[RakishRam]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

I would like to suggest here that rather than get into the Pollution piece, and the Greenie stuff, it would be more sensible to simply focus on Electricity as one more amongst many Alternative Fuels available to us..

That’s a fair point when it comes to pollution while running. My point was even before hitting road.

[Ravi Parwan]

Quite an interesting poll. I hit all 8 of the first 8 factors.

I do think things will be a bit different 5-10 years down the line, when both the battery tech and charging infra improves, an EV will make sense for 95% of users in 100% of situations.

400+ km in a day is a use case you can do max 5-10 times in a year (normal case). For the remaining 350 days of the year, you can easily plan trips with 1 or 2 charging stops coinciding with your meal breaks.

Let's not forget that ICE cars needed 2-3 topups of the radiator in a day of hard driving.

I think the main deterrent to EV adoption is now the changing face of the technology and how fast it is evolving. We are already talking about the evolution of the Nexon (since that is the example most of us are familiar with). Even though I have not had the pleasure of actually experiencing an EV firsthand so far, I can relate to the fact that it is hard to put a large amount of money into something you know will be outshone by its successor technologies in a short amount of time.

People change their mobiles every two years or even sooner, just to keep up with the latest trends. It is kind of difficult today to do so with an EV as the newer products are more capable and incorporate newer features and the same model is actually reduced in price from the manufacturers side. The depreciation hit on EVs is likely the biggest deterrent to second wave of adopters (after the early adopters)

I expect once EV prices start reflecting the actual price of manufacturing without the distortion by material cost, plus more options in the market from all manufacturers, people will more open to buying EVs.

[AKSarkar1]

Voted: Other

Being a civil servant, my work hours are really unpredictable, some days my running is just a little over 70 kilometres and sometimes it is over 250 kilometres + a day. Simply put, like any other car, EVs have to match the lifestyle of a person, had the fast charging times been like what Teslas have I would have adopted EVs in a heartbeat.

EVs is definitely on my list as the next car if the infrastructure gets suited to a more unpredictable lifestyle.

[Hume]

First post.

Love the ICE - EV discussions.

For someone who enjoys driving - not sedately - driving an EV has been a thoroughly enjoyable experience. I've driven the XC40 recharge, ZS EV, Hyundai Kona and the Kia EV6 AWD and while I enjoyed driving all of them, it's the Kia's overall package that has me smitten. It also handles the best out of the four.

This is to say that EV6 has been just as aspirational for me as the BMW 530d, M340i or the X3 M40i had been in the past.

With that prelude out of the way, let me come to the topic of discussion keeping my aspirational Kia EV6 in mind as my personal reference :

Out of all the options above, "Uncertainty of battery life, reliability and repair costs in the long term" is my only real concern. The rest of them, in my use case, are all acceptable to me (I didn't wish to elaborate to ensure not to derail the discussion. Plenty has been said on the forum to and against all the points) Here's why the above point is of a grave concern for me:

For having paid a grand sum for a truly wonderful car, I can see myself running it to the ground by keeping it for at least 10-14 years. And considering what is offered with the vehicle, I can see myself thoroughly enjoying it without feeling compromised until its absolute end. Even the degradation of battery - say an SOH of 70% after more than a decade (conservatively speaking) is also OK with me. I'll happily run it in the city where a realistic range of 200 km when driven hard is possible and will be adequate.

My only ONLY concern is if the battery needs to be replaced - due to any reason whatsoever - after the 8 year warranty period, what then? If that case were to arise, I don't see how I can pay ridiculous sums for a 10 year old vehicle! And if not, what is the alternative?

This therefore according to me should be an important concern for any EV buyer who intends to keep their vehicle for a long time for which a reasonable solution needs to be available. And if there's anyone who wishes to alleviate my worry in this area with any possible argument or offer a solution for the above concern, kindly do so - for you just might nudge me right onto the EV bandwagon!

Cheers.

[rrsteer]

Voted Other.

