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Old 18th September 2009, 13:06   #1
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Post Continental Tyres for my Wagon-R. Upgraded

As I wanted to go to some long trips in this monsoon, I planned to check my stock tyres to the near tyre shop (XL tyre point, Anna nagar). Let me tell about my stock tyres, the DOT is 04/04 the same manufacture date of my car registered and the profile was 145/70/R13. Those stock tyres are ran around only 32K at the time of my purchase, and it is completed now to 36K. The treads are still looks good, it might run 2-3K for sure (consulted with MSM guys).

But from the time of purchase this car, I was in my mind to go for Tubeless tyres only safety purpose. I wait for things to come. There was no puncture at all during my 5k running period with those tyres. But I have planned to go for some long trips for next 2 months I decided to go for tyre change.

I was reading lot of reviews and search each every forums (did thorough search on T-bhp), finally concluded with the Michelins. I went to the tyre shop, that guy checked my tyres and he said if you drive this car only within city you use the same stock tyres for next 3K running period. But if you go on highways or long trips better go for tubeless tyres. After that he asked me to come to his desk and he took one paper to started explaining about tyres. I was really wondered. I learnt lot of things from him. I told him for upsize I ideally wants to go for Michelin XM1+ 155/65/R13 only. He said “ok, Are you aware of silica?” I said “yes, am aware of that, Michelin tyres holds silica compounds.” Then he replied, “Michelin Energy series only contains Silica compounds and not XM1+s”. He continued like, “ there are two set of tyres, which are hard compounds and soft compounds. Michelin, Yokama and continental are soft compound tyres also they are imported.

Then he explained about the silica presents in those tyres. Michelin has 15%,Yokoma 25% and continental has more than 35% silica compounds with them. Also he told me Michelins are really good on the Energy series , if you have R14 size, then I will suggest only Michelin. But R13 profile I advise you to go for Continental tyres. I wondered, actually I was in mind only for Michelins. He said, I will assure you Continental is pretty doing well than Michelin both wet and dry traction. He continued like, Conti tyres are the stock tyres for the German cars and they are imported here as it is designed for German cars, no specific modifications for Indian roads unlike Michelin XM1. Also, they offer better ride quality, less road noise and excellent grip for sure. Also it costs less than Michelin. I really wondered and I don’t have any option to discuss about this to anyone. I was waiting for T-Bhp approval that time. Then I came back and did some research about continental tyres. All the reviews suggested that they are really doing well on par with Michelin. So, next day I went to that shop, I agreed to change my tyres. He quoted 10.3K inclusive of 4 tyres, wheel balancing, alignment and nitrogen as compliment. Also I got a wonderful lotto laptop backpack from Continental for free. During the change process, he told me continental tyres are having harder side wall for better life where as Michelins has softer sidewall which prone to sidewall cuts and all. Also conti tyres gives better life than Michelins. I asked him that I am very struggle with the low ground clearance of Wagon-R (165mm). Is it possible to increase any way?” He replied “ This tyre change should solve your problems , it increases the GC about to 8mm after this upsize. I wondered, how come it can be. He said, “wait, I will show you” and he take my spare tyre(stock one) and get the upsized conti tyre (ready to fit on my car) put stand to next each other. I was amazed, it really higher than the old stock tyres. I’ve really convinced after this live comparison.

Once, everything done, I started my car . WOW, What a dramatic change after the upgrade. I really wondered and never think this tyre upsize will change everything in my car ride quality. Road noise is absolutely silent and handling is amazing. My car was floating on the road. I drove my car on the potholes, it easily ignore them without even a difference on the ride. I really felt the difference after this upsize, I will post my travelogues soon after my long trips which starts tomorrow.

Friends kindly put your suggestions/comments on this post. This is my maiden post kindly ignore if it is too long and bored.

Continental Tyres for my Wagon-R. Upgraded-110920091118.jpg
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Old 18th September 2009, 15:34   #2
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First of all, congrats on the new tyres! They are extremely good and hopefully should not give you any reason for complaint.

Now, let's face facts.

You were lied to and totally brainwashed. The dealer spoke a lot of nonsense and unfortunately you fell for it.

XM1_ is part of the energy series. so, he saying XM1+ doesnt have silica is nonsense. XM1+ was among the first tyres in India to have such a high concentration of silica in them.

Also, he trying to say Michelin has only 10%, Yoko has 25% and Conti has 35% silica is utter nonsense. There are no such facts. Companies do not give out such figures. He just wanted to sell you Continental and he did using every unethical trick in the book.

Continental actually has a softer sidewall than XM1+. XM1+ has been in the market for a long time and has proven itself time and time again. The new batch of Continentals Eco Contact 3s are coming with reinforced sidewalls because they had a lot of problems initially.

We are in the tyre business and I've seen a few complaints with the CEC3.

If you got a tyre from the new batch, then awesome! Your tyre's sidewall is stronger than the old batch. What date of manufacture is your new Conti tyre? I will let you know if it is old stock or new stock.

