[sirjokhi]

Hello to all once again. I don't know how many of you read my thread of my pre-owned Mahindra Thar. If not check the link below:-
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-v...thar-crde.html (My pre-owned Mahindra Thar CRDe)

Prologue

So after that, I really got into the sport of off-roading and modified my thar accordingly. It had a long list of mods which I will list down below:-

1. Stage 2 tuned from T8 performance. I wanted maximum torque possible at low rpms. I let them know of my intentions for the same. I had given my car to a garage called Starboy customs in Nashik for all the labour work and engine refurbishing. I sent the ECU to Bangalore and got it tuned. I also changed EGR system after the tune.

2. T8 exhaust. I had to get it done to get maximum performance from the tune. So I went ahead. It sounds pretty good, like a diesel tractor on steroids.

3. Brake rotors from T8. Thar is not the best in terms of braking or handling vehicle in the market. I am talking about the pre-facelift 2013 model.

4. Lamda manual differential lockers for the rear.

5. Intercooler from KS Motorsports in Mumbai. Wanted better cooling and avoid overheating after so many mods. No issues so far.

6. Pro fender shock absorbers for better comfort and articulation maybe? It's better than before but I honestly can't tell the difference.

7. Armoro Openable soft top was another addition. If you check my previous thread out, you'll notice the hard top being there. Unfortunately it had a lot of leaks, almost a waterfall inside during heavy rains and the mechanic told me it couldn't be fixed. It was almost 7 years old at the time so I didn't bother to cross check the claim. I chose Armoro because I checked it out in the flesh and really liked the quality. I opted for the Olive green colour. Mind you the "Openable" is only for the side and rear windows with zippers. No leaks so far though I miss the hard top now because of the noise and dust that comes through.

8. I also installed BMC air filter and Lamda hub locks just because I wanted to. Air filter was for better performance and hub locks were for better reliability.

All other mods including roll cage, tyres etc. can be seen in my previous thread. So after all the mods my Thar looked like this.









OK enough about the Thar! This post is about CJ.


Need for a vehicle

I modified the Thar to match my criteria for off-roading and it did. But very soon I realised that you need to drive on the road to get there. I'm not saying Thar is uncomfortable but in my case I had to travel almost 140kms one way for off-roading and being the genius I am, I completely neglected that during my build and kept spending money. The travel mainly consisted of highway driving and the total lack of safety features in Thar made me gulp every time I had to brake hard or avoid something. Suddenly I started second guessing the decision. I would worry while off-roading if my vehicle would break down and I'd have to borrow someone's vehicle or find a solution. Though the build turned out to be good, I needed Thar to be my daily driver as it was quite useful for my field of work but I also needed it to be my weekend off-road buddy. Unfortunately, that didn't work so I decided to keep Thar as my daily commute for short drives, Octavia VRS as my highway cruiser and one more vehicle to go off-roading in and keep it then and there after it. So the plan went like this- I drive to Silvassa which is 140 odd KMS away from my home in my sedan comfortably and safely. Off-road in the new vehicle. Keep the vehicle there with my buddies from off-roading group who would get it serviced and keep it ready for the next time. Return home in my sedan safely.

Requirements & Shortlisted Vehicles

My requirements were quite simple. Buy a purpose built vehicle. Off-roading being the purpose here. I didn't want to build a vehicle again because from my experience, building a vehicle requires a lot of energy, time and Vitamin M. I wasn't willing to spend much after the Thar fiasco. I started contacting people I know from different off-road groups. Thanks to Team BHP, I was added to the Gujarat whatsapp group for the same. There I came in contact with Khalilbhai from Ahmedabad. He is into off-roading as well and he helped me shortlist a few vehicles. I was advised to go for a built MM550 above everything else. I have always loved Gypsy and I wanted to buy one so badly but everyone I talked to advised me against it. So MM550 it was. One day soon enough I received a call from Khalilbhai regarding a MM550 for sale in Ahmedabad. It was an ex-army vehicle fitted with Toyota 14-B engine mated with Hilux's 5 speed gearbox. It had numerous other modifications as well and was just the kind of vehicle I was looking for. I was really excited for this one and it was fitting right in my budget. I gave a go ahead but unfortunately the deal didn't go through because of RTO issues. The picture of the vehicle is below.



