never comment on ''what else could have been done by the driver'' as its a matter of split second, those who've been through an accident know hard it is.

4. To come out clean from the aftermath & harassments of an accident, one has to have certain good contacts which i have seen in almost all accidents.

5.The Advertisement of Ceat Tires which says '' the streets are filled with idiots'' is just appropriate for driving conditions in our country .
You said it, these are the things I have learned too. Also note the airbags helped too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caddy View Post
Hi Tazmaan,
The Innova looks very badly damaged. Thank god all occupants were safe.
What is the next step? Would you be scrapping the car or getting it repaired? (needless to say, you would have a comprehensive insurance cover). Even after getting it repaired the performance may not be up to the mark. Have you given it any thought? Regards, Caddy.
I am not sure yet, but we wont be keeping the car. If insurance offers a total, I will accept it, else repair and sell.

Quote:
Originally Posted by man_and_machine View Post
The most soothing thing was, looking at the intensity of the accident all the lives were saved! Even after all the topple, the interiors of the Innova seem so intact, really says a lot of things about the build quality and Big T safety and reliability. May be this answers why it does 4K + units a month.
Yes I agree the doors really held well. Here are some other pics.
Attached Thumbnails
4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!-p1020438.jpg  

4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!-p1020453.jpg  


Last edited by tazmaan : 12th November 2011 at 12:27.
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Old 12th November 2011, 13:52   #53
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Hi
Scary experience and thank god everybody made it without a scratch. Once i was travelling on the ECR with my family in my Getz and to avoid a dog i acutely turned into the next lane and did not notice the biker who could not control and ran his bike into the sand, skidded and thankfully stopped. I stopped and got down to apologise and the biker starts yelling at me. Couple of his friends who were following him saw the whole episode and tried to pacify him. He composed himself after some time. His final words are "Kill the dog mate, i have a family to go to". Now i try to the best of my abilities not to cut into another lane without signalling. Hopefully i wont have a situation like that but got to be prepared for it. Now i have a few more pointers in what not to do when faced with such a situation. Cheers.

Last edited by drrajasaravanan : 12th November 2011 at 13:56.
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Old 14th November 2011, 18:10   #54
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tazmaan View Post
I have got my family to start wearing seat belts and the next step would be to start using the child seat. We have one but I have to go convincing around how important safety is.

@mayankjha1806 :- It hurts to see the car damaged but the car did what it was designed to do which is to keep the occupants safe. I am impressed with the Innova's safety or may be it was just pure luck.

This must be luck, nothing explains the accident. We must be thankful to the almighty! Has the insurance company picked up the case? Hope that you get a good compensation! Seat belts are also known as PRS while airbags as SRS. PRS is Primary Restraint System while SRS is Secondary Restraint System. If the seat belts are not being used, airbags become redundant, or in extremes, even hazardous. Please use seat belts.
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Old 14th November 2011, 19:47   #55
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

That everyone including the kid and people in the Wagon R are safe is what is makes everyone feel better. Just one wild thought, though I am a kind to driver who finds it difficult to steer when slamming hard on the brake (maybe I'll have to change it a bit when I have a car with ABS), is it not technologically possible that steering gets locked (if it is the right term) or becomes hard to steer when you slam hard on the brake? Something on the lines of brake booster that continues to brake the car even when you have removed your foot from the paddle under panic braking conditions. Any thoughts.

Last edited by anandjha : 14th November 2011 at 19:49.
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Old 14th November 2011, 20:25   #56
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tazmaan View Post
I am going to describe the incident in short. We as a family went on a road trip to Rajasthan. We were a total of 18 people and 4 cars. Cars included 2 Innovas, 1 Honda Accord and 1 Merc C class. This is not our first road trip we as family have done Leh one time, Manali 2 times, Bangalore 2 times, Otty , Badrinath, Goa many times, Delhi, Udaipur etc etc.

Dear fellow forum users,


First pl see P1020461.jpg (917.2 KB, 135 views)
Hope you have noticed that small sign in the corner of the picture that says PEDESTRIAN CROSSING.



Pity the road designers did not take the correct steps to make the size big enough to read AND put multiple warnings up to 250 meters ahead AND make it reflective AND ensure one street lamp, because headlights are useless due to multiple beams of light through the gaps in the greenery on the median. This has taken place in daylight, could happen in the nighttime.



SECOND



It was suggested, early on, that safety is an issue on Indian roads, and that we must have driving lessons for highway driving. For example, the single or double lane change is a standard safety test even in India by almost all OEMs in India. Dos and Don'ts may be explained but must not be discussed like this forum does, where everybody has an opinion, but may wiser counsel prevail and respect the available experts, or invite more experienced experts from other countries, if they feel it is better. Just don't blame the lack of local talent, like the F1 driver story, and the consequent issues when foreigners may misguide as they are not aware of Indian conditions.




The worst thing is that most drivers don't know much about car, or truck control and as we are on the road with them, our lives are at risk due to their ignorance, for which we can't blame anyone but ourselves.



THIRD


These types of incidents are very common, with at least one to three in every trip of 150 to 400 km, and will repeat again and again. Some persons will not be lucky and will be injured mildly or seriously or be crippled for life even die, God forbid. There may be government systems to review accidents but they are crippled, as they are mostly political appointees, and encumbered with loads of political baggage.