Oh, another thing. You have gone for 155/70 R13. This is the wrong size for Wagon R. In all probability you will not have any problems, but Maruti might reject warranty claims saying you fitted a wrong tyre size. You trusted the wrong dealer if oyu ask me.

End result is this: The Contis are very good tyres. Continental have a very good name abroad. This is by no means a bad purchase. But you got tricked into it. In all probability, the dealer did not have Michelin and just wanted to sell you something he has.

Last edited by Nikhilb2008 : 18th September 2009 at 15:36.
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Old 18th September 2009, 16:22   #3
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Hi Nikhil,

I agree with you. But first of all, that dealer is MPP ( Michelin Priority Partner). And for R13 section, Michelin does not offer ENERGY series which is very well know. Only energy series contains Silica as per Michelin sources. And for 155/70/R13 size , even Michelin is also offering the same size and it will not harm the ride quality and performance in any aspects (got it from Car bible and ODO error is also little less). And for Continental tyres my friend also recently upgraded his Ford iKon with it, his praises them in all day. Moreover, Continental tyres are really doing good in R13 section (I recently read in T-Bhp CONTINENTAL tyres in india section). Also, Govt india asked the foreign tyre makers like Michelin,yoko and continental to import the tyres as much as possible with the six month of time, due to ban on imports. So, tyre dealers always holds a year back or less than that. And most importantly, continental tyres comes with warranty for 5 years from the date of purchase. I have heard very good feed back about the Conti EC3 tyres anyway. My tyre is DOT is less than 6 months old anyway.

Thanks a lot your valuable comments nikhil.
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Old 18th September 2009, 23:10   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebs View Post
... I told him for upsize I ideally wants to go for Michelin XM1+ 155/65/R13 only....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikhilb2008 View Post
...XM1_ is part of the energy series. so, he saying XM1+ doesnt have silica is nonsense. XM1+ was among the first tyres in India to have such a high concentration of silica in them....
Michelin's India site claims no XM1+ in 13" size, of course XM1 is available as always!
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Old 18th September 2009, 23:55   #5
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XL Tyre point is one of the real sad places in Chennai.

When I bought the ZXi, I went to them and asked how much they'd offer for the OEM alloys and tyres. And after thinking for sometime, he said 6k for 5 tyres and alloys. I promptly asked him "What are you smoking dude?"
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Old 19th September 2009, 00:50   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebs View Post
Hi Nikhil,

I agree with you. But first of all, that dealer is MPP ( Michelin Priority Partner). And for R13 section, Michelin does not offer ENERGY series which is very well know. Only energy series contains Silica as per Michelin sources. And for 155/70/R13 size , even Michelin is also offering the same size and it will not harm the ride quality and performance in any aspects (got it from Car bible and ODO error is also little less).

Thanks a lot your valuable comments nikhil.
Jebs, I'm sorry but you are grossly misinformed. We sell Michelin tyres EVERYDAY. Michelin do offer Energy series in 12" also. The XM1+ is actually the Energy XM1+. It is one and the same thing. XM1+ is part of Energy series. Energy series has a model which is marketed as XM1+. I hope I've been clear!

This means XM1+ has silica. Quite a bit in fact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebs
And for Continental tyres my friend also recently upgraded his Ford iKon with it, his praises them in all day. Moreover, Continental tyres are really doing good in R13 section (I recently read in T-Bhp CONTINENTAL tyres in india section). Also, Govt india asked the foreign tyre makers like Michelin,yoko and continental to import the tyres as much as possible with the six month of time, due to ban on imports. So, tyre dealers always holds a year back or less than that. And most importantly, continental tyres comes with warranty for 5 years from the date of purchase. I have heard very good feed back about the Conti EC3 tyres anyway. My tyre is DOT is less than 6 months old anyway.
Continental is doign well in 13" as 13" tyres are among the biggest sellers in the market. Not only Conti, but Michelin, Bridgestone, Apollo, MRF also are doing superbly in 13". It's simply because there is a huge demand for 13" tyres.

Anyway, about the importing part, it is b*ll****. Sorry to say. But no one follows stuff like this. In my experience Yokohama generally have the most up to date stock. Followed by Michelin. Michelin come 2nd only because their PP2s are generally old stuff. Continental is 3rd because they have a lot of old stock they are dumping on us. By old, I dont mean dangerously old. It is about 8-9 months old. Not 2 or 3 years like some Bridgestones(in 215/65 R16 and 235/60 R16).

If your tyre is less than 6 months old, then fantastic! In that case you hav the tyre with the reinforced sidewall which compromises on ride quality but it's a small price to pay given the fact that our roads are so bad.

There is no ban on imports. It was just a gimmick by the government. the local manufacturers like MRF, Apollo, JK, Ceat pressurised the govt to ban truck tyre imports from China as a lot of China made truck tyres were coming into India and ruining the market.

This lead to a lot of rumours about passenger car tyres supply being hit. Only Michelin was affected to some extent as they usually bring in their truck tyres AND the passenger car tyres in the same container. And most of them are made in China. But that problem is no longer there. The govt was looking to ban Chinese tyres. Not tyres by big reputed manufacturers made in China.