All this while I was looking at multiple built MM550s, 540s, Gypsys but none of them rang a bell. Either they were out of my budget or too beaten up to take the plunge. I was slowly getting frustrated and tired of searching. Out of no where I got a call from Yazadbhai (Mentioned in my previous thread) regarding a CJ that was up for sale. He asked me to buy the vehicle without giving it a second thought because he had driven the same vehicle before and had based his Mahindra Major build off of it. The quoted price was a bit steep so I declined. He was persistent so I budged and hesitantly asked for some pictures of the vehicle. The following pictures were received on whatsapp co-incidentally on the same day one year ago I am starting this thread!






Buying Decision & Experience

I was still a bit hesitant. By this time, I had forwarded the pictures to Khalilbhai. He recognised the person (Sonu Pujari) in the picture and knew him personally. He contacted him and he gave a big thumbs up to the vehicle and also poured in a lot of praises for its off-road capabilities. Khalilbhai gave me a big thumbs up after that saying the guy is very knowledgable about jeeps and off-roading. That was the final nail in the coffin because all these experts who knew much more about off-roading than I probably ever will were asking me to go ahead. I finally decided to go ahead and buy the vehicle but as per our Indian style I tried negotiating a bit. The vehicle was owned by Starboy garage's owner where my Thar was modified. He did not agree to lower the price so we asked him to install a proper roll cage and said we would only buy the vehicle if he was ready to give the 33 inch MTs with it. Not with the buckshots as can be seen in one of the pictures. He agreed to it and I asked Yazadbhai to handle the transactions for me and he did. So there it was. I bought a vehicle without driving or even seeing it. But the word of all these people included in my buying process was enough for me. The vehicle would take another week or two for delivery as it had to be fitted with a roll cage and I was okay with it. Looking at the same limited pictures I had when I woke up, all throughout the day and ofcourse before sleeping. Waiting anxiously for it's arrival which wasn't even going to be at my home. It would be delivered far away (140kms) but I just wanted to have that satisfaction that it was finally mine. I am sure a lot of people here would understand this feeling. Would the vehicle I bought without seeing or driving meet my expectations? This question was constantly in my head reminding me of what I had done. A week after the deal was done, I got a phone call from Yazadbhai telling me that the vehicle was ready and on it's way from Nashik (Starboy Customs) to Silvassa (New home). I was ecstatic and waiting for the pictures after it was delivered. The following pictures were received by me in a couple of hours.






Finally the vehicle was mine and I felt relieved. The vehicle was looking amazing though I wasn't too sure about the colour at first!

Specifications of the vehicle

The vehicle is completely built from ground up. I am attaching the Before & After picture from the previous owner's profile.


The previous owner had done all the work and I was happy not to go through the process honestly. I am listing down the specs of the vehicle:-

Engine- It has been fitted with a 2.6 SZ+ chain drive engine derived from a Mahindra Scorpio producing 109HP at 3800rpm and 255nm of torque at just 1800rpm. Torque is the most important factor here and this amount at just 1800rpm is more than adequate!




Transmission- The engine is mated to a KMT90 4 speed manual transmission. Not very good on road performance but it is very durable and helps in transferring the torque off-road flawlessly. It has a separate gear lever to engage 2WD, 4H (4 High) & 4L (4 Low) modes which is quite common in 4 wheel drive cars available in India. Not many vehicles have electronic toggles or selectors in this price range.

Suspension- It has long travel shocks adopted from a Eicher mini truck if i am not mistaken. They are really good for articulation and again durable enough to take the beating off-road. There are leaf springs probably taken from a Mahindra Bolero or 550.

Axles & Differentials- Both the front and rear axles and differentials are from an ex-army MM550. The front has closed axles and the rear differential consists of the factory fitted LSD.