While we can review about the good and bad car design and other features, 50% of the time is better spent taking on the Government bureaucracy and road design inadequacies, and make teams to work on each issue listed by Nordic, EU, Australian, Canadian road design standards that are available on the net. This must be reviewed by an expert engineering panel selected by sheer experience and engineering skills, and presented to the 'TEAM-BHP BOARD'.


The TEAM-BHP board members may be selected auto enthusiasts, with strong connections, and will be a shadow Government tracking all safety and traffic related issues. We don't have to become a TEAM ANNA, but an NGO for road safety and traffic.



Finally, if we can pull this off, we have not only done the country proud by better road systems, but also lay a better foundation for its citizens.


Roads and mobile communications are the lifeline for any country.
Let us do our bit.


ACTION Please.

Last edited by mobike008 : 10th January 2012 at 13:02. Reason: Please DO NOT quote large text, videos and pictures as it inconveniences our mobile users. Thanks!
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Old 14th November 2011, 23:00   #57
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Thats an unfortunate accident! Lucky, no one was harmed much. A couple of things I have:

1. Safety first - seat belts all the time, child seats for the kids, responsible driving, etc. For people who think that under the speed limit, for the passengers that the law doesn't enforce, it is not required to wear seatbelts, take them in your car without seat belt and while driving at less than 20 kmph, apply the brakes suddenly and see what happens. I am sure they will start wearing seatbelts from then on. Disclaimer: This experiment could be dangerous - I only meant that even at 20 kmph it is not safe without the seat belts!

2. In India, I seriously think that it is NOT safe (to the driver, passenger and others on the road) to drive at any speed, however slow, in any car, however "safe" it is. No offence meant, but its sad that we, most of the time, fail to see the actual culprit in most of the unfortunate accidents that we see - which is the government. I mean, how tough is it really to provide proper, safe, durable infrastructure? Including passages for people to cross highways, safe to drive highways, etc? Sad that in spite of taxing the common man to the core, the governments are failing to provide the very basic infrastructure! Please refer to http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-analysis.html (Fuel Pricing in India. Detailed Robbery Analysis.) to get a vague idea on how much the Government is earning from fuel alone, a significant amount of which should ideally go to proper infrastructure development! Its not that infrastructure is not developing, but its just not at a pace that it should have happened (with a layman's point of view, of course) and its just not happening properly, in a well thought out manner.

3. Driving experience, IMHO, is the ability to predict what is generally not possible and being able to calculate those millions of possibilities of an accident occurring and act accordingly. For that, the level of concentration a driver requires while driving in India is immense. How long can one concentrate for that long? Even if you stop taking your car out everytime, what about the other vehicle that takes you to places?

4. We are adding approximately 2 lakh private passenger four wheelers (only that the team-bhp monthly sales threads list - excluding other vehicles like buses, trucks, auto rickshaws, two wheelers etc) every year to the 4 plus lakh kilometer (in lanes, a km of 4 lane express way is considered to be 4 kms) of highways (including state, national and express ways). Think of the traffic situations we may have to handle a couple of more years down the lane with all this infrastructure issues, lack of discipline and all?!!

My two cents...

Last edited by devansn : 14th November 2011 at 23:00. Reason: Added spaces for readability...
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Old 16th November 2011, 17:28   #58
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Default Re: 4 cars went on a road trip only 3 returned!

Can anyone suggests what to do, if anyone encounters such an unfortunate incident in an alien land? What are the "Dos and Don'ts" in such a situation? How about dealing with the legal formalities? How about the vehicle?
I know many of us go on long road trips and not all of them have connections / relatives for assistance. I will appreciate if anyone can give some guidelines.
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Old 16th November 2011, 20:27   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekiny2k View Post
Sorry to sound mechanical but it's not worth risking many lives for the sake of one. Apply full brakes, sound horn, but swerving is not what I would recommend in such a situation.

The agony of he wagon R driver alone is enough to rationalize the thought here.
I completely agree with vivekiny2k. Its better to hit the brakes with your full might than to swerve to the sides. What if the Innova had hit multiple vehicles/people on the way to the pit? By God's grace, your aunt was very lucky. Glad to hear everyone escaped with minor injuries.
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Old 16th November 2011, 23:39   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by su48 View Post
I completely agree with vivekiny2k. Its better to hit the brakes with your full might than to swerve to the sides. What if the Innova had hit multiple vehicles/people on the way to the pit? By God's grace, your aunt was very lucky. Glad to hear everyone escaped with minor injuries.
May we request a read please



"SECOND

It was suggested, early on, that safety is an issue on Indian roads, and that we must have driving lessons for highway driving. For example, the single or double lane change is a standard safety test even in India by almost all OEMs in India. Dos and Don'ts may be explained but must not be discussed like this forum does, where everybody has an opinion, but may wiser counsel prevail and respect the available experts, or invite more experienced experts from other countries, if they feel it is better."


Will explain once, am sure there will be comments which will be replied to if value addition is there.



Braking distance is normally too long to stop before hitting the object we are trying to avoid. So the technical advice is brake to slow and turn before the object and turn back into your lane to avoid hitting more objects. This is called a double lane change. ABS helps to brake AND steer.


Good drivers need exposure to accident avoidance manoeuvre training and even opposite lock steering, to survive near misses that occur every few months. 30 years of normal driving experience cannot manage this without some practice.


Everyone must know his/her limits and car's limits. This is also rare as no one may risk the possible damage during trials, and the severe tyre wear that happens at limit driving.
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