[volkman10]

Tesla puts India plans on hold.

Tesla has put on hold plans to sell electric cars in India, abandoned a search for showroom space and reassigned some of its domestic team after failing to secure lower import taxes.

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[mkumar79]

Tesla should pay import duties on raw materials and look to offset that against other costs like skilled manpower. If their number-crunchers feel otherwise, so be it. I am good with Nexon EV Max.

Before their cars reach demand, they need to first clear the physical speed breakers. In a market which has forced fun sedans like Virtus to 'arise', Tesla Model 3 has 140 mm ground clearance!

[GTO]

Just 2 days back, we got to know about Ford dropping its India EV plans, but that was more or less expected. Those were all fake & misleading statements by Ford when they stopped selling cars here. Like GM's Mary Barra who announced a year before GM India's exit that "we will invest a billion dollars in India" .

I have mixed feelings about Tesla though. On the one hand, I really want to see Tesla's cars here because - in terms of the EV drivetrain & technology - they are 5 years ahead of everyone else (even Mercedes is just catching up). The power delivery, "feel" of the electric motors, sharpness, range etc. of Tesla are exemplary. They are like the "BMW" of the electric car scene. Only Porsche has matched them with the Taycan. I've driven EVs from the likes of Mercedes & Audi, and can tell you they still have a lot of work to do.

On the other hand, if Tesla expects special concessions because they are "Tesla", well, take a hike. Our import duties are in place for a reason = BUILD LOCAL. If you want to sell your cars here, make them here! If Mercedes can locally assemble AMGs & Maybachs, as can smaller brands like Volvo & Jaguar-Land Rover, I don't see why Tesla has commitment phobia. Anyway, it's not like Tesla is going for the masses as their products will be priced in the luxury segment, so I don't get on what basis they wanted concessions. Elitist brands are hardly a priority for our government.

It's a level playing field for all OEMs, whether Indian or Multinational. Take it or leave it.

The real reason will be that Tesla is just way too busy with unprecedented growth in USA, China & elsewhere. At best, it would be a few thousand units a year in India, which would serve as a distraction. This "lower import taxes" was just a convenient way of ending the India plans. Mercedes - after so many years - sells about 13000 cars / year in India. Electric cars in the same price bands would sell what, 2500 a year tops?? Why bother with a market of such minuscule volumes when there are far bigger fish to fry.

Originally Posted by mkumar79

If their number-crunchers feel otherwise, so be it. I am good with Nexon EV Max.

. Well said.

[Turbanator]

As I have said previously too, Tesla does not just sell the cars but they develop a complete eco-system to run those cars as well. They could have done what BMW or MB or some of the other Germans are doing, launch a few units with no commitment to the charging infrastructure. (to be fair to Porsche, they did have installed a destination charger at DLF Emporia mall in Delhi ) Similarly, you can charge your BMW & MB at the dealerships but how many of these companies are going to invest in the highway chargers?

With Tesla, they were scouting real estate for the company-owned sales and service outlets and chargers on major highways, as they have done elsewhere in the world. Today, a 30 Lac vehicle can be sold in thousands a month, a Model 3 without driving aids, and without taxes comes to around a similar price. The savings on fuel and reduction in pollution should have been enough reasons for the GOI to consider lowering tariffs for a while.

For the people who are scouting for homegrown EVs like Nexon, it is definitely encouraging but if we dig deeper arent these based on kits from China? So, how would a Tesla import at a lower price be going to hurt such Indian companies who are assembling products from China?

There is definitely a space for premium EV in the 30-40 Lac range and Tesla could have done this if we had supported them for 2-3 Years on taxes with clear assurance on the assembly or investments in their IT support/ R&D functions in India to compensate for such imports at lower duties.

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

There is definitely a space for premium EV in the 30-40 Lac range and Tesla could have done this if we had supported them for 2-3 Years on taxes with clear assurance on the assembly or investments in their IT support/ R&D functions in India to compensate for such imports at lower duties.

Which was what the Govt. was seeking, assurances about Tesla's long game in India and they were non-committal. If Tesla was able to lay out EV production plans and investments akin to Tata motors, any government in their right mind would roll out the red carpet.

Plus, what message would this send to MNCs who spend millions setting up operations in India while Tesla on the other hand gets special allowance to import chinese CBUs at lower duties?

[EV NXT]

Tesla doesnt need India right now or at any point in the foreseeable future. They have their hands full with US, UK, EU, China whose requirements they are barely able to meet.

They are also continually honing their EV tech to stay ahead of the game and right now the others are sprinting faster. So they would rather spend their energies where it gets them maximum benefit.

