Hyundai Tucson Vs Ford Endeavour Vs Tata Safari 2.2 a performance comparo

[rippergeo]

Mods- I know this thread is long, but its a 3 car comparo- please dont penalise me,this review took 1hr to type


Before all the brick bats land, yes ,yes I know the safari is an underdog.
But I'm looking for a diesel SUV and I TDed everything I got my hands on
so the safari will look like a punching bag, sorry about that.

Will TD the mitsubishi Pajero on monday and add it to the thread, or probably put up a new thread.

mHawk is not available in cochin, so mahindra fans will have to wait.
Am still trying to track down a Nissan X trail for a TD.
Remember, this is a Diesel softroader comparo. we're not discussing VFM here

Lets get to business

Looks
in order of MY preference
Endeavor>Tuscon>Safari
road presence of the Ford is unbeatable.the safari comes a close second, tuscon comes an overall second for me in looks , but lacks road presence. this section is subjective so I'll leave it at that

Build/Fit and finish
Endeavour>Tuscon>Safari
the endeavor is definitely better built, and feels sturdier
Hyundai comes a close second in fit and finish. It does feel sturdy, but the sheet metal is not as thick as the safari or the endeavour(false sense of security) also the lighter sheet metal will turn out to be an advantage later on, wait and see.
The safari does suffer from panel gaps, but they are nowhere as bad as what it used to be a few years ago

Interiors
Tuscon>Endeavour>Safari
this is again controversial and I dont like reviewing interiors, cos its boring. Forgive me.

Engine
Tuscon>>>>Endeavour>>Safari

the safari was a bit of a let down after all the nice things I'd heard about it here on the forum. It is not slow, but I was expecting a rocket after all the reviews. The engine had run 2700km, so it was broken in. It was'nt happy being revved and the power/ torque spread was quite narrow-1200rpm or so.But its not going to let you down during an overtaking maneuver

Endeavour was a surprise- i was expecting it to be the slowest of the lot, but it can move if pushed and the best part is that the TDCI is willing and tolerates a heavy right foot better

Tuscon- This engine develops the least HP here 110 or so compared to the other 2 behemoths at 140bhp, but this engine is brilliant. There is no turbo lag, the car is a rocket,and it pulls happily from idle at 1000rpm all the way to 3000rpm, by which time you're doing insane speeds in this 1.7 ton vehicle. Tuscon wins hands down

Lesson learnt- bigger muscles dont mean anything if you dont watch your weight.

NVH
Endeavour=Safari>>Tuscon
Safari should win here cos it costs only half the other two. Both engines are silent during normal running, but when the engines are pushed, thats when the safari loses, the engine sounds strained and harsh and the noise intrudes into the cabin, its not loud, but it is unpleasant, and feels like your going to break it.

Endeavour's engine is the most refined here, and the car insulates its occupants well from the mechanicals.

Tuscon's CRDI engine,is showing its age, the clatter is evident. so even though it was revolutionary when it came out, it is outclassed by the other 2 when it comes to engine noise.
Vibration is not a problem in any of the vehicles.
BTW- like the engine noise in the Hyundai- call me biased.

Gearbox
Tuzy=Endy>>>>>>>safari
the endy and tuzy both have good gear shifts.but the hyundai inches ahead cos of the shorter throws between shifts.
The safari's gear box is rather pathetic,you dont have to hunt for the gears,but the amount of play in the gear lever rivals that of my old MM540.

Handling
Tuscon>>>>>Endeavour=Safari

This Hyundai blows me away. I had given up hope of ever driving a hyundai that handles well,TILL i drove the tuzy. This softroader is a better handler than most sedans and hatchbacks that I've used. body roll is minimal and the car eggs you on in the corners. this car will be a hoot in the ghats.

The endeavour and the safari are both pretty poor in the handling dept. endeavour edges past the safari because the body roll even though significant, is nowhere as scary as the Dicor2.2

The tata's body roll reminds me of those toy clowns you get in a
jack-in-the-box. After a direction change, the body rolls first in the opposite diection of the turn(which is what you expect in any car) and then...rolls back the other way and then..rolls back in the initial direction..and then..ok,I guess you get the picture.
It will not let you drive fast on the twisties,unless you are borderline retarded or completely insane.

Handling off road
Endeavour>>Tuscon>>safari
the endeavour is pretty good off road, and keeps pointing where you tell it to with the steering even when the road is very rough. the hyundai is very happy on irregular surfaces, but it will flounder if you meet large ruts/craters
The safari is completely lost on all surfaces.

