Water Pump Failure - Why and How?

Tejas@perioimpl · 25th February 2010, 11:38

A brand new water pump was installed in my Mahindra Classic just 3 months ago by Global Gallerie Service Center in Thane. This was when i had just bought my Jeep and went in for a complete diagnostic.

During last sunday's OTR, my jeep started developing a sound and minor vibrations were felt (while running and idle). On opening the hood, it seemed the pulley was loose.

However, there was no overheating and the temp needle stayed well below 80.

Showed it to my local mechanic and he said the water pump has failed. Now since i had just changed my water pump and i know that water pumps last for tens of thousands of kilometers, i didn't believe him.

So i went in for a second opinion to Milestone Mahindra workshop and they too just heard the sound and said water pump failure. On inspection they confirmed the bearings had gone for a toss.

How and why did a three month old water pump fail?

A quick google search gave me the following possible causes:

Quote:

Water pumps typically fail one of two ways: the shaft seal starts to leak, or the impeller inside breaks, comes loose or the blades erode and wear down (which is more of a problem with pumps that have plastic impellers).

There was definitely no leakage around the pump.

Another website says that over-tightening of the pulley and excessive strain of the belt can also cause failure. So then, how does one check for adequate tension of the belt?

Jaggu · 25th February 2010, 11:57

Yup overtightening belt can put strain on the pump, usually a thumb check is good enough to check if its tightened properly

ex670c · 25th February 2010, 12:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl

How and why did a three month old water pump fail?

A quick google search gave me the following possible causes:

There was definitely no leakage around the pump.

Another website says that over-tightening of the pulley and excessive strain of the belt can also cause failure. So then, how does one check for adequate tension of the belt?

Hi Tejas,

The Peugeot Water Pumps are Pre-Lubricated (Bearing).

The Pulley is attached to the impeller shaft with a Woodruff Key.

A few causes for failure.

1) Improper installation

2) Pulley fitted incorrectly

3) Too Much tension on the fan belt. A simple way of checking the fan belt tension is to push the belt down (WHEN THE ENGINE IS SWITCHED OFF), is to push the belt down with one finger, it should not depress more than 2cms. (Specifications are given of the fan belt packing)

or pinch the fan belt and shake it (Radiator to Engine Block), there should not be any play.

4) Use Good Quality spare parts
i) Fan Belt Fenner 1125 part No. for Peugeot
ii) Lucas-TVS water pump.

Tejas@perioimpl · 25th February 2010, 12:01

But will only over-tightening cause the pump to fail in three months?! If it is over-tightened way too much, shouldn't the belt have failed first?

EDIT:

Just saw your post Arka:

Will make sure the parts are correct. The previous pump was also Lucas and was fit by Mahindra Authorized Service Center.

Live To Jive · 25th February 2010, 12:06

Could the pump have been running dry. Chocked intake hose or something? Running a pump dry will surely ruin the pump.

Tejas@perioimpl · 25th February 2010, 12:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

Could the pump have been running dry. Chocked intake hose or something? Running a pump dry will surely ruin the pump.

Nope. Radiator was flushed and new pipes installed at the same time of installing the new pump. And no overheating at all.

headers · 26th February 2010, 08:35

Hey Doc, Looks like an installation issue. You gotta fight with the guy who fixed it.

Tejas@perioimpl · 26th February 2010, 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by headers

Hey Doc, Looks like an installation issue. You gotta fight with the guy who fixed it.

Yep. Mahindra Milestone workshop is going to give me a report on why it failed and then i'm gonna take it up with Mahindra Global Gallerie.

But, fighting with a Mahindra Authorized Service Center is going to be an uphill task!!!

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 26th February 2010, 14:43

tightness/slackness of the accessory belts should always be checked at the midpoint of the longest belt, the procedure mentioned by Arka is correct, only thing to be noted is that the belt should be depressed between 1/2 to 1 inch (thumb rule), also if you have an option to measure the frequency gently tap the belt at the midposition and allow it to vibrate, the frequency of vibration can then be measured in Hertz. Also it needs to be mentioned that different manufacturers have different specifications, so it is better to stick to them.