I will not buy my primary car as as an EV for the foreseeable future because of the uncertainties associated with doing/completing intercity road trips in India.

Today I did an intercity round trip of about 420 kms. Some of the EVs currently sold in the market like the Hyundai Ionic should be able to do such a trip in a single charge. Majority can do the trip with a planned charging stop. But how do you plan for unexpected congestions, road diversions, and unruly traffic? We ultimately ended up covering the 420 odd kms in more than 10 hrs. At one place we were literally crawling up-hill on an inclined road for couple of hours and covered no more than 15-20 kms. If that was not enough, met with a massive traffic jam in Chandigarh of all places, because the authorities had at one junction, stopped the flow of traffic in one direction. Then on the highway there were frequent police checkpoints that disrupted the free-flow of traffic, and unruly traffic made matters worse. Its not like this every time, but like today, it can and does happen frequently enough for me to not be comfortable doing it in an EV.

Having said that, I do feel EVs are superb for city specific journeys and in this respect just obliterate any other type of car. We have had a Toyota Etios for the last decade or so just for city use. It didn't have a fast-tag as it never crossed city limits. We recently replaced it with a Tiago EV. I don't think highly of Tata cars, even so I am kicking myself for not having replaced the Etios with the Tiago EV an year ago, when I was presented with the opportunity earlier.

[SKC-auto]

Great thread, we should do this every year, also link to older threads, will show by 2030 how people's opinion and EV tech has changed.

No product can satisfy 100% population, definitely EVs are not for people who drive 1000kms non stop, and genuine concerns about present day infra, as we see costs of EVs falling down.

Keeping those sentiments aside, most comments turned outright negative as expected.

For those asking for 1000km EV is like asking a smartphone in 1990, 5G speeds in 2000, Intel i7 latest gen processor in 2005, Petrol Hybrid in 1980. Product development or building infra does not happen in a day. Many would have learnt about "Continuous improvement" in their corporate jobs.

Should Apple, Airtel, Intel or Toyota wait for that perfect product?(oh..Toyota is waiting for that perfect EV, but also sells bz4x).

To the people who say EVs pollute more than Pollution cars(ICE cars).

""Physics is the law, everything else is a recommendation. Anyone can break laws created by people, but I have yet to see anyone break the laws of physics." - Elon Musk

This thread is just a recommendation for ICE cars. Physics clearly says why EVs are better, listen to what people who know science are saying regarding EV vs ICE cars.

Some haters saying this is 100 year old tech? really? does LFP or NMC batteries existed 100 years ago?

Watch this video about EVs in Norway. EV drivers say 'Never again'.

https://youtu.be/R5DbRyeZNRk?si=yL6sDw2KwRiMJHgd

[Redex]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

I need vehicles that can do interstate trips with only fuel breaks at the maximum possible speed the roads would allow, so even with a diesel returning hardly 9-10 kmpl, I have a decent range with ~ 60L tank on all our vehicles.

Hi,

Just curious, which diesel are you driving? Only 9 or 10km/l at highway speeds. My 20 year old Focus Estate 1.8TDI returns at least 21km/l at highway speeds. Averaged over 880 kms per week commuting to work 80% highways.

[rajshenoy]

Who would have thought that EV evolution will be so fast paced!! Couple of years ago, I would have checked most of the items in the poll but now only few points remain open for me - 2,3 and 4.

At its current stage, EV can be a perfect city runaround for me but the range won’t be sufficient for my highway drives (also speeds above 100 kmph or on winding and steep western ghats).

My concern is also on charging infrastructure on the highway as I am yet to see fast chargers in my regular food stops.

[ajitmoses]

Voted for ‘Tech is fast developing’

Barring Tesla, Most manufacturers are still not near the maturity levels that gives me the confidence. At least based on the cars that are available in India.

I am reminded of when my parents bought me my first IBM PC in 1996. It had no hard disk and it only ran from a 5 inch floppy drive. Within the first year, it became obsolete.