Steering
Tuscon>>Endeavour>Safari
tuscon is the more accomplished soft roader and thats evident on road.
The steering on the tuzy is heavier than the other two by a significant margin but the feedback available is also significantly better

Steering off road
Endeavour>>tuscon>>>safari
I dont know how ford manged this, but the steering did feel nicer on gravel
than the tuscon. the offroad excursions are easier on the ford because the steering does not kick when you drop the front whels into a rut. on the other hand, the safari's steering wheel kicks like a mule, and you would do well to keep your thumbs out of the way(opposable thumbs are an important evolutionary advantage to us humans)

Suspension/ride
Safari>>Endeavour>>Tuscon
here the safari gets its own back on the other two bullies, especially on the tuscon, whose ride is firm, but not uncomfortable.
The safari feels like a magic carpet compared to the other 2 whose suspensions do not seem to travel as much.
The endy's ride was good I thought, even though most people have complained a lot about it.
even off road, the safari carried its rear passengers the best compared to the other 2.
The safari pays the price for keeping its occupants comfortable. i guess we should give it some leeway when it comes to handling.

Transmission
Endy>Safari>>tuzy
all 3 let you select 4 wheel drive
the hyundai comes with traction control that can be switched off(rubbing hands in glee) and a 4 wheel drive auto that cuts in when the main drive starts losing traction(never got the chance to see it in action)
The endy and tuzy both have differential locks. not sure about the safari
Sore point with the tuzy? It runs as a front wheel drive during normal duties,so no tail out antics. boohoo

the endy will slide around nicely if floored in 1st gear from a standstill or on a corner in a gravel track.
I do like RWD cars!! just that we dont get any these days that are affordable(dont say Amby!)

Visibility/seating position
Safari>>>>>Tuzy>>>Endy
I'm not very tall-5'4(stop sniggering) so this is important,
the safari will be way easier in traffic than the other two cos you can see allround and the corners of the bonnet very well. tuscon is not bad in traffic cos its not as wide as the other two. Visibility in the endy is a joke, and this post is already a mile long. so I wont go there.


Accesories-
not something I like reviewing, because I feel they add little to any car
I hope some one else will do that job for me on this thread. Sorry guys
But I should mention- the top end safari comes loaded to the gills with gadgets.

Miscelaneous rants-
The endy's turning radius is useless. buy your own football fields at evry place you might need to make a U turn.

The endy has this funnily placed hand brake lever which will be a pain to use when poised on an incline. Hate it.


The Tata Safari Dicor 2.2 is definitely VFM if you want it for bad roads and the straight highway.and anyway its half the price of the other 2 so u could go buy yourself a gypsy with the money thats left over

The Hyundai Tuscon CRDI is brilliant for the segment its in, I wonder why it doesnt sell like the endy. Please let me know guys cos, I'm going to buy it.

The Ford Endeavour TDCi is quite nice, and would have picked it over the tuscon if only the handling was better.

Overall- Tuscon-for the brilliant engine and razor sharp handling.
It looks like I'm going to be buying the Tuzy, but will wait for the Chevrolet captiva in Jan 08,and If I can get an Nissan Xtrail in kerala with a guarantee of good After SS, then I will buy it without a TD.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

WOW! Nice write-up!

Excellent thread and nice decision. However, the Tucson may be on its way out soon!

Originally Posted by rippergeo

The Hyundai Tuscon CRDI is brilliant for the segment its in, I wonder why it doesnt sell like the endy. Please let me know guys cos, I'm going to buy it.

'Hyundai' badge?

[Elito11]

From what i have read Tuscon is really capable performer. It also looks ripper in black!

There is one regularly parked near my office. All black..looks awesome!

Elito

[abbey4u]

A great Review and everything is very much true about all the three vehicles.

The Hyundai Tuscon CRDI is brilliant for the segment its in, I wonder why it doesnt sell like the endy. Please let me know guys cos, I'm going to buy it.

COZ of the pricing. ONe would always ready to pay 1 Crore for BMW or Porche brand but not more than 10-12 Lac for an Hyundai or Maruti..

[hondadude]

Good report rippergeo.

Originally Posted by rippergeo

Remember, this is a Diesel softroader comparo. we're not discussing VFM here

Do you believe Endeavour, Safari and Pajero to be Diesel Soft-roaders ?

The Hyundai Tuscon CRDI is brilliant for the segment its in, I wonder why it doesnt sell like the endy. Please let me know guys cos, I'm going to buy it.

Several reasons

- It does everything well but doesn't stand out in any one area. In your own comparison, the only place where you rated Tucson ahead of Endy is Engine, Interior and Handling. CRV is much better in all three areas. That implies if you throw CRV in this mix, Tucson won't be first in any area.