Tyres- As I mentioned, I was only willing to buy the vehicle if the previous owner delivered the car with MTs and not buckshot and he he kept his end of the bargain. The car has 33x12.5 Savero radial tyres on 15 inch steel rims. They provide good amount of grip but I think there are better tyres out there which will definitely be considered when I'm replacing these. For now though, these tyres are good enough and I am happy with the performance.

Things I Like

- Powerful engine. It really comes to life when you put it in 4L and can go through any obstacle with ease.

- Reliability & Durability. I know jeeps aren't known to be reliable but this vehicle hasn't given me any issues so far. A lot of vehicles have broken down OTR but this car has never put me in a spot where I have to worry about heading back. Not even a puncture so far. I hope I don't jinx it! Fingers crossed!

- Looks. I understand looks are subjective but I feel everybody loves the way Jeeps look. A lot of people don't like the way they drive and I understand and even agree to a certain point but so far I haven't met a single person who dislikes Jeeps for their looks. Let's see if we find someone on this thread, maybe?

- Ground clearance. One of the most important requirements while off-roading. I am not sure about the exact clearance but I am guessing it's more than 260mm if not more. The large tyres help here.

- Capability. It is a very capable off-roader. It overcomes any obstacle with ease. Even the ones where Thar used to struggle a lot. It's almost as if it's taunting me asking for more. Something like " Is that all? Give me something challenging at least "

- Visibility. The lack of doors altogether help a lot. Whenever I have a doubt about clearing an obstacle, I just pop my small head out and the issue is sorted. Also seating now (Mentioned below) is higher up which helps further.

- Sound- People might call me crazy but I actually do like the sound of a diesel engine. The grunt with sudden surge of torque pulling you back into the seat is what I live for. Also the exhaust pipe broke in the middle of an obstacle which makes it sound more rorty. No plans of fixing it


Things I dislike

- Ride. People often describe the ride of an S-class as cushiony like it just cushions out the pot holes and glides through. But you'd be better of comparing the ride of my CJ with an auto rickshaw. Heck, I'd swap the journey till an obstacle with an auto rickshaw if I could. It is literally back breaking. I have sat in various off-roading vehicles in my group and mine easily has the worst ride. I honestly can't describe how bad it actually is. The short wheelbase, large MT tyres, firm suspension and top notch infrastructure of rural areas in our country results in my misery. All this when I have set the tyre pressure to 16 PSI!

- No Air conditioning. I understand this vehicle is not meant to have a list of comfort features and I am not complaining. OK I am a bit. But I have good reason to. It is alright when we're on the move but sitting in the car while it's stationary in our climate is agony. As a group, we wait for everyone to clear an obstacle like most off-roading groups, spotting and what not. After that, I see a Thar owners with their smug faces where they know they're going to be greeted with a cool breeze from air conditioning vents. Yes. I envy them. Might fit a fan in my vehicle in the future.

- On road manners. The vehicle needs to be driven slow. You can NOT drive it like a normal car at normal car speeds. The tyres offer very little grip on road & under heavy braking, they lock up. No matter how minor a turn is, you need to go slow. It can topple very easily and it will.

- Braking. This was expected from the beginning and I am not shocked by the way brakes perform. They will do their job and stop you but you need to keep twice the safe distance you normally would. The vehicle did not come equipped with a handbrake which is a nuisance because I have to put it in gear at a steep incline or decline if we need to stop there. Also the engine is so torquey and the brakes so weak that if you release the clutch in 4L First gear and press hard on the brakes, the vehicle will still keep moving forward. It won't stall, won't even decrease the speed by a lot just crawl like it has no brakes. You know brakes are working because they make squeaky noises during this practice.

- No safety features. Again, not shocked by this since I own a Thar which is much more modern comparatively and still had no safety features. (2013 model) Apart from the roll cage, there's nothing.

- Exposure. In these recent times, this word has a scary meaning. Since I have no doors, no windows & a completely open vehicle from almost all the sides, I am exposed to everything on the road. Smell, dirt, mud etc. The wheels are wider than the arches which leads to a free pass for mud to cover everything up with itself including my face, hair and clothes. The front wheels account for the front side of my body and rear wheels account for the backside since there is nothing between me and the tyres.