There will be a time when the EV markets in the world reach a plateau as they are for ICE engines right now. At that point, India will appeal to Tesla and Tesla will do what India wants. Right now Tesla couldn’t be bothered.

Additionally as indicated above, Tesla builds the complete eco system - in the UK their plan is to let Tesla car owners charge their cars free at Tesla charging stations which they plan to build / are building along all highways. So a Tesla owner in the UK doesn’t pay for electricity with the assurance from Musk that it will remain free permanently.

EV’s are not too much of a priority for the Indian govt, even less are Tesla. So it’s going to be no Teslas for a while in India.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by shortbread

Which was what the Govt. was seeking, assurances about Tesla's long game in India and they were non-committal.any government in their right mind would roll out the red carpet.

Not privy to such discussions, but Elon is no fool to leave our market. I think both sides wanted assurances, and nobody believed in the other. In my opinion, Ford & GM's exit must have played on Tesla's mind.

what message would this send to MNCs who spend millions setting up operations in India while Tesla on the other hand gets special allowance to import chinese CBUs at lower duties?

It was never about Tesla alone; this should have been for all EV manufacturers. What all EU and other manufacturers are asking for is limited time imports of EVs at reduced rates and based on the sales, they can invest in the factories.

I do not know how much Tata is investing in manufacturing batteries or motors or the other EV components in India, so it will be unfair to comment, but to tell everyone to set up a factory first won't suit everyone.

While we are Ok using some nondescript Chinese vendors supplying kits to a local/ MNC company but cannot accept full CBU's from a known American company producing in China!

Will also like to know how Tesla is producing some unique inferior low-cost cars in China that are different from what they produce in the EU or US?

[androdev]

Tesla can be the Suzuki of EV cars in India. For that both Tesla and GoI have to come up with a visionary proposal. Tesla should commit to affordable EV platforms and charging infrastructure and GoI should give substantial incentives to make it attractive to Tesla. Model 3 etc can hardly be a win-win for both parties. We need a Sanjay Gandhi of sorts to pull this off.

[itwasntme]

Mixed reactions but I'll run with the Atmanirbhar theme. What is the staggering difference between MB, VAG, BMW & Tesla? Why should Tesla suddenly get the benefit of lower duties especially when the entire value creation is carried out in China?

MoRTH under Gadkari is doing good work, and I'm sure we would not have turned down a practical, reasonable but committed proposal from Tesla.

Let them bring in CBUs at the prevalent taxes and make a success of it. I'm sure they will pick up a good number of UHNIs wanting to get onto this particular bandwagon.

Anyway, the only option for them is the Model X SUV, as the other Teslas have wholly impractical & pitiful ground clearance.

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

For the people who are scouting for homegrown EVs like Nexon, it is definitely encouraging but if we dig deeper arent these based on kits from China? So, how would a Tesla import at a lower price be going to hurt such Indian companies who are assembling products from China?

There is definitely a space for premium EV in the 30-40 Lac range and Tesla could have done this if we had supported them for 2-3 Years on taxes with clear assurance on the assembly or investments in their IT support/ R&D functions in India to compensate for such imports at lower duties.

Ofcourse, Tata just imports the batteries and motors straight from China. And am not too fond of it. Thought with atleast the Nexon EV max they will start localising stuff.

But there are encouraging happenings. Just a few days back, the homologation documents for the Mahindra Atom was out, and while the battery cells were Chinese, the motor and battery pack were from Mahindra itself. Total noob regarding BEVs, also not sure if Mahindra itself are importing Chinese motors and stuff and rebranding as Mahindra.

Also the TDSG plant in Gujarat will be making battery packs, though the cells will be imported from China. I believe Toyota and Maruti would be game changers in producing more EV parts in India. Ofcourse, the BEV age belongs to China, but we sure can make some bits atleast in India. Granting concession to just Tesla will set a precedence for other companies who will be only glad to import stuff straight from our northern neighbour. Tesla is welcome to import CBUs and sell them like others. Pretty sure, there will be a horde of early adopters for the Tesla brand regardless of CBU pricing.

[volkman10]

Originally Posted by shortbread

Which was what the Govt. was seeking, assurances about Tesla's long game in India and they were non-committal. If Tesla was able to lay out EV production plans and investments akin to Tata motors, any government in their right mind would roll out the red carpet.

Plus, what message would this send to MNCs who spend millions setting up operations in India while Tesla on the other hand gets special allowance to import chinese CBUs at lower duties?

Tesla, as many have said before, can afford to keep India on hold as they have more projects to cater to including Cybertruck and the city car.