- People who have the money for Tucson usually spend a couple of lakhs more and buy either a Pajero or a CRV.

Also as far as Endy is concerned, get someone to sit on middle row and drive on a couple of speed breakers or bad roads and lets see if anyone would like to sit there.

You will find the Pajero brilliant if you can tolerate its interiors and its weird two seater middle row.

[speedzak]

:
Nicely written! A very good TD report.

I would like to differ from some of your points. Sorry!
Tucson is a soft roader for sure. Safari and the Endeavour are not. They are true offroad bullies. I'm really surprised to see Tucson above Safari in your driving impression. Especially in the offroad section.
A good offroader will be bad in handling. This is a fact thru out the world. Even the landcruisers handle badly when compared to a CRV. So, it matters what a customer is looking at. If it's a vehicle with SUV looks and some offroad capability is what one needs, then it's better to stick to that lot of softies. The real ones do not come into picture. They cater to a different clientele.
I would definitely say Safari is a better package overall. Why? It has all the good offroad capabilities, it has a good diesel mill, tested and tried, space, comfort and the best VFM of the lot. There may be a lot of glitches when compared to others. But the price and virtues make up for it.

Endeavour is a truck. Yes it is! As pointed out earlier, the rear seat occupants suffer a lot. The rear most seats are not even worth talking of. So, even after being a big vehicle, the space utilisation is very poor. And ride comfort is up for a toss! It's price point, makes it worst too. With so much of it's asking price, we expect some kind of respect given to it's occupants. Sadly, it fails.

Why don't we see a lot of Tucsons on the road? It's a good question. You will be able to answer it in a few months.
Tucson is placed in a very abnormal position in India. It's priced close to CRV, GV and Endeavour. Not many will sacrifice the badges in those vehicles for a Hyundai in that price range. And being a diesel is not of much benefit too. We had a Terracan some while ago. Even that couldn't kindle hearts of people with it's size and one of the reasons was the wrong H badge. Only if it had to be a Honda or so!

If it was me, the choice would be between 2 vehicles only. Safari and Mitsubishi Pajero! Softies, Please make way.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by hondadude

CRV is much better in all three areas. That implies if you throw CRV in this mix, Tucson won't be first in any area.

CR-V does not have a diesel option though!

[rippergeo]

Originally Posted by speedzak

:
Nicely written! A very good TD report.

I would like to differ from some of your points. Sorry!

Zak! you are entitled to your opinion and i welcome criticism, makes me write better next time. so dont apologise!
Tucson is a soft roader for sure. Safari and the Endeavour are not. They are true offroad bullies. I'm really surprised to see Tucson above Safari in your driving impression. Especially in the offroad section.
In hindsight, it was a mistake to call the endy a softroader, I have no hesitation to call it a true offroader(not as capable as the pajero, but definitely can handle climbs with its 4wd and torquey engine)

The safari is a softroader, no doubt.It was built to carry people in comfort and it does that job brilliantly. better than the other two(infact better than most cars I've driven) even over extremely rough terrain
BUT
the GC is only 180mm and the soft suspension bottoms out in deep ruts. scraping the underbody is also frequent.I had to baby it on the trail, while the endeavour sailed through and the tuscon did to a lesser extent

A good offroader will be bad in handling. This is a fact thru out the world. Even the landcruisers handle badly when compared to a CRV. So, it matters what a customer is looking at. If it's a vehicle with SUV looks and some offroad capability is what one needs, then it's better to stick to that lot of softies. The real ones do not come into picture. They cater to a different clientele.

I agree with that,its impossible to find an offroader that handles well. the sad part is, the safari handles poorly(like an offroader) and cant deal with the rough either(like a soft roader)

I would definitely say Safari is a better package overall.
I agree the safari is a better package overall It is definitely value for money.the reasons you've listed below already, (I deleted the offroad capabilities bit that you typed). I'm sure most other offroad enthusiasts will agree with me.

Why? it has a good diesel mill, tested and tried, space, comfort and the best VFM of the lot. There may be a lot of glitches when compared to others. But the price and virtues make up for it.
I agree to the above, and if my budget was limited, I would have picked the safari straight away.

Endeavour is a truck. Yes it is! As pointed out earlier, the rear seat occupants suffer a lot. The rear most seats are not even worth talking of. So, even after being a big vehicle, the space utilisation is very poor. And ride comfort is up for a toss! It's price point, makes it worst too. With so much of it's asking price, we expect some kind of respect given to it's occupants. Sadly, it fails.
Very true

Why don't we see a lot of Tucsons on the road? It's a good question. You will be able to answer it in a few months.