Spike

Tejas@perioimpl · 26th February 2010, 15:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

tightness/slackness of the accessory belts should always be checked at the midpoint of the longest belt, the procedure mentioned by Arka is correct, only thing to be noted is that the belt should be depressed between 1/2 to 1 inch (thumb rule), also if you have an option to measure the frequency gently tap the belt at the midposition and allow it to vibrate, the frequency of vibration can then be measured in Hertz. Also it needs to be mentioned that different manufacturers have different specifications, so it is better to stick to them.

Spike

Spike, so will mahindra compensate me for a faulty job?

EDIT: Spike just kiddin... I know it's not your domain!

siddartha · 26th February 2010, 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

also if you have an option to measure the frequency gently tap the belt at the midposition and allow it to vibrate, the frequency of vibration can then be measured in Hertz.

Spike

.. is this humanly possible?

ex670c · 26th February 2010, 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by siddartha

.. is this humanly possible?

Humanly its called ESSSperience.

For laymen, you will need a tuning fork, for the preset frequency and when the Tuning Fork Resonates with the Vibration/Frequency of the fan belt

.

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 27th February 2010, 13:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl

Spike, so will mahindra compensate me for a faulty job?

EDIT: Spike just kiddin... I know it's not your domain!

@Tejas you are correct, its not my domain, but as a customer i would be on your side, i hope this answers your question

Spike

siddartha · 27th February 2010, 17:45

Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : One-liners that add ZERO value to the thread are strictly prohibited on Team-BHP. In fact, they are considered as SPAM. Please do not hit the post submit button unless you have something of value to add to the thread.

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DirtyDan · 27th February 2010, 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex670c

Humanly its called ESSSperience.

For laymen, you will need a tuning fork, for the preset frequency and when the Tuning Fork Resonates with the Vibration/Frequency of the fan belt

.

Specially trained dogs are now used for smaller car's fan belts. These vehicles emit frequencies higher than human ears can hear but the canny kanines have no trouble.

25th February 2010, 11:57	#2
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,384 Thanked: 17,299 Times	Yup overtightening belt can put strain on the pump, usually a thumb check is good enough to check if its tightened properly
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25th February 2010, 12:01	#4
Tejas@perioimpl Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bombay Posts: 4,430 Thanked: 9,764 Times View My Garage	But will only over-tightening cause the pump to fail in three months?! If it is over-tightened way too much, shouldn't the belt have failed first? EDIT: Just saw your post Arka: Will make sure the parts are correct. The previous pump was also Lucas and was fit by Mahindra Authorized Service Center. Last edited by Tejas@perioimpl : 25th February 2010 at 12:04. Reason: see edit
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25th February 2010, 12:06	#5
Live To Jive BANNED Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Swindon, UK Posts: 698 Thanked: 89 Times	Could the pump have been running dry. Chocked intake hose or something? Running a pump dry will surely ruin the pump.
	() Thanks

26th February 2010, 08:35	#7
headers Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Greater Chennai Posts: 4,667 Thanked: 564 Times	Hey Doc, Looks like an installation issue. You gotta fight with the guy who fixed it.
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26th February 2010, 14:43	#9
SPIKE ARRESTOR Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 2,856 Thanked: 1,545 Times	tightness/slackness of the accessory belts should always be checked at the midpoint of the longest belt, the procedure mentioned by Arka is correct, only thing to be noted is that the belt should be depressed between 1/2 to 1 inch (thumb rule), also if you have an option to measure the frequency gently tap the belt at the midposition and allow it to vibrate, the frequency of vibration can then be measured in Hertz. Also it needs to be mentioned that different manufacturers have different specifications, so it is better to stick to them. Spike
	() Thanks

27th February 2010, 17:45	#14
siddartha BHPian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: bangalore Posts: 671 Thanked: 24 Times	Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : One-liners that add ZERO value to the thread are strictly prohibited on Team-BHP. In fact, they are considered as SPAM. Please do not hit the post submit button unless you have something of value to add to the thread. We advise you to visit our board rules before proceeding any further. Last edited by GTO : 28th February 2010 at 16:34.
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