An Equilibrium

Short Wheel Base. It adds to the vehicle's capability in off-roading as it reduces the risk of becoming high centered and trapped with all four wheels off the ground. But it is not confidence inspiring at least for me as SWB vehicles are known to topple easily. I usually avoid such obstacles where the approach or departure leads to the vehicle tilting. It is also a factor in the harsh ride but improves the turning radius of the vehicle. It's a love-hate relationship honestly.

First Encounter

I have mentioned in the thread that my friend took delivery of the vehicle. That weekend, we all went out to test the vehicle and that would be the first time I would actually see the car in flesh. My friend with whom the vehicle is kept is a filling station owner in Silvassa and all his jeeps are stored there as well. That is the meeting point for all our group members from where we head to the jungles for adventure. As we drove up to the station, I saw the jeep from far away. Really hard to miss it in this colour. It was looking amazing in the sunlight and the paint looked better than in pictures. It was much smaller than I imagined but I was excited to finally see it and drive it. As I opened the door, and stepped in I realized how cramped it was. I am 5 feet 10 inches tall and my legs were literally touching the keys when they were in the ignition hole. The seat couldn't be moved back because of the wheel arch behind. But all these small niggles weren't going to spoil my mood and I just wanted to take it out for an adventure. And I did.


Repairs & Replacements

The vehicle hasn't had anything major done to it. I replaced the seats and have a better view now and my legs fit inside the vehicle comfortably. The starter motor had a problem and it wouldn't engage randomly which was repaired. The arches behind the seats were fabricated so as to not make it uncomfortable for the driver and passenger. That is pretty much it. Normal servicing has been done once or twice which includes oil change in engine, gearbox & differentials. Other than that, nothing has been done to the vehicle as it is performing flawlessly.

Summary

I have owned this vehicle for almost an year now and I am very happy with the purchase. Thar prepared me for owning such an uncomfortable and compromised vehicle but as it is not my daily driver, I am fine with it. I only drive it every alternate weekends and the vehicle is still performing well. I would like to thank all of my friends who made this possible and helped me in finding and maintaining my Jeep. I am also highly grateful to all the members from Kings Off Road Club Silvassa who have taken me under their wing and taught me everything I know about off-roading. They are the ones who are maintaining my vehicle and storing it for me. Thanks to Team-BHP again for connecting us like minded people and I am grateful for the opportunity to share my experience here. I will share my future OTRs with this vehicle on this same thread. Will depart with some parting shots. Stay safe everyone.

[Aditya]

Thread moved out from the Assembly Line. Thanks for sharing!

[amol4184]

Fabulous Jeep! I had red your Thar thread and loved it too. Very subjective but I think the original olive green was a better shade for this Jeep's looks.
Any thoughts on doing SPOA conversion of leaf springs for added articulation?

[Kosfactor]

Congratulations, Jeep looks like quite a character , wish you loads of fun as jeeps should be. I have a liking towards this Jeep in that greenish color with NDMS because it was my earliest memory of a Jeep, flat fender CJ.

Recently I was driving a topless CJ3B on the winding roads of Nilgiris with my college friend, Jeep was a medium to take you back in time. I enjoyed the company and the machine.

[Tejas@perioimpl]

Nice and well done.

I liked the hood design and will made a similar one for my classic.

[sirjokhi]

Originally Posted by amol4184

Fabulous Jeep! I had red your Thar thread and loved it too. Very subjective but I think the original olive green was a better shade for this Jeep's looks.
Any thoughts on doing SPOA conversion of leaf springs for added articulation?

Thank you for the compliment! I personally feel the olive green was better looking but the previous owner had other plans! Might consider the colour when it's time to respray this one. As for SPOA, we drive around 10-15 kms to the tracks on road and it's already pretty scary. From what I know SPOA will make it worse? Might consider in the future or just go with old school shackle lift.