Now that rolling smiley is scaring me. please elaborate zak, I need to know before I plonk 20 lacs down for it.

Tucson is placed in a very abnormal position in India. It's priced close to CRV, GV and Endeavour. Not many will sacrifice the badges in those vehicles for a Hyundai in that price range. And being a diesel is not of much benefit too. We had a Terracan some while ago. Even that couldn't kindle hearts of people with it's size and one of the reasons was the wrong H badge. Only if it had to be a Honda or so!
I used to sneer at hyundais too.but I'm a convert now. and anyway, the badge doesnt matter. I'm looking for the best softroader in diesel, and this seems to be it. have to TD the Nissan X-trail first though

another thing,I want to buy the car cos I like it. doesnt really matter if it doesnt look as good as the others. If it satisfies me, snob value be damned.

If it was me, the choice would be between 2 vehicles only. Safari and Mitsubishi Pajero! Softies, Please make way.

Zak sir! we will have to agree to disagree, the safari is a softie.
My replies are in bold above.
maybe we should have a poll on this. Safari-A softroader or not

anyway this comparison was thoroughly unfair to the safari as i said in the beginning, It is punching way above its weight class but still acquits itself well.
It is a nice car, but its not what I'm looking for

[rippergeo]

Originally Posted by hondadude

Good report rippergeo.



Do you believe Endeavour, Safari and Pajero to be Diesel Soft-roaders ?

I take back what i said about the endy ,its not a softroader.
the tuzy and safari however are both soft roaders
Several reasons

- It does everything well but doesn't stand out in any one area. In your own comparison, the only place where you rated Tucson ahead of Endy is Engine, Interior and Handling.
BUT- the engine and handling are the most important things to me and the tuscon wins by a huge margin.That car is a rocket! and it handles like no SUV I've tried before(have not tried the CRV-I admit)

CRV is much better in all three areas. That implies if you throw CRV in this mix, Tucson won't be first in any area.
True- but i want diesel! Honda please give us diesel!

- People who have the money for Tucson usually spend a couple of lakhs more and buy either a Pajero or a CRV.
The pajero is nice, but it is sluggish compared to the tuscon and will find overtaking on the highways painful(which is where its going to be driven most of the time)

Also as far as Endy is concerned, get someone to sit on middle row and drive on a couple of speed breakers or bad roads and lets see if anyone would like to sit there.

You will find the Pajero brilliant if you can tolerate its interiors and its weird two seater middle row.

actually i like the pajero a lot, even the old fashioned interiors, it gives it a strange kind of charm
Anyway, will TD it on monday and then decide

[hondadude]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

CR-V does not have a diesel option though!

True but a lot of those who pay 20L does not necessarily care about diesel or Petrol. The sales number of CRV indicate that.

[rippergeo]

Originally Posted by hondadude

True but a lot of those who pay 20L does not necessarily care about diesel or Petrol. The sales number of CRV indicate that.

not true, I hate paying for petrol and worrying about the next price hike. in real life when you have a diesel and a petrol car in the same family, the diesel ends up doing all the running around. but hey, maybe thats just me

[hondadude]

rippergeo,

I have a basic question. From your responses you seem to desire excellent handling, want to rip on twisties etc. Do you really need an SUV ?

[BUSA]

True but a lot of those who pay 20L does not necessarily care about diesel or Petrol. The sales number of CRV indicate that.

If the CRV was selling in diesel it would sell double of what it is now. And its not that diesel is cheaper and gives more FE, the driveability of diesels is fantastic. I would never want to buy a Petrol car, diesel is the way ahead. Even if i buy a 7 series BMW, i would opt for a diesel option with less features but better driveability, more torque, good FE. Its like having your cake and eating it too.

[rippergeo]

Originally Posted by hondadude

rippergeo,

I have a basic question. From your responses you seem to desire excellent handling, want to rip on twisties etc. Do you really need an SUV ?

I'm surprised that you asked that question.Very perceptive of you. Its true, I want every car of mine to accelerate well and should handle well. its essential. the only reason I'm looking at an SUV is that we've already got a hatch and a sedan in the family, wouldnt make sense to get another one of those.

so, basically, I want a diesel soft-roader which handles well and can leave traffic behind if its irritating me- answer seems to be tuscon

top speed is not important. I rarely go above 100. but till i reach 100 its always pedal to the metal.

also- something I forgot to mention- braking- the tuscon thrashes the pants off the other two

[speedzak]

Shove in another 10 and buy the Montero. You'll be over the heaven. And will be able to plunge the earth too.