Who will set up a manufacturing facility initially itself for a low volume product ( due to cost ~30 lakh and above and questionable infrastructure) before test marketing it?

Indonesia as a market seems more lucrative to Tesla and is interested in buying mines too. So in all probability Tesla will prioritize setting up a manufacturing base there in addition to China.

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Tesla, as many have said before, can afford to keep India on hold as they have more projects to cater to including Cybertruck and the city car.

Who will set up a manufacturing facility initially itself for a low volume product ( due to cost ~30 lakh and above and questionable infrastructure) before test marketing it?

Agreed, both parties aren't a fit right now.

Neither does Tesla have a mass market product that's viable to bring numbers in India, neither do we have a large demand for 40+ lac cars. India's EV boom will continue without Tesla and the latters growth will continue without our market.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by itwasntme

I'll run with the Atmanirbhar theme.

Atamanribhar cannot be accomplished overnight and neither importing significant components from China and labelling as Made in India make anyone proud! I was recently shopping for Audio equipment; one of the amplifiers says - Made in Japan vs another Assembled in Japan. On further asking the company, I was told that a certain percentage of the components need to be produced in Japan to qualify for Made in Japan. I wish we get something similar so that people doing assembly operations cannot misuse the sentiments attached to this.

None of us (scouting for Tesla) is saying to make exceptions for one manufacturer; as someone who wants our country to get self-reliant and have less dependence on oil, I would love to own an EV, not necessarily made locally.

MoRTH under Gadkari is doing good work, and I'm sure we would not have turned down a practical, reasonable but committed proposal from Tesla.

Absolutely, but I doubt if his department had a significant role.

Let them bring in CBUs at the prevalent taxes and make a success of it.

As I mentioned before, Tesla is one company which has set very high standards in this industry, whether it is the technology or the infrastructure they create. Others follow. Can someone else invest in the infrastructure like what Tesla could have done?

I'm sure they will pick up a good number of UHNIs wanting to get onto this particular bandwagon.

Why do you want to have a Tesla only for wealthy people? Can an ordinary man who has a 25-30 lac budget not buy a Tesla? What would change if Tesla or other EVS got a tax holiday for 3 Years, as an example?

I feel sorry for the people who come into the sweet talk of the local manufacturers who know they are not competent and are afraid to lose their share/ profits. EVS are the future, and the government needs to handhold manufacturers who commit themselves irrespective of the brand.

[k491]

Just a few mins ago I was having this discussion with my mom, if Tesla could get the help from GOI in the form of lower taxes or subsidies, Tesla is one company that would set up the highway charging point infrastructure and that will make owning an EV car a lot more practical.

Strictly speaking as an automotive enthusiast without any political stance, Tesla putting Indian plans on hold is another major setback.

[officer416]

Tesla will be fit for India once they sort out their customer service. People here can't bear the customer service experience from Tata and Mahindra, wait till you experience Tesla's customer service. I mean non existent customer support, keep sending emails and you might get response if Tesla gods are looking upon you that day.
Tesla in India by default will be considered luxury vehicles, and Indian's expectation from a luxury car manufacturer are different. They don't want their car to rattle, they don't want to sit and type emails all day, they don't want the car falling apart due to shoddy built quality.
Cars rattle like you are travelling in the city bus from 1980's.

Also those saying that Tesla will come and setup chargers all over India and then we can buy electric cars as they will make more sense then is a total myth
Don't know why people think that businesses will invest in setting up fast chargers without any ROI potential. All the first adopters and people who are switching to EV's in India, especially Nexon EV owners are the ones who fuelled that fast charging network setup rush in India

They are the ones that have given the reason to companies like Zeon, Statiq, EESL and many more to rapidly deploy fast chargers as they now see potential. But many think government and above mentioned companies should have first installed chargers all over India, create a dense network, and then EV adoption should have kicked off.
Well businesses aren't charities, they don't invest if they don't see any potential. People who are buying EV's now are the ones who are pushing the EV revolution. It was not Mahindra Reva, it is not MG ZS EV and it's not Hyundai Kona that has brought electric revolution in this country, it's Nexon EV.

So to think Tesla would make a huge difference in our market it won't. What Tesla is to US is what Tata is to India. For Indians, mass adoption of EV's in near future will be fuelled by Tata Electric Cars. Model 3 is a mass market car in US and Nexon EV is the same for us in India.

Also the fanboyism for a company that doesn't give two cents about our country is next level. I just saw they have a Tesla India Club, I mean what do they share with each other in that club? Tesla wallpapers. Lol.