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Congratulations, Jeep looks like quite a character , wish you loads of fun as jeeps should be. I have a liking towards this Jeep in that greenish color with NDMS because it was my earliest memory of a Jeep, flat fender CJ.

When I look at the classic jeep from the picture, I think the same. If I could, I would keep one Jeep completely stock and build one so that I can just stare at the stock one in my garage. It's beautiful. But unfortunately, I can't. Maybe in the future? You never know!

Recently I was driving a topless CJ3B on the winding roads of Nilgiris with my college friend, Jeep was a medium to take you back in time. I enjoyed the company and the machine.

I agree. These vehicles when driven slow reward you with a sense of occasion. The stance, open top driving experience, raw engine feel with zero dampening feels really peaceful and calming for a weekend getaway. It's sort of a stress-buster for me honestly.

Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl

Nice and well done.

I liked the hood design and will made a similar one for my classic.

Thank you so much for the kind words Tejas! Honoured to have your reply on my post. I think it's the Willy's hood if I am not mistaken. If you are making an all out monster of that classic, here's a picture of one from our group.

[COMMUTER]

That is a wonderfully equiped vehicle. Please post more videos of off roading in this nice vehicle.

Has fitting the new engine been legally hassle free?

Has it been updated with the RTO? Has it been acceted without any issues?

OT

I am dreaming of doing an engine swap in my Figo when I have used the current engine to the fullest.

Hence I want to know how to deal with the legal issues, if any.

[amol4184]

Originally Posted by sirjokhi

Thank you for the compliment! I personally feel the olive green was better looking but the previous owner had other plans! Might consider the colour when it's time to respray this one. As for SPOA, we drive around 10-15 kms to the tracks on road and it's already pretty scary. From what I know SPOA will make it worse? Might consider in the future or just go with old school shackle lift.

My mechanic to whom I occasionally take my Thar has a project MM550 with SPOA. I did have a ride in it as a passenger and it was scary alright. Various sounds and creaking noises didn't help either. A thoroughbred unsuitable-for-on-the-road vehicle but great advantages while off roading?

This ancient thread is a great read on the topic:
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-t...arted-now.html (Gypsy on Steroids -- The SPoA Project. EDIT: Stage-2 Started now..)

[sirjokhi]

Originally Posted by COMMUTER

That is a wonderfully equiped vehicle. Please post more videos of off roading in this nice vehicle.

Has fitting the new engine been legally hassle free?

Has it been updated with the RTO? Has it been acceted without any issues?

OT

I am dreaming of doing an engine swap in my Figo when I have used the current engine to the fullest.

Hence I want to know how to deal with the legal issues, if any.

Umm... I have been dealing with issues regarding NOC. The previous owner and I have decided to transfer it in the same state. I don't know if the engine number will be changed in the RC but since I am only using the vehicle on weekends that too for rural driving I don't mind the variation. The best thing for you would be to contact a good and reputable agent there and ask about the legal proceedings for the same. A lot of agents claim things they can't achieve so I would suggest contacting someone you know or someone through a friend. Cheers.

Originally Posted by amol4184

My mechanic to whom I occasionally take my Thar has a project MM550 with SPOA. I did have a ride in it as a passenger and it was scary alright. Various sounds and creaking noises didn't help either. A thoroughbred unsuitable-for-on-the-road vehicle but great advantages while off roading?

This ancient thread is a great read on the topic:
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-t...arted-now.html (Gypsy on Steroids -- The SPoA Project. EDIT: Stage-2 Started now..)

I don't need more articulation from the vehicle but I will surely check the thread out to gather some knowledge. Like you mentioned, the on road performance was scary and I don't want to do anything that might change the character of the vehicle from what it already is. Thanks for the thread link. Will surely update you if I go with the addition.

[COMMUTER]

Originally Posted by sirjokhi

Umm... I have been dealing with issues regarding NOC. The previous owner and I have decided to transfer it in the same state. I don't know if the engine number will be changed in the RC but since I am only using the vehicle on weekends that too for rural driving I don't mind the variation.