Then we also saw how the mobile phones evolved. But then we came to a point where the maturity peaked and then the improvements were more evolutionary. A 5 year old iphone is still very much usable and relevant.

I know that EVs will probably mature faster than mobiles and computers but I still feel that for most people, making the transition to EV will only happen when EVs start to outsell their ICE counterparts.

[GeeTee TSI]

We don't really require labelling of contrary views as haters, such hate is uncalled for. If range and recharge times are anxieties (even if misguided to convinced EV owners) those anxieties will remain till the last ICE driver feels convinced.

I wish proponents of change respect these.

[sgmuser]

How about an option on availablity of reliable EV models in a decent budget. What we have is Tatas, Mahindras, MG and Citroen which are not worth considering for people like me who puts peace of mind above everything else in their ownership experience. We need something like Toyota (ICE equivalent) and Tesla level of ownership experience below 20 lakhs category. Even a Kia or Hyundai in this range will do a world of good to the first time car buyers who wants a 4 wheeler but do not prefer these brands. They need more options and painless ownership experience. Third gen atleast should be of more reliable for Tatas while Mahindra's should move from drawing board soon and deliver. MG should use whatever brain they have to bring products which are roadworthy for Indian conditions and priced sensible and not act like premium. Hyundai/Kia brothers should have similar portfolio like Tata where they give options for people to choose - a petrol or diesel or hybrid or an ev. They are usually very good in giving options and that's what their strength. I20 ev and creta ev will be a game changer and will convert their existing crazy numbers to ev for example. IMHO.

Btw, I am not sure what to talk about Toyota. Such a pathetic strategy but still making some serious profits and they will be happy. They won't go any further as two hybrids makes good money already along with Innova and Fortuner. Why to unnecessarily complicate. I don't expect any kind of new ev onslaught or low to mid range ev introductions even if they have in their international portfolio.

[OpenRoads]

Originally Posted by Hayek

Range
This is a complete red herring except for the tiny number of BHPians who regularly drive more than 400-500 km at a stretch. Journeys up to 200 km can be done comfortably without recharging in any EV. For 400-500 km journeys, you need one recharge, which is easy enough to find on highways out of all major metros. And most people would take 6-7 hours for such journeys, and take at least one 30-40 minute halt in such a stretch - you need may be 15 minutes extra to recharge .

To reason with this point the very first thing we should consider is how many of Indians can afford to buy a car. It's ~9% at present. Out of this whole lot it's a fraction of percentage who can afford more than one car.

1. Now for the vast majority of owners who can afford only one car it is not just city usage which would be on the cards. They would want to buy something which can be driven without any hassle whenever needed. And when this situation arrives the idea of taking a 30 mins break every 150~200km to charge the car vs probability finding an actual working empty recharging station to plug in the car is very bleek. Current infrastructure (recharging station) is not adequate enough to provide that hassle free environment.

2. Of all these households who can afford only one car how many of them do you think owns a personal garage with charging facility. What about the majority who live in flats and park in the open. What will they do?

Any solution should consider problems faced by the masses. And EV and related infra to this day do not bring those answers. That's why in my opinion the concept of EV in Indian scenario is questionable or unreasonable to be precise.

[Ph03nix]

When an EV gives a real world range of 500 KM and is priced under 20lacs for a compact SUV, I will take the plunge.

This way I do not have to worry about charging for one day trips, and I generally take a break after 500 kms when touring.

[ASP007]

Battery tech and charging infra are the major downers for me. I tend to keep the cars for 5-7 years, so that's also a concern with the current battery warranty offered. It'd be difficult to get a decent value for an EV which is almost near to it's battery warranty. I'll wait for a few more years before jumping the EV wagon in India. Until then it's only ICE cars for me.

[camaroon]

We probably need another thread to collate points on when EV's make sense Following article on EV battery recycling https://economictimes.indiatimes.com.../107921327.cms