Make a note. I highly recommend Continental tyres. They are very good. But for outright comfort, I would still prefer a Michelin XM1+.

Quote:
Originally Posted by breezydrive View Post
Michelin's India site claims no XM1+ in 13" size, of course XM1 is available as always!
Of course XM1+ is available. It was introduced a month or so back. Until then you only had XM1. But now XM1+ has been introduced in the 155/65 R13, 165/65 R!3, 155/70 R13 sizes.
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Old 19th September 2009, 01:08   #7
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OT:
xltyre's on here too.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/member...eenivasan.html
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Old 19th September 2009, 06:26   #8
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question - will this outlast a set of those not so long running XM1's ?
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Old 19th September 2009, 20:31   #9
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Well a friend of mine / a TBHPian also had similar interaction with a tyre dealer. He was also pushing for Conti tyres but was asking more money for it. We figured out he was trying to rip us off so we eventually settled for Apollo Acelere.

A question for you Nikil. Which tubless tyre do you think is best in 13" (155/65/R13) on stock rims (Apollo Acelere, XM1+, Conti) in terms of:
1. Life
2. Noise
3. Grip on wet / dry surface
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Old 19th September 2009, 22:43   #10
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Life: Bridgestone S322 tubeless. Absolutely $#!t tyre, but it lasts long!

Noise: XM1+

Grip: Cant really say. The BS ER60, XM1+, Apollo Accelere all seem to be decent. See, in this case, the car is the weakest link. For a Wagon R, either of these tyres would be good.
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Old 19th September 2009, 22:56   #11
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@Jebs, That was a well deserved upgrade. Can you post your experience on how does it feel at 80+ speeds ?
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Old 21st September 2009, 13:09   #12
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Hi Friends,

I have just completed my 400 k.m trip with the new shoes of my Wagon-R.

My Old tyres were 5 years old, so i got only 100rs for each.

About my trip with CONTI tyres:

It was an excellent trip after the upgrade. I never think that just a tyre upgrade made an extreme change on the ride quality. I did not click pics , so dis-qualified to post a travelogue. But honestly says, I felt the difference between with my stock tyres and tubeless tyres. From my experience, road noise is absolutely zero, and grip is excellent. I did some harsh braking, it saved me. And the cornering is absolutely 100% confident. I did few cornering with around 90+. No significant body roll. I was scared to do this with my stock tyres, but i did this with my new tyres. I agree that 90+kmph cornering is not advisable for the tallboys. But somehow, I got some confidents. Thanks for CONTINENTAL tyres. All I would say am pretty much satisfied with this upgrade.



Nikil,

Now i got clear about the Michelins. Thanks a lot man. I did not know that xm1+ and energy series are same. Now, I got cleared from false information. One question still itching me like "Why the dealers are always insist us to go for CONTINENTAL tyres? Though they are Michelin PP. Kindly let me know..
I was really interested with Michelin before i heard about CONTI tyres. I heard that Michelin has shorter in life, is that correct? Is that due to softer compounds? And soft sidewall prone to cuts? Kindly let me know man. Also, please tell me 155/70/R13 is not ideal upsize for Wagon-R?
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Old 21st September 2009, 15:44   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebs

Nikil,

Now i got clear about the Michelins. Thanks a lot man. I did not know that xm1+ and energy series are same. Now, I got cleared from false information. One question still itching me like "Why the dealers are always insist us to go for CONTINENTAL tyres? Though they are Michelin PP. Kindly let me know..
I was really interested with Michelin before i heard about CONTI tyres. I heard that Michelin has shorter in life, is that correct? Is that due to softer compounds? And soft sidewall prone to cuts? Kindly let me know man. Also, please tell me 155/70/R13 is not ideal upsize for Wagon-R?
Well, I have no idea why the dealer pushed Continental so much. As I said earlier, maybe he didnt have stock of XM1+. He may be an MPP, but if stock is not there, he might have pushed Conti so that he doesnt lose you as a customer. I have no problem with this. It is a normal business tactic. I feel bad that he lied to you and gave you completely rubbish information.

Life: Michelin and Conti should be about equal. I dont expect a huge difference when it comes to life. XM1+ is not really known for sidewall cuts. They are quite robust. Conti CEC3 is now coming with reinforced sidewall, so hopefuly that should be quite durable as well.

155/65 R13 is the correct upsize. Upsize is considered by keeping various things in mind. Especiall yhe rolling circumference. There is a lot of variation between 145/70 R!3(which is the OEM size) and 155/70 R13.
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Old 21st September 2009, 16:41   #14
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While looking for 155/65 R13 for my Zen, I saw recently launched Bridgestone ER 60 in this size. The dealer quoted Rs. 2750 per tyre which is about 150 more than XM1+. The tyre seemed better than XM1+ in terms of section width, side wall thickness & overall feel.

My car ran only 34 k on last set of XM1 so may be this time I'll go for ER60.
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Old 21st September 2009, 16:47   #15
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There is XM1+ now available in the same size. This will last you much more than the XM1 you had previously.
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