Thank you very much.

Was the engine swap conducted before the last road tax/renewal/fitness? When is the next renewal coming up?

Do keep updating us further.

[abhikb]

Congratulations Neil for this beautiful buy, an open top CJ beats any other vehicle easily and is a crush of many enthusiasts.

The previous owner has done a commendable job by fitting the best of the stuff available in other Mahindra vehicles to make this a competent off roader.

[Shubhendra]

Originally Posted by sirjokhi

Engine- It has been fitted with a 2.6 SZ+ chain drive engine derived from a Mahindra Scorpio producing 109HP at 3800rpm and 255nm of torque at just 1800rpm. Torque is the most important factor here and this amount at just 1800rpm is more than adequate!

Congratulations!
Few inputs.
1. Its a CJ3B which is SWB (81 inch wheelbase), CJ500 is MWB (91 inches wheelbase)
2. Do you have OKBJ in the front? though, they look like closed knuckle of non-NGCS but in case you have OKBJ, please be gentle on throttle during offroad else universal joint within open knuckle might break.
3. Please check if chassis strengthening is done, wait and torque of this engine needs strengthening. As i have had this setup in my Jeep and Bolero.
4. Dont ever go for SPOA on this Jeep, SWB and SPOA dont go along well

Say my hello to Parmars

[sirjokhi]

Originally Posted by abhikb

Congratulations Neil for this beautiful buy, an open top CJ beats any other vehicle easily and is a crush of many enthusiasts.

The previous owner has done a commendable job by fitting the best of the stuff available in other Mahindra vehicles to make this a competent off roader.

Thank you so much for the kind words Abhik! Can't wait to go on an OTR with you someday!

Originally Posted by Shubhendra

Congratulations!
Few inputs.
1. Its a CJ3B which is SWB (81 inch wheelbase), CJ500 is MWB (91 inches wheelbase)
2. Do you have OKBJ in the front? though, they look like closed knuckle of non-NGCS but in case you have OKBJ, please be gentle on throttle during offroad else universal joint within open knuckle might break.
3. Please check if chassis strengthening is done, wait and torque of this engine needs strengthening. As i have had this setup in my Jeep and Bolero.
4. Dont ever go for SPOA on this Jeep, SWB and SPOA dont go along well

Say my hello to Parmars

Thank you for investing in the thread sir! Even I was confused at first, but the RC says it's a CJ500. Might be a mistake? The previous owner mentioned it's a closed knuckle but I will get it checked once again. Thank you very much for the advice. Will check if the chassis is strengthened too! SPOA is a no for sure. I will say hi to the Parmars. Please ping us if you ever come to Gujarat or Silvassa.
Regards
Neil

[gaurav.kokra]

Hi Sirjokhi! I guess the fuel station seen in your pics is the one on Bhilad Road of Silvassa. This is the only single fuel station I have been using since the time I have been in silvassa.

Also, I have spotted some of the Jeeps in the pictures around here many times. Wanted to go upfront and really wanted to join in on some of the OTR adventures.

I am myself thinking of getting a second vehicle soon (preferably 4*4 Thar) as I have had and am done with my share of experience with sedans.

Want to level up now.

Would like to join you sometime when you are planning something around Silvassa if its not a problem!

[sirjokhi]

Originally Posted by gaurav.kokra

Hi Sirjokhi! I guess the fuel station seen in your pics is the one on Bhilad Road of Silvassa. This is the only single fuel station I have been using since the time I have been in silvassa.

Also, I have spotted some of the Jeeps in the pictures around here many times. Wanted to go upfront and really wanted to join in on some of the OTR adventures.

I am myself thinking of getting a second vehicle soon (preferably 4*4 Thar) as I have had and am done with my share of experience with sedans.

Want to level up now.

Would like to join you sometime when you are planning something around Silvassa if its not a problem!

Hello Gaurav. You are most welcome to join. This is the same pump that you are mentioning. My friend owns the pump and my jeep is stored there itself. I am actually considering selling my own thar. PM me if interested!